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my second levels q today I am not obsessed honest!

22 replies

expectingno2 · 08/07/2014 21:09

Reception levels. Do they link at all to the nc level (quick google search says not?) Also is average getting expected across the board and how unusual is exceeding across the board.

Thanks

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reup · 08/07/2014 21:14

I asked a friend that today, she had 4 in her class

reup · 08/07/2014 21:15

Its a mostly v rich area- outstanding primary

Iamnotminterested · 08/07/2014 21:38

4 what, reup? Exceedings?

LittleMissGreen · 08/07/2014 21:41

From people's posts last year, the number of exceedings depends on how the school awards them. Some schools seemed to award if the child was working at a year 1 level, others wanted the child at a year 2 level.
Therefore there doesn't seem to be straight comparison at reception level between schools, or against national curriculum levels either.

reup · 08/07/2014 21:41

4 kids that got exceeding for all areas.

reup · 08/07/2014 21:43

Her school recently got moderated by thee borough to ensure standardisation.

3bunnies · 08/07/2014 21:54

Goggled this last week. Found this which says that EYFS doesn't map onto NC levels but that it currently roughly seems that 1c comes after EYFS level 6, with 7&8 being expansion levels in EYFS to account for children within EYFS who are exceeding the expectations at that stage. Haven't a clue what it all means though except ds seems to be doing well.

nonicknameseemsavailable · 08/07/2014 21:58

it does depend greatly on the school, last year a lot of schools were VERY harsh and made it a 2c equaled exceeding. my eldest got 16 out of 17 exceedings (not IT because the school don't do much IT in reception so the teacher told me that was the only reason for just getting expected).

It doesn't seem standard as far as I know.

expectingno2 · 08/07/2014 22:02

All seems very complex. The report was nicely written and personal in fairness I just dont know how to guage the levels. Sounds like that is normal though!

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reup · 08/07/2014 22:12

Al

reup · 08/07/2014 22:13

I meant. Also next year there won't be levels (except at end of key stages) so even if you knew what the level was it wouldn't help!

nonicknameseemsavailable · 08/07/2014 22:18

I think as long as it tells you whether they are doing what is expected or are above or below that then that is fine at this age. I would actually be happy with that for every year to be honest, it flags up clearly if there is a problem, it also shows clearly if a child is doing very well, what it doesn't do is indicate if they are at either extreme end of the range really or give you any indication of what they can actually do.

I have been really surprised to see on other threads that there are levels awarded for history, music etc too. I had no idea it all went that far. I was just thinking reading, writing, maths and that the other subjects at primary level were more on effort and interest if that makes sense. I mean history at primary is surely more about exposure to different periods of history and learning to find it all fascinating not expecting them to learn all the kings and queens and dates they ruled and for science they should just be focusing on recognising what an amazingly huge subject science is etc.

mrz · 09/07/2014 06:59

There is no correlation although some schools/LEA use them to predict future achievement. PSED has been shown to be the strongest indicator (but not until GCSEs)

overmydeadbody · 09/07/2014 07:03

Really? You don't know how to gauge the levels?

Surely the words give it away?

'Emerging' = the kid is getting to where the government want them to be

'Expected'= means the kid is where they should be

'Exceeding' = means the kid is advanced beyond where the government expect them to be.

It really is that simple. Stop over analysing it.

3bunnies · 09/07/2014 07:31

We get marks for all sort of things - e.g. French dd1 was assessed as average by a teacher who clearly had very little knowledge of French herself - dd1 may well be average but this teacher was making basic pronounciation mistakes and trying to teach them from a dictionary. I felt sorry for her being asked to teach a language she didn't know and the school has now changed their approach to teaching French. As long as the child is average or above and putting in average or above effort then the finner details may well change.

Particularly in reception it is a hare and tortoise situation. Dd1 struggled to read and decode until yr 2, all her peers steamed ahead. Something just clicked and in yr 4 she is now 4a which is average for yr 6. Ds is just entering reception and on purple reading levels but his peers could easily equal or overtake him by year 4 if their understanding of characters and plots is more sophisticated than his, it's one thing being able to decode and understand a basic plot line but another being able to explain the nuances of a more complex book.

expectingno2 · 09/07/2014 08:11

No need for that overmydeadbody. Just because the assessment is "where they should be" I would still like to know what that actually means so I can decide if I am happy with that knowing my child or if exceeded warrants a watchful eye on differentiating work next year for example.

