Skipping a year. WWYD?

[jenniferalisonphillipasue]

My dd is in year one at a very small school where the classes are mixed. She is a winter birthday and one of the oldest in her year. They work in ability groups and she has been doing her work with the Year Twos who are mainly summer birthdays. Last week they did some SATS papers for practice and dd scored 2a's.
Her teacher spoke to me and asked how I would feel about her skipping year 2 and going straight into year 3 which is in a different classroom. I don't really know what to do. She has friends in both year groups but I don't want her to feel socially alienated. I also don't want to push her too hard but don't want her to be bored either.

Does anyone have any experience of making this kind of decision?

Thanks

I would not advise the move. I was moved up twice in primary school and academically it was fine, but I was physically and emotionally less developed than my cohort which was tricky at times.
There is so much more to childhood than academics! There is so much that you can do at home and outside of school (as well as what the staff can do in the classroom) that will extend intellectual abilities and interests. As she grows older having a social group of similar aged peers will be invaluable.

Thank you for taking the time to respond. I think it is an overwhelming no which is really interesting. Many people mention differentiating. Can someone explain how this works in practice please I.e my dd knows her times tables and can tell the time. How does a lesson work when the main focus is teaching these things to a majority who don't know? Thanks

She should always be given the next step if she is confident on the main things being taught. For example, I can think of all sorts of telling the time puzzles that would range from easy to very complicated. There will normally be times in a lesson when children work independently at set tasks/activities and there will be differentiation across the class anyway at this time. Just perhaps the teacher needs to think beyond what is normally required for this year group to stretch your DD, but a good teacher should gear it to the individual pupils so shouldn't be that strange a thing to do .

As an example, while others may be mastering the basics of three o'clock/6 o'clock etc she could be working out the time between events in 24 hour clock/looking at timetables/introducing more than one person making the same journey but by different transport modes and with differing start times/working back from a time (i.e. The start of a film) and working out length of journey and what time people would need to leave to arrive on time and so on.

In dd's year 6 class there are children working towards/aiming for a level 4 and children working confidently at a level 6. In ds1's year 3 class he is at level 4 for reading and writing, whereas I'd imagine some pupils are working towards a level 2. Mostly he is accommodated in the same class but for some aspects (guided reading/reading comp) he works with year 5 and 6's (mostly 5 now, because this is part of the strategy to cope with the current year 6 cohort leaving this year). Moving up by one year wouldn't have helped in his case because the same issue of differentiation would have applied, with no social benefit at all (quite the reverse) and the thorny issue of what to do in year 6.

We were offered for DS1 to go into Y3 at his new school after finishing Y1 but I felt quite strongly about him mixing with children his own age.

He went from YR into Y2 at his infant school but we knew he would then stay in Y2 for another year as there was no junior school. Whilst he was challenged going up that year he was still in the top groups so it felt like actual Y2 was a real waste of time as there were no other children at his level and he repeated lots of work. The only reason we agreed to it was that the school 'sold' it well and it was a very small school which meant he would still be with Y1 for play time, PE etc. It was not without its problems though in spite of initially being good for him academically.

When the new school offered for him to go into Y3 instead of Y2 I knew academically he would more than keep up, he is also very mature but my worry was later down the line, he wouldn't have to repeat Y6 as it is also a senior school but I would have real concerns later down the line as he is not an older one in his year so when he was 13 there would have been some 15 YOs and I think there are huge differences then.

My other reason is I was similar to him at school and all my friends were older than me, it made my last two years at secondary school very unhappy and I don't want that for him.

Any school should be able to differenciate IMO, I wish I had been more forceful at his infant school about this issue.

I would imagine that there is only a small amount of talking to the whole class about the activity they are doing so then the children should be able to be given work for their ability.

When DS started in YR for instance the children were having to sort objects into catagories such as soft/hard so DS was given the job to write out the labels for each section and check if the objects were in the right catagories. A simple example but teachers should be able to do this right the way through and if not then children can go to a higher class for a specific lesson such as guided reading. I am surprised that it would be necessary in maths as I would think that would be the easiest to differenciate.

In DSs Y3 class the children are working between a 2b and a 3a (there are only 18 of them) so they must be able to work it out fairly well.

I meant to say in Maths they are between a 2b and a 3a.

In literacy the difference is even bigger, covering more than 2 NC levels.

