Want: Central / North London 7+ Entry, not highly selective, excellent teaching! Impossible?

[HippyMum23]

Opinions please:

Relocating to London and thinking about 7+ choices for my DS who has been described as 'very bright' by teacher but is having a slow start due to past health problems and a very bad Nursery school. He is a somewhat above average in his class academically at the pre-prep dept of a lesser-known public school (good maths and reading, weaker in story writing, near bottom of class in handwriting) bags of enthusiasm but very opinionated and not good at concentrating, socially immature, needs a bit of hand-holding emotionally and to maintain concentration.

Preference is for a good London day he can enter at 7+ and go through to 18. Seems very hard to find so also considering a Prep school then for Senior a London day or boarding school within good reach of London by train. No preference for Co-ed vs boys, want good pastoral care.

I've looked at quite a lot of schools and the only ones which seemed to have a very good standard of teaching & nice philosophy & atmosphere are those which are far, far too academic to consider eg. St Pauls. All of the less selective ones just seem to have poor teaching / uninspiring teachers and atmosphere. I know my son is not the brightest of the bright, but I still think he deserves a school which can get the best out of him and it feels like good schools in London don't exist unless the DC is Westminster / St Pauls / future Oxbridge material.

Suggestions for any with good teaching but less selective entry?

Highgate looked very good, but soooo oversubscribed and I think the chances of him being up to it academically are slim :-( (they told me they are looking for National Curriculum level 3 for entry at 7+).

UCS seemed good, but I worry that it is so oversubscribed, and that they told me they look to see National Curriculum level 2a in all subjects for 7+, and I just don't think DC will manage that in English. Plus I've heard it is best for self-motivators :-(

The Hall: far too academic.

Arnold House: ditto, plus I'm not rich enough ;-)

Wetherby (Marylebone): also seemed good, but strongly suspect the entry criteria will be level 3b / far too high?? I have not yet enquired, anyone know?

Thomas's: Seems very good but would be a bit awkward location-wise. Not sure how selective entrance is?

Would love opinions on: Hill House International, Knightsbridge, Eaton Square, Hereward House, Trevor Roberts.

I have been unimpressed with:

-Mill Hill Foundation Grimsdell & Senior (terrible atmosphere and lots of teachers who seemed very old fashioned and uninspiring).

-Abercorn (totally put off by the website, I know that may seem a bit shallow but I think everything has to feel right from the start).

-North Bridge House (a lot of things seemed wrong with it!) Lyndhurst House (so many exit to Mill Hill).

• Portland Place for Senior (generally a bit lack-lustre and not sure if there is much value-added??).

-City for Senior (seemed very uptight).

All opinions good or bad welcome!
Thank you!

I agree that a] - a state primary might solve all OP's problems b] if not the Academy is what she's looking for

@ Almapudden:
I would be so happy it Wetherby was suitable, especially as they are opening up the senior school! I have been in contact with them to ask what sort of National a Curriculum level they are looking for at 7+ and are waiting for an answer. If it turns out that the level they're looking for might be achievable then I think it will be at the top of my list. Fingers crossed!

Do you have experience of the school? Any idea about:
Class sizes
How caring the teachers are?
Provision for sports
Negative points?

Thank you so much!

Have you considered Bedford School? It has a mix of borders and day boys, and while it is selective it isn't massively so IYSWIM. Bedford is ~40 mins by train from St Pancras.

Class sizes are between 16 and 20 but there's always a TA on hand in Y3 and 4.

Excellent teaching staff, incredibly committed - for a school which has grown so rapidly, it's maintained a really friendly, family environment and the staff know the boys really we'll.

The school has just acquired its own sports ground, although it is a short bus ride away. Break times on non-games days are held at Hyde Park.

The only negative would be the lack of on-site outside space but the school makes up for it pretty well.

Would you consider a Montessori school eg Rainbow or The Gower School? Rainbow only goes up to 12 years but their leavers destinations are good.

Friends sent their three to King Alfred's and were very happy with it. I've only read about it but it seemed a bit too relaxed for what we are looking for.

I agree with Princesselsaanna on Hendon Prep..

