How do you as a parent use an Ofsted report?

[onetiredmummy]

I'm in the middle of deciding to move my DC's to another school. Current school is Requires Improvement, both potential schools are Good.

I read the Ofsted reports to get an idea of how the school is performing.

However on MN I constantly see that Ofsted reports are regarded as box ticking excercises & not a true reflection of the school. If that's the case then is there any use trying to use them to make an informed choice about a new school (also viewing the school as well obviously). There must be a point to Ofsted but if its not trustworthy then do you disregard it totally?

milly my daughters school is expecting a crappy ofsted report imminently. One set of poor SATs results and a few nasty pants who have it in for the ht. Less than 12 months ago they believed all was hunky dory (and wrote the complimentary letter for the website).

I guess someone has to believe

parents not pants

Before I had children in school and was looking at potential schools I used it as a way of prioritising the schools that were of interest to me. We have lots of schools nearby and I only went to see the schools with level 1 or 2 Ofsted reports.

Fast forward 5 years and the DCS school went from a 2 to 3 Ofsted report during the time at the school. They have now returned to a 2 and are expecting a 1 next time. From my perspective nothing has changed in that time. Both my DCs are happy and progressing. Would they have done better in a school with a consistent 1 in Ofsted ? I honestly don't believe they would have.

If I was looking at schools now I would take the Ofsted into consideration , I would consider the overall pattern of their Ofsted results, get opinions of other parents and then go and see the school. I think you get a feeling for schools. If you like a school when you see it but it has a poor Ofsted then ask the school what their improvement plan is.That should tell you if it's OK.

I think an Ofsted report is just one aspect of the decision process.

there's a local(ish) secondary that got good in one ofsted & inadequate at another inspection only 8 months later. Doesn't give you much faith in the grading techniques.

Brettgirl2. I am sorry you think I am some sort of "duped" person as I think differently to a lot of posters but parents writing negative things about a school coupled with one set of poor results will not result in requires improvement or worse! If there is evidence to uphold the parental complaints, then that will be stated in the report. If the school is worried it is probably because that group of children did not make good progress. How do you know if all the children are making good progress unless you are a governor or teacher? My earlier point was that most parents do not have this information so an Ofsted inspection can be useful. All schools have less good year groups and brainy ones too. The pattern of progress is taken into account and schools who have good results can still require improvement if lots of bright children could, and should, have done better.

I strongly agree that looking round a school is important but an improvement plan will not tell you if the school is actually improvement or not. The review visits be HMI would. An improvement plan will tell you where the school is focussing their attention, not if they are achieving anything.

I wouldn't look at them. Remember, if the bad ones can be wrong then so can the good ones. In my experience, Ofsted come in with a grade in mind and make that fit the school. Why are so many schools suddenly requires improvement? Because Ofsted want them to be.

I don't. I talk to parents at pick up times in the playground, I go on a visit or two, and make my decision based on how I feel the school will suit my DC's. My gut feeling has never been wrong - I disliked my DC's last primary even on the visit, it didn't 'feel' right. Had no choice but to send them there (long story, but genuinely no choice), and they ALL hated it there, to the point of my 11yo having depression at 9yo because if it.

Have now moved house, had a perfect gut feeling about new school, and it's done WONDERS for DS2...

And that's been with all 5 primaries my DC's have attended, that my initial 'gut feeling' about the school has been proved right.

The last school they were at, the awful one, was graded 'Outstanding' by Ofsted. The new one is graded 'Satisfactory' under the OLD framework. Which means it would probably have been a 'requires improvement' under the new Ofsted framework.

It's a load of bollocks. At the (on paper worse) new school, DS2 has jumped 6 sub levels in Maths in just half a school year, 4 sub levels in English, and two sub levels in writing, despite his physical disabilities, because the new school are providing him with the equipment he needs that the 'outstanding' school refused to provide. They also have FAR better pastoral care, and any bullying incidents are dealt with immediately. They do far more in depth work in Science, History, and Geography too.

Which is the better school, in my eyes? The one with the worse Ofsted rating!

Remember the inspection report can be years out of date (we once went 7 years between inspections) and many things can change between one report and the next.

Outstanding schools can dine out on it for years. I look forward to some near us getting a full inspection under the new system...

Well I don't set so much store in them now and think that some schools think of themselves a little bit too highly simply because of their Ofsted rating.

We moved to a new area so had little chance to visit or get local opinion so went with the local school who had a good rating even though I had a little niggly gut feeling about some senior staff members. Nothing I could really put my finger on though - seemed pleasant enough to your face but something just didn't 'feel' right.

Certain events then happened which resulted in them showing their true colours . We were treated diabolically when we complained about things as they clearly did not like anyone daring to challenge them. When we said we felt that they had discriminated against our dc they were adamant that they hadn't as their reputation and Ofsted's views proved that they were not that sort of school . They were subsequently found to have been wrong in that assumption.

My point is that some schools absolutely do deserve their good or outstanding rating but others may not be what they seem. I would always recommend caution when choosing a school and think that gut instinct counts for a lot.

I wouldn't not make a decision based on an Ofsted report ever again. Dd1 primary school had an "outstanding" report. For some reason the inspectors did not pick up on the culture of bullying and generally poor behaviour. Sats results were good, but there was no mention about the fact that a lot of DC had a tutor for the 11+ which is before the Sats. When we looked for a secondary school I took a lot of time to listen to what the DC had to say and asked them loads of questions. Sadly this would be difficult at primary level. If I had my time again I would look for happy smiley faces when looking for a primary and gut feeling!

Sadly Millymollymama, Wellthen hits the nail on the head.

Ofsted decided what they wanted to see, poked their noses in to 10 minutes in 60minute lessons and saw what they wanted to see.