There is also the danger of being a social outcast in a child's proper year, though, if they stay in it and are well ahead. I came from a country where acceleration/repeating years was more common, so the worry about secondary transfer didn't come up, but there was the possibility of moving me ahead at age 6. In the end it didn't happen as school and parents felt that socially it might not work. But actually, I often did socialise with the older year at activities etc, and I was always seen as a bit of a misfit in my proper year. I was the one other children came to when they needed something read, or help with something, or information or whatever. I wasn't disliked, I just didn't seem part of the class on equal terms - like an older sister in some ways. It was never ordinary peer relationships, and the chance for the ordinary give and take of friendships never quite worked. There were many other reasons that I didn't have lots of friends as a child - shy and geeky doesn't really help - but that contributed. I was physically as big and tall as the year above (being 2 weeks too young to have gone into that year in the first place), but wasn't very good at sports anyway whatever year I was with.

On the other hand, there are good things about being top of the class most of the time (although it didn't tend to teach me a work ethic, or how to try and fail at things). I also felt very out of place when even my own year were getting interested in 'teenage' things, because I wasn't. This was my own personality I guess, but if I'd been moved up, I might have felt even weirder (although maybe then I'd have at least had the excuse that I was a bit younger!).

I certainly learned to hide being clever as I got older; it's one thing to be fairly easily in top groups, and another to be noticeably different, and children (at least back then, and particularly in later primary and early secondary) were not very tolerant of someone who was seen as clever.

So I don't know. If she has to repeat year 6, then I think 'no'; but if not, it's worth considering her personality, the group that she'd be with, and how it would affect her more globally.

If she is a 2a now, she could be a 3b this time next year, which would not be out of the ordinary for a Year 2 child. A little ahead, yes, but in a larger school she would probably not be the only one.

It is easy to differentiate the activities for her and her teachers should be doing this already. I would not skip a year but I might consider changing schools to a larger one.

It sounds like her school are trying to fit her into the most convenient place for them, not her.

I used to teach a class with a very large spread of ability - so in Maths, I had children working between P5-6 (so significantly lower than a level 1) and 4c.

It is harder work than a smaller spread, I won't deny it - and it is probably for this reason that the school wants to accelerate your child, as a Reception - Year 2 class is already a very large range to plan for in a single class. I did that in a training placement and it was very hard work - think of how to move children with an 'effective' age range - so an academic age range - between 18 months and 9 years old, on in every lesson for 5 lessons per day.....OK the 18 months [significat SEN] was unusual, but 36 months - 9 years would be a 'normal' effective ability range for such a class

However, your concern shoudn't be the ease of the teacher, but the best outcome for your child. When posts on MN talk about benefits / issues of mixed age classdes, I have usually posted about the issue of 'outliers' in ability terms in such classes. Mixed age classes already require significantly differentiated planning to deal with e./g. the needs of the youngest Recpetion child as well as the most able year 2. If the most able Year 2 is VERY able, then the stretch is wider and the differentiation required that much greater.

On the one hand, in a mixed age class, the teacher should already be very well versed in differentiation - in my current school, with a narrower ability range, some teachers are perhaps less skilled at in than my colleagues in my old one, simply because it uis less of a day to day pressing reality. On the other hand, they may be genuinely reluctant, or simnply humanly unable, to accommodate the even wider range of abilities created by keeping your DD in the correct year. In the latter casde, the only solution is to move schools, to a larger school where there will be others of similar ability - 2a at this point in Year 1 is good but not extraordinary - or where single age classes may make it more humanly possible for the teacher to deliver suitable differentiation.

I'd go for the 'not bored' option. Our child (reception) spends half of her time with year 1 and it has made a big difference to her behaviour and attention span, plus she's started to make progress again.

I think the idea that other children will catch up is often confused with it being hard to significantly differentiate for a small number of children or one child, so of course the others 'catch up' It's also very hard for teachers to asses quite what level the kids are at if the level they are at is very different from their expectations because they don't have time. When the school did test DD they found that for maths she would be in the top half of year 2 despite being one of the youngest in reception, for example.

I think socially she's happier too as she knows more children and more staff, and in some ways I think she finds it easier to relate to the older ones because she's always had an old head.

(Incidentally I was accelerated too and had to repeat a year - I'm determined that won't happen for DD and so have the option of home-schooling up my sleeve.)

My youngest sister and I were both a year ahead at school. It did neither of us any favours. Academically we did fine, emotionally and socially it was a disaster with effects that have lasted into our adult lives.

My brother and other sister who were among the eldest in their years did considerably better in the long run even if they didn't have as good a set of exam results.

Own year in a school that can differentiate.