The three families I know at Hendon Prep are Asian, Jewish English and Eastern European by ethnicity so I really don't think it's predominantly Jewish at all.

@ Frogs, Almapudden, Pyrrah:

State / Private debate:

I don't mind at all that Frogs suggested state sector, all suggestions welcome, however state is not something I have really considered for a variety of reasons:

• I could not aim for state schools which work on catchment areas as I probably couldn't afford to live in catchment areas for most of the good ones (in London), therefore I would be looking at schools which selected academically anyway.
• I much prefer small class sizes. Current school for this year was 11 /12 with 3 TA's floating between two classes.
• I am not familiar with the state sector and don't really understand how it works, so I suppose it doesn't seem like a natural choice for me, though perhaps I should be more open to considering it.
• If there was a very obvious amazing state school then I would consider it. If I had a very, very bright boy I would certainly apply for QE Boys for example, but I don't know of any equivalents for less bright DC's, plus I still worry a bit about things mentioned below.
• I think state run services such as the NHS and the education system are a fundamental human right and I am so, so glad they exist and am happy to pay taxes to fund them etc, however I do feel that the lack of competition for business within the system (eg. The vast majority of people can only use the NHS or can only choose 1-3 local state schools) means that there is less impetus for services to improve for fear of losing custom - private businesses don't survive if they continually offer a poor service, but state run ones can and do IMHO. I do worry that the state education sector may be as badly run as the National Health Service IMHO, and IF that is the case then I would rather not use it (and I'm so lucky I have the choice!). Obviously I am not sure if this is the case, but it does concern me.
• Going private (whether it be healthcare or education) offers a choice in ways that using the state service does not - if you don't like the school you can leave without having to worry about moving to a new catchment area. If the school governors decide the National Curriculum is not adequate then they don't have to follow it. If you request a specific service at a private school they often have the budget to provide it and there is not too much red tape. Hopefully you get what I mean, I'm not very good at explaining.
• When it comes to pupil demographics / 'class issues' (which I think people are often too scared to talk about) I don't really see too many issues with going state - I imagine that most (obviously not all!!) good state schools are in reasonably middle class areas. Most of the state schools in eg. Hampstead or Chelsea / Fulham are probably more 'posh' than my DC's public school! I think if I did find a state school which was exceptionally good yet in a very rough area then tbh I would feel put off because I would worry about my DC's social experiences being limited and feeling as though we did not fit in (just as I would also worry about not fitting in at a very Hampstead 'Gucci handbags & Chelsea tractors' sort of school).

I really hope I have not offended anyone, it was not my intention.

-Regarding the above, I should point out that from ages 1-4 DC and myself & partner lived next to a large Zone 1 Railway terminus on the outskirts of a 'sink estate'. DC went to 2 playgroups (one was also the council run nursery) on said estate until age 2 1/2, at which point we found an expensive (unfortunately turned out to be terrible - ah, hindsight!) chain Nursery a bit further afield. Then we moved out of London to the rural area we are now in to send DC to the current Pre-Prep dept of a public school.

@Pyrrah:
You are so lucky to get that standard of education without having to pay for it!

Do you mind me asking what suburb that school is in? Or could you be as specific as you are comfortable with about which school it is? PM me if you like.

We are not too sure where we are relocating to, so 'local area' is a tricky one! Essentially it will be as far in towards London as I can afford to live in an OK area, and on the north side. If money no object then Belsize Park, but that's not very realistic!

@ FoodFairy:
It is so hard! I know my DC is bright but can be lazy and I worry too that in a class of 30 he would be overlooked. Plus also I can't play the catchment area game!

How are you getting on with finding somewhere? Will you move your DD to the same school too or keep here where she is?

I totally agree- seems there is a massive gap in the market in London. Maybe you should relocate out of London like so many others do ;-)

@ Princesselsaana:

Interesting to hear that about Hendon, I will take a look!

MILL HILL:

Also interested to hear you were impressed with Mill Hill. Personally I thought the Senior school came across better than Grimsdell. Did you find the teachers all perfectly OK in regard to what I said about not finding them inspiring and thinking them a bit dreary or dull? Did you go to a recent open day?