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overmydeadbody · 09/07/2014 08:45

But it makes sense surely?

If they are where they should be then that is where they are, where they should be.

If they are exceeding they are above where they should be.

I just don't get why there is so much over analysis of this stuff on MN. Leave teachers to do their jobs. It doesn't even matter what level your child is at. As long as they are happy and enjoy learning and feel loved and supported at home. That's all that matters.

overmydeadbody · 09/07/2014 08:46

Anyway, you came on here asking for clarification, saying you couldn't gauge what it all meant.

I offered a simple explanation to try to help you put it all into perspective and 'gauge' what it all meant.

overmydeadbody · 09/07/2014 08:47

You said it all seems complex and you don't know how to gauge the levels. I gave you a simple explanation.

expectingno2 · 09/07/2014 09:27

No it does not make sense to lots of people. My q was what does expected actually mean in real life. It is not a phrase that is universally understood.but bever mind I am not losing sleep over it.

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diamondage · 09/07/2014 10:32

overmydeadbody your argument that it's all simple only applies if it is actually simple. As has been mentioned up thread it can be far from simple with some schools assessing children as being exceeding when they hit 1b, while others insist on a child being well into level 2. This represents a significant difference.

Whilst the individual school may know what their exceedings mean for them I remember threads from last year where there were differences between reception classes in the same school, and it wasn't just parents reporting this.

expecting, it is true that expected doesn't fit exactly with NC levels or rather the year 1 requirements of the new national curriculum, however with exceeding then there is more of a match. The reason for this is that if a child is exceeding the EYFS then they should already be being differentiated work in line with the national curriculum. The issue is that EYFS doesn't cover all of the areas of the NC so some areas might not get covered in a reception class.

Nevertheless if a child is exceeding then they are likely to be at least meeting some and perhaps most of the year 1 new national curriculum requirements, depending entirely on their abilities. A gifted reception child may be working well into year 2 in some or many areas, but the school can still only report this as exceeding.

If you really want to understand what your child's report means you have a couple of options.

Firstly you can ask your child's teacher if they are prepared to provide your with more information. The nature of this information will depend on how they intend reporting progress from September when the new national curriculum comes into force and levels no longer have to be used.

Some schools may not be prepared to answer this question yet (others already have the information on their websites). If you are referring to your own child receiving a report with all exceedings then I would have thought the teacher might be amenable to such a conversation because as part of the process of assessing a child as exceeding the EYFS teacher should have spoken to the year 1 teacher and receiving exceedings across the board is quite unusual (more on that later).

Your second option is to work it out for yourself by downloading the new national curriculum information and matching up from the detailed text what your child has been assessed as already achieving. Check both year 1 and year 2.

Regarding what is average, it works like this - there are 17 early learning goals 1 point is awarded for emerging, 2 points for expected, 3 points for exceeding.

The average point score is 32.8. Achieving expected in all areas has a point score of 34. Achieving exceeding across the board has a point score of 51.

About 1% of children nationally achieve a point score of 51, although how accurate that is if different schools or Local Authorities are using different criteria to determine exceeding is debatable. I think roughly 5% achieve a point score of 45 or above. If you think that over 40% of children nationally achieve level 5 and above at KS2, it's only when you get to level 6 that you get a similar %s.

I'm not saying that a child achieving a point score of 51 on the EYFS will go on to achieve a level 6, I am saying that nationally it's as hard for a child of 4/5 to achieve a point score of 51 as it is for a year 6 child to achieve a level 6.

If you'd like to understand this more, and also understand what a what a Good Level of Development is then please read here. It's very interesting that only 52% of children nationally achieved a Good Level of Development in 2013 - I think it shows just how much higher the bar was raised in the EYFS.

Hope that helps and apologies that this has turned into such a mammoth post!

expectingno2 · 09/07/2014 18:56

Thank you diamondage that is really helpful.

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