Devonshire House

[stretto]

I have found a lot of negative comments about this school on Mumsnet.

In particular there is a thread where several different posters pile in and say it's hardly selective at all.

Yet I have read elsewhere that there are about 4 applicants for every place.

I would love to hear some opinions from people who are familiar with this school and with the general North London educational melee milieu.

Thank you.

Where did you get the 4 applicants per place? The school? I've never heard of anyone wanting a place not being offered one. Most apply for several schools, with the likes of DH and NBH as back ups. DH advertises heavily- may not be the best use of cash in such an 'oversubscribed' school. I looked round and personally didn't like it. Nursery children didn't look particularly happy on day I visited, teachers distant etc. Prob just a one off, but you have to make the cut somehow.

I think in an area with such superb schools, it's not that DH is 'bad' per se, it's just not thought to be as good academically as say, the Hall, Arnold House, Hampstead Hill, UCS/Pheonix, Highgate etc etc. HTH

Our 2.5 year old child is on the reserve list for a 3+ place at Highgate. I sat in on that assessment, and my child was clingy, but did very well otherwise. So I had high hopes for the Devonshire House assessment. For what it's worth, my little one can recognise numbers up to 15 and is confident with the alphabet.

We found out earlier this week that we have only made it on to the waiting list for Devonshire House. If it's true that it's hardly selective at all, this makes me a bit panicky about 4+ assessments, assuming we don't get a 3+ reserve list place at either Highgate or Dev. House.

Our child doesn't attend nursery, but goes to a relaxed creche for a couple of hours most days. We haven't engaged a tutor, as the schools advised against this. Maybe I am being naive about this?

Seriously, don't worry. Im certain a place will appear at Dev House.....Highgate is notoriously hard to get into apparently. Lots of turn over in n London schools. Try hanpstead hill school. Even if you don't get a place this time, lots move to more selective a at 4+ so lots of time. Also try north bridge house, st Margaret's, could also try the feeder nurseries if you are that way inclined eg HHS, Clowns (quite intense tho by all accounts), Annemount and the Avenue.

I have two close friends with smart children who didn't pass the Devonshire House assessments, neither at 3+ nor at 4+. I totally disagree that everybody gets a place there. The school is actually full and oversubscribed. Of course it's not Arnold House or NLCS, but I find it quite snobbish of people to talk about how easy it is to get in there. There are plenty of schools in Hampstead that are just fine and still relatively hard to get into, even if not super selective.

Avenue say there are lots of siblings this year so it's looking unlikely for a 3+ place; and we registered there when our child was only 10 months old.Apparently that was too late! It's like a rat race for babies.

Does Highgate say no to anyone after assessment? They say the reserve list is short but I don't know if they're just being kind.

If you have the dish, you will get in somewhere. Puke.

A tutor?!

Apparently some parents do engage tutors for 3+ and 4+ assessments. I can't imagine a toddler sitting still for long enough to be tutored but maybe that's just my child.

There probably are 4 applicants for every place, most parents put their children down for 3-5 schools, do all the assessments. Then the schools all offer to the brightest children, the turn 3-4 schools down, them the next round offers to next children and so on and eventually most of the children get a place.
As Devonshire is one of the bigger schools and less popular, it's likely you will get a place at some point this year (we did). They also have a very big turnover of children, those moving to different schools and out of London.

Thank you Karoleann. Did you take up the place at Dev House?

I would imagine that there would be huge movement on their WL as they are generally a backup school rather than a first choice, so while people may not get a place immediately, if you hang in there one should come up.

Thank you, that's reassuring.

stretto - no we didn't, it was sort of a back up if we didn't get our first (and only) choice of state school. Although we did move out of London and the boys go to an independent school now.
I know three families that did go there and have since moved on - after 7+. I don't think they had any major issues, but there are many schools with better facilities and academic reputations.

Thank you. I'm curious about what they, and other selective schools are looking for. My child seems bright, and I thought it was a good achievement to be able to read the alphabet and numbers by 2.5 years old. I guess in North London that's a bare minimum for that age group!

Stretto, have a look at mumteacher's 4+ 5+ assessment threads for some
Ideas. Generally they like children who are articulate, outgoing, have a good vocabulary and advanced grammar for their age, who have some general knowledge and are curious and well behaved, mature, follow instructions and so on. Basically children who seem like they are ready for school and will be easy to teach.

Thank you, I will have a look at that.

I'm gate crashing a bit here, as I'm not living in London so don't have any personal interest in the schools, but how do they assess children who are so young? Surely they can't measure a child's ability at just 3 or 4 years old, or can they? What exactly do they do and how do they differentiate between those who are naturally bright and those who have been tutored?

I know they have many applicants per place, so have to choose somehow but I struggle to see how they can do it fairly or even accurately.

DS had an assessment for his school, but I was given the impression it was more of a formality than anything else. He was offered places at 3 other schools too and I was told that if you had an offer from one you would likely get offers at them all. I don't think they are selective in the same way as in London though (we're in Edinburgh).

And also, it's not just being able to read and say numbers - do they know what 3 means? Can they match number to quantity? Do they recognise patterns? Pen grip? Are they confident? Articulate etc?

Tailtwister. Yes, I agree it's hard to assess meaningfully at 3 or 4.

Dreamingofcake. That's an interesting list. I would say my child scores highly in everything you listed except for confidence. My LO can be a bit tongue-tied around strangers. I don't know how to address this.

tailtwister check out the 4+ threads on here, that will tell you what they assess.

tali some schools rigoursly interview the parents too and some even go the childs current school to watch them in that environment.

I was wondering that too tailtwister. Also if they really are managing to select the brightest kids then how good are these schools really? After all, you can't compare them to a non-selective school only to the very brightest kids in the non-selective school. Still, if everyone else is doing it I can understand the peer pressure and if all the bright kids go elsewhere you would worry for your bright kid in the state school.

In the past few years (not inc 2014 entry don't know those stats yet) but Nlcs have taken on a number of girls from DH at 7+. However I don't know DH school personal so couldn't comment on if this is a reflection of the school or tutoring.

Thanks mumteacher. The reports on Dev House seem to be excellent so that's why I'm puzzled by some of the Mumsnet comments.

On a separate note, does anyone know whether the deadline for accepting Highgate Preprep places has passed? I'm guessing no reserve list place will be forthcoming as we would have heard by now.

It is really very irresponsible to talk about schools in this manner, especially when it is not based on facts. Devonshire House is a good school, the children are happy and there is a good community feel. The turnover is high, but is it a reflection of the fact that surrounding area attracts expats.

There was a slippage in the quality admittedly going back 3-4 years for various reasons. However, it never got to the point to deserve such unfair criticism.
The new head teacher Mrs Piper is excellent and has been making significant improvements since she came on board. Academic results are getting better every year, 2014 results were no different.