Yr5 had student teacher for autumn term now having another student from Jan to June - am I right to be unhappy?

[really1234]

DS2 is in yr5 with a deputy head as his teacher. This means she is already out of the classroom for one whole day a week. Many parents have concerns about her not being there as she is often also out of the classroom for other meetings etc, and are also concerned that the children are not being stretched by her. I myself went in last week to check how he was doing as I was concerned that he wasn't working to his ability. I was told he hadn't been last term but has turned around this term.

For info but not strictly relevant - I have a mixed history with this teacher as DS1 also had her in yr4 and yr6, in yr4 he hardly progressed at all and it seemed a surprise to her when I mentioned I was shocked at the end of the year yet in yr6 DS1 did very well. I also know her well through being a longstanding governor.

Anyway, in the autumn term they had a student teacher in the class on placement for about 8 weeks (not sure exactly but over half the term). She seemed fine but it is very difficult as a parent to know if that was the case.

We have now had an email saying that from Monday next week they will be having a PCGE student in to 'join the class teaching team' until June.

Now, in reality the student teachers tend to teach almost full time in our school. Is it unreasonable to be concerned about this and about my child's education being disrupted further?

Is there anything I should do or could do? Is it acceptable to have nearly the whole year taught by student teachers?

Any thoughts from teachers would be really welcome.

Thanks in advance.

When I was training we were in school for this period of time.
If it helps there was lots and lots of support, and much more observation than at any other stage of my teaching career. All the planning was scrutinised by the qualified teachers, and lots of the time we followed the planning put in place by the year group team.

You might be pleasantly surprised, especially if you are not happy with the class teacher being out so much!

Thanks for that Beccadugs, it's good to hear there is lots of support.

There should be lots of support and the student shouldn't be left to teach the whole class full time for the duration of their placement. When I had students on their final placements I had them work up to about 80% in their penultimate wk. then use their final wk for reflection and evaluating their own practice which is vital IMO.

However, I am well aware that some crap schools use even first year students as supply and to cover. It is shocking and if you're sure this is happening you should complain. It's not fair to the student either.
However, if your concern is simply that there's a student in the class then I wouldn't worry. Assuming they are progressing well then their lessons are likely to be innovative and imaginative. They always have great enthusiasm and aren't yet jaded.

Btw, if the dht is out for one day a week, isn't there a regular stand in who plans in advance for that day in collaboration with the class teacher? That's what should be happening.

The teacher still has ultimate responsibility. Even if the student is a bit rubbish, the children will still be expects to progress. I think 2 students in one year is a bit too much disruption but the students aren't a problem in themselves. I have had students and if I was ever worried the kids hadn't got something I made a mental note to go over it or would mention it to the student later and ask them to try it differently in their next lesson. If the student isn't up t? scratch the support will increase - if necessary their planning will be reviewed before they teach.

IMO you'll be far better off with an enthusiastic out to impress student who's getting loads of support than you are with a jaded Deputy Head who's looking for every opportunity to be out of the classroom. Teachers who love teaching often don't progress beyond a senior classroom teacher grade because they don't wan to leave the children behind.

That's obviously not always the case but it makes me laugh when parents at our school are so delighted to get the experienced deputy head rather than one of the younger less experienced teachers for their children, as I know she lost interest in actually teaching a class years ago and is always looking for a reason to be out of class or (even better) off the premises altogether.

Thanks for your replies, they are good to see.

There is regular cover for the regular one day per week but it is PPA teacher in am and HLTA in pm. And other random people when she is out at other meetings.

I am not sure how much the students are left to it, my impression is a lot but that may be unfair. I will keep an eye on it.

Good to know that it may be a good thing. Thanks all again.

As a governor you must be aware that teachers are definitely judged by the performance re attainment and progress of the children in their class so the deputy still has to ensure these children make progress. I would be shocked if the student is not heavily monitored with plenty of support.

it could definitely end up being a bonus.

DD2 had students in Yr4, they were brilliant. Very well supervised, bringing in lots of enthusiasm. It depends on the school - ours is very much a 'teaching' school and they take their duties seriously.

DD2 is in yr6 now, her teacher is in her second year of qualified teaching and honestly she is the best teacher DD2 has had since Yr2. DD2 has come on in leaps - she has always done very well in school but her confidence has been lacking. She's now inspired with confidence, ambitious to do well and she knows she can do it. It's great.

Hi really1234

I can sincerely hand on heart say that PGCE teachers being trained through a University based teacher training programme tend to be highly motivated and dedicated. In both my DDs cases, trainee PGCE teachers often have been more up to date, challenging (in the sense of stretching my child/ no preconceptions about what a kid can or can't do) than the 'staff'.

I was having teachers & HT tell me DD1 was 'just a bit dim' and 'no good at maths' and a trainee PGCE teacher from the University where I work (so I tended to bump into her) was able to teach her about fractions - no problem in October of Y2.

It was taught visually - using pizzas and cutting up plastic cups - and having the children make them whole again. DD1 just totally got it & retained it. Suddenly she could talk about there being 8 1/8ths in a pizza with eight slices - or 'Mommy we've eaten 5/6ths of the pizza and there is 1/6th left - and that was when I began to think 'maybe the school staff aren't the best qualified' to judge what my child can or can't do.

Unfortunately, one of the real shames about school staff pages is they tend to avoid showing parents what the actual qualifications of the staff are. (In one case I think telling us X got a 3rd from University of XXXX and after a few years working in a pub went and did in service teacher training - wouldn't be a good thing. But of course this highly qualifies her to be Head of Maths at our school.).

I strongly suspect most of the teachers at our school are a product of 'in service' training (for which read thrown in at the deep end - often with familiy already in teaching - so connections to make this possible) - which the government is big on these days. But as Universities are trying to argue (although possibly too late in the day) wider understanding of how children learn (that they learn differently) and knowledge that there are 'trends' or 'fads' in education + knowledge of how to support/ teach chidlren with various learning difficulties/ disabilies - and being aware of both traditional/ new approaches (their advantages/ disadvantages) really helps all the children learning from them.

So sincerely really1234 - don't rush to judge the trainee teacher harshly. They're going to be full of enthusiasm. They're going to work really hard (because they want a good reference to go on to get a job & because they're being so closely observed). And sometimes they bring all sorts of new and exciting ideas to the classroom - which really livens up the learning environment and can help your child achieve things you never thought possible.

HTH

Thanks again to all replies. I am coming round to the fact that I don't have utmost faith in the existing teacher so an enthusiastic student may well be very good. The student is also male and the school has very few staff so I think DS will relate well to him.

Thanks again.

My son had a similar scenario to this:

brilliant teacher loads of progress in year 4

Largely absent deputy head year 5 - set back in levels achieved.

Full time teacher and more progress in 6

Personally I don't think a deputy should be allocated a class if it means the children's education will suffer a set back as a result

I wouldn't assume having a student will be a bad thing though in my experience they have bags of enthusiasm - my son is most inspired by the teachers who enjoy their subjects.

I asked every teacher my son had of they had noticed some of his odd behaviour the only person who had picked up on it at all was a student teacher.