Yes, there were management issues, but SM was utterly heartless and plain cruel. The class teachers didn't deserve it, the HT didn't deserve it.

But most of all the DCs didn't deserve their school rubbishing that way, they are mostly justly proud of it.

Starballbunny, Sorry but inspectors do not go in for 10 minutes into a lesson, it is always longer than that and if you read the current (and previous) inspection regimes then any significant failure in management is almost for sure going to end up with a decision that is going to be inadequate.
If there were management issues then that is the direct responsibility of the head teacher, that is what they are paid for.
I do agree with you that for many children it is a really disheartening experience but if they are not getting the education that they deserve then the school has to be named and shamed. There is not alternative if we want to get to the ideal situation where all schools are good schools.

Ignore it. I am governor of an "outstanding" school. It is many things, outstanding is not one of them.

admission do you think management and leadership should be considered inadequate if a number of illegal acts have been committed by the school?

Admission I'm sorry, but that is what I was told by people who were there, I have no reason not to believe them.

Here isn't the place to discuss the fine details of one Ofsted, but the vast majority of the DCs were getting the education they deserved and much of what Ofsted picked holes in a year ago and the HMI has praised now was largely cohort dependent (for a small achievement band) and in no way statistically significant.

I looked round four schools when I was choosing for my daughter who is now in year 2. Two were graded outstanding, one good and one satisfactory at the time. We had a good chance of getting into one of the outstanding ones on distance and both the good and satisfactory ones would have been definites.

One of the outstanding schools was genuinely horrible. It seemed like a factory. I didn't get to speak to a single actual child. Head spent a lot of time talking about SATS and uniform. Still outstanding but hasn't yet been inspected under the new guidelines. We'd probably have got into this one if we'd stayed on the waiting list. I could not have sent my child here. It was horrible.

Other outstanding school seemed nice - friendly and with loads of fun extra-curricular stuff. I kind of knew we wouldn't get this one (a bit too far away) but wasn't that fussed. It was nice but not so nice that I would have wanted to hang about on waiting lists. Nice, friendly children. Since then, they've been revisited by Ofsted and now have a good rating.

The good school, quite frankly, just seemed a bit odd. V full in lower years but only a few children (like less than 15 in a class) left by year 6. Where were they all going? Nobody wanted to tell us. There didn't seem anything special about it. The children who we got to talk to seemed a bit uncommunicative. This school is still graded good.

The satisfactory school was one I LOVED. It was friendly. The head was interesting and took a good hour out of her day to talk to us and show us round (personal visit - we couldn't make the general tour). The school was absolutely covered in amazing artwork. Children were friendly and genuinely happy to talk to us. Every child we spoke to had something nice to say, either generally in a friendly way or about the school. It seemed like a real community. It was just a lovely place to be in. It was a no-brainer that we had to choose it. This school has since been upgraded to good (and rapidly improving so I wouldn't be surprised if it gets a better grade in a few years).

I would take any Ofsted report with a massive pinch of salt. I read the reports for all these schools and the only one that seemed accurate was the second school (used to be outstanding, now good). The others bore no relation to what we saw!

When I was looking for DD, I looked round 5 schools - 4 Outstanding, 1 Needs Improvement - and read the Ofsted reports on them and another 4 (faith schools so not a hope for heathens like us).

I read more than just the current Ofsted for each school. One school that I was very interested in was pulled up for not stretching more able students - however they had been pulled up for the exact same thing the previous time as well so obviously hadn't been making an effort.

Having 4 'Outstanding' to consider was handy as I could compare what was potentially like with like. We live in a very deprived area that is definitely not leafy and MC so no one could accuse the schools of doing well because of their intake. They all had fantastic academic results.

Ultimately for me it came down to the tour - one school did a quick 20 minute rush round and the staff member wasn't able to answer many questions.

The one we picked did a 1.5 hour tour where we sat in on lessons, singing classes, looked at books in a variety of classes and the deputy head explained the literacy systems they used, the range of afterschool clubs, the music lessons

The school websites were also really interesting - the one with 6 typos on the home page alone did not impress!

The categories which I think are really important are Pupil Progress and Teaching and Leadership. From what I have seen, lots of schools which overall need improvement, get good for pupil safety. Not many seem to fall down on this one (luckily)
If leadership requires improvement, there are underlying issues. It suggests a lack of capacity to turn the situation round. It often seems to be associated with temporary heads or quick turn over of heads, but not always.

One thing I look at when visiting schools, is exercise books. I am looking to see the quantity of written work and particularly the marking. I am also looking to see what pupils then have to do in response to the marking.

It is this feedback on work and take which then lead on from the feedback, to embed the feedback that allows real progress.

Reading this post has made me think more about my priorities in a school. Number one - I just want DC to feel comfortable and confident and safe and happy (as much as possible). Number two - I want them to do interesting things so that they like learning.

I don't care what their SATs are as long as they have tried their best and are happy with themselves.

They are in school not a factory.

Oh and number three - I want the school to be local so they have local friends. So they can play after school, see each other at cubs, be part of the community.

I just look for hot gossip. One school near me got sanctioned, shut down temporarily and heavily fined for hiring unqualified teachers who were just friends and family of the headmaster. No background checks at all. Another school claimed no bullying took place, ever, and kept no records of any incidents, yet the children reported it did, frequently, and they were often frightened. Oh, and a school that just gave the kids worksheets to colour in and then the teacher sat in a corner in silence ON inspection day! In front of the inspector!

So, I basically look for huge glaring enormous problems and try to keep an open mind about the rest of it. I am very aware of schools that are grade-chasers and coasters (story of my life) so I try to look for those factors in the figures as well.