Am I eligible if I rent a place while keeping my house?

[Fiona2011231]

May I ask this question?

My child is in year 1 and we still hope he can get into a better school.

Does it make any difference if we now rent a place next to our preferred school while we still keep our current house.

In this scenario, will the council consider that we are near the preferred school and thus would become eligible if the school has a place?

Thank you

Depends on the rules of your council.

Our local council says the house you own is the real residence, others will consider where the child actually lives by checking gp records, etc.

Are you planning to move permanently and sell the house or just until you get a place and then move back to the house.

If it's the second then not only will you not be considered nearer the school, but they will consider that you have attempted to make a fraudulent application.

Thank you.

In that case, can I still keep renting for about a year before moving back to my house?

It's not very ethical.

But I empathise as our local schooling situation is desperate. Faith schools who won't have us or failing schools in special measures (and likely to be closed in a year or two anyway)

Given that many people keep the house they own when moving to a new area/rent until they decide to buy in a new place I think it would be difficult to prove that you moved solely for the school place. Especially if you were there for a year or more.

From previous threads, if you and your family actually move to the rented place, and either sell or rent your current home, that may bump you up the list. You're going to have to pay rent and bills there, including council tax. If you simply rent eg a studio or one bed flat and don't live in it, it will be treated as a fraudulent application.

I don't think the OP wants to sell her home though. She wants us to help her make a fraudulent application in a way that she can't get found out.

You really need to PROPERLY move to the rented place that's in catchment. Someone in our area tried to pull a fast one last year with a one bedroom flat that the husband was actually using purely as an office, even though he had his post redirected there etc and was paying bills and so on. They were caught out all the same. (Outstanding Ofsted Academy, top 10% nationally GCSEs and ALevels, very understandable as 'real' catchment school was at the time in Special measures...)

You will be found out. Surprisingly, you're not the first to come up with this brilliant wheeze. They've seen it all before.

You are planning to rent a place to get your child into a school. That will deprive someone who actually properly lives in the area. Morally wrong.

If this is an in-year application it would also depend on the other people on the waiting list. If there is anyone who is or has been a looked-after child, or has siblings in the school, they will take priority. Unplaced children newly moving to the whole area also take priority. So it's a bit of a high-risk plan, as well as unethical.

Is the school you are in really so dreadful that you need to move?

TBH unless a child is desperately unhappy, primary schools are much of a muchness.

Regardless of anything else, if your child is in year one it's perfectly possible that no spaces will come free in your preferred school for years. Depends on the area. So even being no. 1 on the waiting list may do nothing.

But yes, if they catch you you will be bumped down the list as it's not your genuine home. If you actually live there, it depends how thorough your area are in checking, but the same could happen.

It could even happen after your child is at the school. Think of your poor child. Settling in, making friends, then kicked out

That is cheating and immoral. But I expect you're not bothered about that. I hope you're found out.

If we say something is morally wrong and then stop, then I suppose the whole country should protest until those celebrities who evade tax are kicked out of the country or prosecuted. In reality, one would say those celebrities, including people like Gary Barlow, can do such things as long as they are legal.

I think it is fair to debate in a public place about the legal limit to what one can do.

Yeah, well the legal aspect is that, if caught, your child will be kicked out of the school.

And none of it will do anything unless you get to no.1 on the waiting list at the same ttime a place comes up.

So a pretty high risk plan all round, morality aside.

Fiona this isn't the way. It's admirable that you want to do your best for your child, but there are better (legal) ways.

The outcomes of a primary education depend on the child's own natural ability, the support of the child's family and the school - in that order. You can't do anything about #1 but you can do an awful lot about #2 and any efforts you put in to supporting your child's education at home will have a far greater impact than putting your energy into defrauding the system to get a place in a different school.

Children with engaged and supportive parents will thrive and learn loads even in a struggling special-measures or barely-satisfactory school. Children without engaged and supportive parents will often do badly even in an outstanding school. Your child spends only about 30 hours a week in school. There's an awful lot of other hours out of school - if those hours are filled with reading, counting, investigating and thinking, that is way more valuable than a move of school.

Moving schools, on the other hand, is definitely something that has the potential to damage long-term outcomes - obviously many people have no choice, but it's not something to seek out if unnecessary.

You weren't debating it though were you. You just wanted to know how to get away with it.

If you rent whilst keeping your current house the council is likely to ignore your rented address and user the property you own. If they do use the rented address, you get a place on that basis and subsequently move back to your house they are entitled to take your child's place away even after your child has started at your preferred school. This can happen even after your child has been at the school for several terms. If your child does get kicked out there is no guarantee you would get a place at your child's current school. You could end up with a place at an unpopular school that is miles from home.

If you move permanently to an address nearer your preferred school you may move up the waiting list but that doesn't guarantee you will get a place. It may be that no places become available or that others move even closer to the school than you.

I think it would be difficult to prove that you moved solely for the school place

The council don't have to prove anything. If they reasonably believe the OP moved into rented property to get a place they are entitled to treat the application as fraudulent.

Fiona, you are doing an in year application- if the school has 30 in each class, you are unlikely to get a place. If they don't have 30 in each class, you may be able to appeal for a place.

Thank you for all your replies.

Is it reasonable to assume that the only way is to sell your home first and then to rent another place next to your preferred school?

I don't think you'd have to sell your house, but letting it on a longer lease (they'll want to see the rental contract) would probably be a good idea.

@ OldLadyKnowsSomething: Thank you. Do you think they would want to know the reason why I let it on a longer lease? Or a rental contract would be enough?

The rental contract should be enough, but I'm not a legal bod, so don't be paying too much mind to me! The thing is, the school wants to see that you and your family are going to be part of the local community. From my perspective as a granny, I see the value in dc having schoolfriends who live nearby, rather than this odd playdate/shuttle dc halfway across a city to see pals culture that seems to have arisen of late.

The LEA may decide that you have leased your home and rented another just to cheat the system ... Suspicious lot that they are!

"I don't think you'd have to sell your house, but letting it on a longer lease (they'll want to see the rental contract) would probably be a good idea."

That depends on the distances involved. If you move fom City A to City B (70 miles apart) and rent because you cannot sell previous home, everyone would accept the move was genuine.

If you've gone 1 mile or so and near to a desirable school, then expect it to be treated as fraudulent unless the previous address is definitively disposed of. Most councils are very alert to this kind of thing, and yes, they really do remove places even from children who have started at their new school (alerted by other parents, or noticing the move back to the identical previous address from other records).

You could move there and then still have to wait ages for a place until someone leaves or they start yr 3 and then you might have more chance on appeal. There might also be children with siblings ahead of him on the waiting list who might get priority over you.

You might then need to move again to secure a secondary school place. It sounds silly thinking about it now but those years go very quickly and if you have the money to consider owning and renting then I would suggest researching secondary schools now and make one proper move close to a good one.

What is so bad about the current school? Have you tried going on lots of different waiting lists not just for your preferred school?