DB skipped a year in primary but was then had to repeat a year before secondary and got v bored. BIL skipped 2 years, academically able (fulfilled promise as adult) but he says it was difficult socially as a teen.

One thing I'd say is that, if you choose not to move her up, press the school hard for them to provide appropriate learning and teaching.

The brightest kid in the class has the same rights to differentiated learning as the one struggling the most.

Taking, I'm with you all the way there!

However, as I posrted above, differentiating appropriately for a very brioght Y2 in a mixed Recpetion - Year 2 class as the OP has may steer close to 'humanly impossible' for the teacher. As i say, I have taught such a class (containing a significant number of SEN children as well, including one with moderate learning difficulties - no speech, not toilet trained etc). Even before differentiating, providing a proper free-flow EYFS environment for the Reception children as well as properly progressve and increasingly stretching Phonics, English and Maths throughout, and really engaging the whole age range duing e.g. history, RE, PE etc is hard work. I used to end up planning c 15 separate 'lessons' [obviously not all formal teaching lessons, some would be 1:1 or small group input or a set of teacher guided activities for EYFS] per day to accommodate the full range. Ensuring that in each one of the activities geared to Y2 the very able get appropriate differentiation would cut sleep even further to a minimum!

In the OP's case I would be looking for a larger school with a reasonably able intake - her DD would be well within the 'normal' range for such a school and would receive appropriate teaching in her own year group as a matter of course.

I wouldn't do it. Repeating y6 again would be incredibly boring and your DD wouldn't like it. She would also grow up with people older than her and won't really experience being a child really if you know what I mean. So I wouldn't do it.

There is no reason she would have to repeat year 6 - get the LA involved and point out that it is your legal obligation to provide your child with an appropriate education, which you do by entrusting your DD to them - and that their judgement has been that she should be with older children.

I would have lived dc1 to skip a year. Very similar situation than your dc.
However I was told clearly that he would just end up redoing his Y6 which really defeated the whole point.
So we went with the 'let's difference ate his work' which has done years worked but most of the time hasn't. He spent all his Y2 and most of his Y3 learning very little, esp in maths with a teacher who acknowledged his abilities but couldn't possibly do more than she did 'as he was so far advanced' compare to the others. Y4 was even worse. Y5 is better in that he is stretched more, still
Shows abilities way beyond his age but ... As he never has being given the support to move on he is still just cruising at the top of the class.
The one area he needed to improve was spelling and no one has ever managed to really make a difference or tell me how I can support him
Can you tell I'm very desillusioned about it all?

Oh and YY to the fact that an older child with some academic abilities will feel out of place.
I was a year ahead (different country) and always felt right where I was. Dc1 hasn't been moved ahead and is out of place and looking for older children to socialize with.

Consider what will happen when she's 14 her peer group are having 16th birthday parties full of alcohol, sexual experimentation etc.

Or going to university aged 17 and not being able to get into clubs or have a credit card in her own right.

Oh the inhumanity of not having a credit card at university!

Won't anybody think of the children?

As a child who was ahead I have never had any issue with parties, clubs, going out etc. I even managed living home wo a card for a few months (remember the OP dd would is one of the oldest in the class) after Alevels.
If my son had been ahead a year, he would have had to wait only a couple of weeks more than the youngest of the year to get one anyway!!

I can't quite see how it would be an issue for one child to be in a certain year group when they are only a couple of weeks younger than their (youngest in that year) counterparts.
It would be an issue if you were asking a teenager in Y8 to go that but not when they are so young and then just grow with children that age

Your DD is a little ahead but lots of children often are. Its very normal for teachers to teach a wide level of ability! There are schools round me that teach two year groups in one class. There's even a school with only 60 kids and few classes! It really is the norm for a teacher to have to teach a real mix. Often there is a TA in the class anyway. As a compromise I might ask for my child to do maths with the year above but to be honest teachers have to set questions in work books that match individual child's ability anyway. It's not like your child is doing year 5 work while the class is doing reception work. The difference between your DD's ability and the others is workable.

It's very odd they have suggested moving her. Half my DS's class was level 3 in y2 but the teacher just rolled with it.

That's the point though really. If half the class were at her level it would be fine. As it is none of the class are at her level. She scored higher in the tests than any of the current year twos.
I am still in two minds. The best option would be to move her to a bigger school (45 pupils in whole school here) but she has 2 other siblings at the school so this is not really workable unless I move them all. However I am really happy with the school in general.
Decisions, decisions.....