Been offered brand new free school or last choice

[Lazymama2]

We're not sure what to do as have been offered a place at a brand new school which is with walking distance but has not been 'fitted out' yet (buildings are there). There is very little concrete info on term dates, start and finish times, curriculum and obviously no past performance on which to base a decision. Also no older kids to look up to. Other school is our last choice and has improved from satisfactory to good. DH does not want Dd to go to this school and would prefer private. I, on the other hand, quite like idea of a brand new school.

Thoughts/ideas anyone?

PS please dont turn this into a debate of state vs. private as I believe every parent does what is best for thier child/family circumstances and im not for/against one or the other.

Nlondondad - the Wolverhampton school is a totally situation because it's a Sikh school in an area without enough Sikhs to fill it.

I don't think it's comparable to Whitehall Park.

@buckskid

What is comparable is the shortage of applicants, what, I agree, is (probably) very different is the reason for the shortage. Shortage of Sikhs in one case, shortage of children in general in the other.

I was interested that this school was shut down for lack of enough applicants in its second year. Assuming Whitehall park gets going this year with the same sort of handful of children as this school had, what happens next year when it becomes apparent that there will be no new building for the children ready only what, one must presume, will be really crowded temporary accomodation.

Can anyone update on what is happening with whitehall pk? It's not relevant for us for this Sept but soon will be. I saw portacabins in the back but the old school building still standing abandoned. The schools own website is so slick and generic it doesn't tell me much.
we just fall inside Haringey but are basically on the dividing line so we are out of catchment for ALL other state primaries. is WP the only choice likely to be offered to us in future then as it's now our nearest and will presumably have a massive catchment as it needs kids.
We can't really afford to move and don't want to but are starting to think about if we could do it to avoid the DC starting at a completely unknown quantity school in portacabin which could fold at any time for the reasons discussed upthread. Am interested in worst case while try to balance against possible move. How likely is it that the school will go ahead as planned over say next 5 years? What actually happens if a free school closes what alternative offer would the kids get?

All schools are unknown quantities.

School is a diff experience for each child who goes there. There is no school which is perfect for every child.

As the say in finance 'past performance is no indication of future performance'

Not sure I agree about the past performance thing, endof prior performance can be quite predictive IME in various areas of life.
Anyone got any other thoughts on this?

I wonder why the previously enthusiatic supportes of Whitehall Park School are, it seems, not to be heard from. Could it be that a matter of days before the school is due to open all is not well? A bit low on pupil numbers perhaps?

LocalMummyperson feel free to PM me if you are genuinely interested in more information.

Out of interest, does anyone know how many children will be starting at Whitehall Park this week? Will it be 56 or anywhere near?

@playfortoday

The last I heard it was around 50

How long ago was that......

No matter how many or how few in numbers they are, the reality is, some very real little four year old children will be starting their very first day of school tomorrow, no small feat for them or the parents that got them this far; so let's please put the knives away - it feels instinctively wrong, odd and not a little creepy.

I agree its all about children:

So what about the children in Islington Schools, which because this school has been set up, have lost 3 million off the repair budget?

So what about the children, who because Islington have not been allowed to use this site for social housing will remain at best seriously overcrowded, at worst in bed and breakfast accomodation?

There is a real issue here, and I regard it as a great disgrace that the children attending WPS, should have been made pawns in a game of politics against Islington Council mounted by Mr Gove and the Swiss based commercial interests of Bellevue Ltd.

But, whatever, there is omething odd here. I passed by WPS today and other than a large banner on the railings on Hornsey lane announcing that this was the site of a new school opening in autumn 2014 - the banner is new - there was no sign of any activity. Is the school term for WPS starting late?

Foxmon I do agree that there is an unfortunate level of 'personal' hostility upthread and really hope that we can stay away from that from now on here, while I get it that we won't all agree on the issues. Saying that though, if we shouldn't discuss complex issues because real kids are involved then the whole of MN had better find something else to do with its time.

I want information about my local school which I haven't been able to find on their website. While recognising that there are other bigger problems in the world it's stressful not knowing if my local school is any good, what it is going to be offering or even whether it will exist for the duration of my kids' education.

I think a lot of the confusion about this school could be solved by its website being more specific about its plans but because it isn't, that feeds into my concerns that because it is run by a commercial organisation it's not going to want to be that open about things. I'm really trying to keep an open mind but the lack of info doesn't help.

@Localmummyperson

Yes, Whitehall Park is going ahead despite all of the controversy, and there is every reason to think that it will be there for your DC next year. If you're genuinely concerned, why not ask for a meeting with the Head to learn something about the school to help you make your decision? Given this year's experience, you're right that you are unlikely to get a place at another local school, but fortunately Whitehall Park seems to be coming together well.