As a point of comparison, DC's current school comes slightly above Mill Hill in most league tables for A Level / Bacc and quite far above for GCSE, yet Mill Hill is quite selective at all ages, whereas DC's current school is unselective until 6th form. So I feel as though Mill Hill achieves only because of weeding out the weaker ones. Having said that, Mill Hill get more to Oxbridge and Sutton Trust 13 than our current school, despite getting worse results.

@ Saganoren:

Exciting that so many people are raving about The Academy!

I will try to be more open minded about state.

Thank you!

@ OublietteBravo:

That's an interesting one! I think TBH I prefer the idea of 40 mins travelling within London compared to getting to St Pancras then doing a 40 min journey. I know that might seem a bit odd!

Thanks for the suggestion though, it's worth bearing in mind if my ideas change.

Should also say that they have lots of flexible boarding options - you can board FT, weekly or e.g. one or two nights per week. We live locally, but DS would love to be allowed to board. (The Thameslink line also goes to Bedford, so St Pancras isn't the only option when travelling from London).

Totally understand you wanting something on London though.

@ AlmaPuden:

You do make Wetherby sound nice! I assume from what you say about the nurturing approach that they take just as much time and care over boys who are not Eton material? Any idea how much time they spend doing sports / outdoor stuff? Have you ever heard of a pupil who was under performing being asked to leave (I assume this won't be an issue, but nice to know about the ethos). Class sizes of 16-20 aren't great but not too bad either. Current school is 16 max I think. Any idea if it is the kind if school which encourages competition between the boys? Or is it more of a competing against yourself type of ethos?

Thank you!

@ CrankyPants:

I probably wouldn't consider a very Montessori-ish school, nor King Alfred's. I think both are a bit laid back too, and there's something about Montessori that's always made me doubt the approach for older children, though actually I nearly chose a Montessori nursery. I think it works well for the very young but sceptical about the older ones. Plus my DC in particular seems to learn best in a very structured environment rather than with lots of 'free play'. Though they have a lot of fun too!

Thanks for suggestions.

@ LePetitPrince:

Thanks for the info, I'm going to read about Hendon.

@ OublietteBravo:

Sounds similar to where DC is now! I think TBH if we were happy with the 40mins to London thing then we'd stay with the current school and do flexi boarding a few nights a week, but I know what a pain commuter trains are! It's always reassuring when kids want to board - you know they must really love it at the school :-)

To all who recommended The Academy, thank you, having looked at the website and read MN it is now on my list of schools to visit! It clearly caters for all abilities yet gets great exit results so is certainly worth looking at.

I can't believe how small it is! Only ~70 pupils! It is so massively different from the prep at DC's current school, which has full use of all of the senior school facilities set in several hundred acres (school well known for amazing facilities), that I think I may have trouble convincing my partner of the merits, but I attended a very small village prep as did he, so perhaps he will like it. I'm excited about visiting now!

Let me know what you think when you go Hippy . Any questions give me a shout.

Hippymum, absolutely, all boys are supported to achieve their potential even if not super academic. Recent leavers' destinations include Bradfield, St Edward's, Bryanston, Stowe, Portland Place etc, as well as more traditionally academic schools.

The school has fantastic art and music departments, by the way, if your son's interested in creative subjects.

All boys have one lesson of PE and two full afternoons of Games per week. On non-games days they go to Hyde Park to play outside. Friday afternoons from 2.15-4 are given over to clubs, which range from horse riding to cookery to rock climbing to the school newspaper. Really wide selection!

No one has been asked to leave (or expelled, for that matter) in the time that I've known the school. :)

@ Sleepwhenidie:

I'll not be visiting The Academy / others until September, but I'll post here again to let you all know how it goes.
Thanks!

@Almapudden:
I really hope they get back to me soon about expected level for the 7+! I've asked twice now. I'm definitely going to visit in September, unless I hear that entry is absurdly selective.

I hear lots of stories of people choosing it as an alternative to Westminster, which worries me, but maybe that is just due to location?

We are probably more interested in music and sports than art, but the sport provision sounds especially good from what you've said for a school which is located in the middle of Marylebone!

Hope I hear from them soon!