@nlondondad

Whitehall Park School has its first day of school tomorrow. The opening party was on Friday. I don't know the exact number, but there are approximately 50 kids among the two reception classes.

Can I just point out that "this years experience" would have been, given that Localmummyperson lives due North of the old Ashmount site that, by now she would have had an offer of a place at both St Mary's Hornsey and Highgate Primary School? And possibly, depending exactly where she is, Coleridge? But that actually she is interested in the situation in two years time, and that what happens then is driven mainly by pupil demand in Crouch End. As pupil demand, that is the number of unique applications, not the number of preferences, has been falling slowly over the last three years, were this trend to continue, then her position, regarding having an actual choice of school could be expected to improve.

@nlondondad

Two quick points:

First, the argument over whether Whitehall Park School is needed is over. It's been funded and has opened. Everyone on Mumsnet knows that you don't think it's needed, but it's happening.

Second, as far as Lazaymama2's decision goes, the important point in considering moving out of the area is that there is now a school practically across the street from her that many people, including myself, think will be excellent and to which they are sending their kids. In my case, which I think is typical of this area, I was offered nothing in April except WPS. As you know, last month we were offered a place at St Michael's at the last minute, but we decided in the end that while they are both excellent schools, WPS will be a better option for our children.

@Lazymama2

My advice to you is to ignore the politics of this and arrange a meeting with the Head at WPS, Laura Birckett, and see for yourself what you think. It's also worth both learning about her track record as Head at St John the Baptist in N1 and speaking to Bellevue Place Education Trust, the non-profit Free School Trust to which WPS belongs, to see what you think of their ethos. For the record, BPET is support by two UK-based private companies: Bellevue Education, which runs independent schools in the UK (including locally the well-regarded Norfolk House School in Muswell Hill) and Switzerland, and Place Group, which is a well-established contractor supporting the establishment of academies and free schools. It's worth going to see Rutherford House, the first Free School the BPET opened in Balham, to get a sense of where WPS is going. Get the facts, meet the people involved, and see for yourself.

@highgatedad:

So you were offered a place at St Michaels School ...N6

First point. This is yet another example of Whitehall Park School being not needed, because in fact you DID have an offer of a place at another school.

Second point. Despite being offered St Michael's School N6 you chose Whitehall Park School.

So you are telling us that you turned down an over subscribed, well regarded, "sought after" school, with excellent facilities, on a very fine, very spacious site (in 1852 it was a working farm) - spacious enough to have a full set of playgrounds, sportsfields on top, AND their own "nature trail" in favour of a school whose future is not certain, where the children will be housed for some time to come in portocabins (really cosy in January) on a building site, which during the building period, will have virtually no space for them to play in? And where instead of a long established record of achievement you have marketing promises?

"very spacious site (in 1852 it was a working farm)"
How does that mean a school has room? My house was part of a large Orchard in 1852.

Its an interesting historical thing. The school was set up in 1852, with the same number of pupils it has now, and on the same site it has now, and at that time there was a farm attached to the school. They have retained all the land, but they no longer farm it....

So the school was not BUILT on a farm, it HAD a farm!

@highgatedad

Are you crazy!!?!! You turned down a school that had a farm attached to it 160 years ago. When I was choosing a school for my child that was top of my list of priorities.

I make no comment about anyones sanity: but for the avoidance of any doubt St Michaels School still has all the land it had when it opened all those years ago. Have a look at the website...

But I would have thought the Ofsted "outstanding" grade more significant myself.

Agreed, St Michael's has an amazing site - possibly the most amazing of any state school site in London, and more amazing than many independent schools. Definitely one of the biggest pro of the school.

Leaving the benefits of St Michael's aside, I think that one of, if not the, most important choices in choosing a school is how much confidence you have in the school's leadership team and how much attention that children are going to get from that team. Whitehall Park has an amazing leadership team and with only two classes, and as a result is able to give a great degree of focus to the children and their individual needs.

As for the need for Whitehall Park, if it had not been there we might have gotten a place at a school in special measures in Tottenham and, if we hadn't had the good fortune that a St Michael's child moved out of London, we would have been left with that unacceptable choice or an independent school (another school nlondondad is skeptical of, by the way, which just got an Outstanding inspection report). We would have been forced to choose the latter to ensure a high quality education for our child, and at this point we would already have been liable for a full term's independent school fees. That seems to me like need, if not dire need.

Highgatedad:

"would have been" is surely the relevant point. You were offered a place at a school within a reasonable distance of you, ofsted outstanding. You did not "need" Whitehall Park...

be that as it may it would still be interesting to know how many children WPS actually has, ought to be pretty evident by now.