Supporting a good reader who struggles with sounding out/blending new words

[DebbieFiderer]

DD1 is in Y1, and a pretty good reader (Gold level), but I think she has mainly learned to read by sight/memory, meaning that she struggles occasionally with new words. She has a bad habit of guessing what the word should be, sometimes by looking at the first sound then substituting a word she knows which starts with that sound, sometimes by just making up a new (non-existent!) word which shares some of the same letters as the word she is trying to read. I tell her to sound it out, which is fine, she can sound out each letter, but she can't go from there to blending the full word if it is long (short words are fine).

We have tried breaking it down into segments, but she still can't make the leap from there to the full word without a lot of help. For instance, the latest book we read had the word 'desperate' - hard enough using the phonics she has learned so far, but even if she sounded the last syllable as ate rather than at, she couldn't join des-per-ate into a word until I said them for her. I am planning on raising this at parents' evening tomorrow, but in the meantime, does anyone have any ideas of how I can support her at home?

On a slightly separate note, can anyone point me to a link where I can get an idea of what is required at various NC levels, specifically for reading?

My DD is also in year 1 (on Lime) and has a similar problem.

On gold and white levels in particular I would write words like that out on a piece of paper like this des/per/ate and encourage her to sound out the first part d-e-s then blend it, then sound out the next part p-er, blend it but then go back and say the first blend and the second blend before then sounding out the ate.

This helped because the problem DD has (I think) is a working memory one. By the time she sounds out the middle or end of the word she has forgotten the beginning sounds she'd just made.

This is all made more challenging because by White and Lime levels a reasonable amount of the new words (especially in factual or mythical books) are so phonetically irregular that there is no way she can work out what the words are without help. For example (with her attempts in brackets):

labyrinth (l/ay/b/ee/r/i/n/th),

phoenix (f/oa/e/n/i/x),

theory (th/e/or/ee))

If anyone else has more advice on this particular problem I'd be interested to hear too!

Finally, here's a link to the skills required for each of the book band levels.

I don't think you need to worry; your DD's reading level sounds like it is well above average. It is not that your DD struggles with blending new words but blending longer new words, some of which won't even be in her spoken vocabulary. Then there the added complication that the pronunciation of longer words is distorted slightly. How is she with words that dont distort like, say, picnic or fantastic?

Your children will get lots of blending practice when they prepare for the alien words test.

I am really surprised that your children have been allowed to soar up the reading levels if they can't blend and segment well.

It is still early in the year and year 1 children are really little.

They should be getting 98% of the words correct straight away. If not, they are on the wrong reading level.

My DS was the same in yr1. He still doesn't seem to be able to blend, but as he's level 5 and in yr 6 it doesn't seem to matter any more. And I think the problem was with words outside his vocabulary.

As for being allowed up the levels, he taught himself to read in yr r and holding him back to simple books when he could easily read gold would have been very demotivating for him.

Oh she is definitely getting the vast majority of the word correct first time, in her latest book I think there were two or three she didn't know; desperate, scent and maybe one other. I think it is about longer words, I spoke to her teacher about it at parents' evening tonight and she wasn't worried, just said to carry on with what we are doing. Thanks for all your input.

Obviously can't speak for the OP but DD 'took' the phonics test in reception. I'd printed a copy of last years off for interest and although I'd placed it face down she was nosying about and saw all those cute aliens and off she went - she 'scored' 38 out of 40 and will have no problem passing this year either because let's face it, it's a basic test with only the common phonic correspondences and words of only two syllables. DD had no problem sounding out portrait when she came across it the other day. It is multi or poly (not sure of the difference) syllabic words that cause problems.

Shrieking
Where exactly did you get 98% from then? Everything I've read (and I've read a lot) states that 90% - 95% is the correct 'instructional' level. She reads fluently and with expression out loud (as noted by her teacher, who is, after all, the person that has placed her on this level), and she happily zips through the standard fairy / animal chapter books for pleasure.

It doesn't change the fact that when she reaches a word of 3, or more usually now, 4 (or more) syllables or any word with rare correspondences, she struggles.

Sorry Debbie, when I started you hadn't posted!

Many years of administering reading tests. 95-98% is instructional level for eg ORT although the levels they get are based on the comprehension scores too. It is totally fine to learn by sight - sounds like they'll all ace the phonics test anyway. Some children do just learn better that way!

In terms of advice, just get her to not panic when she comes to a long word, remind her she can tackle it in bits and doesn't have to start at the beginning of it eg if she recognises the sound that 'ix' makes at the end of phoenix and she sussed that ph was 'f' in this case she's very nearly there.

Sometimes children are so keen to read quickly that they start taking stabs at unfamiliar words and then get a bit tangled up. Always give them a slow out of five in your head before asking if they need help. If they're just racing through and guessing the word as the OP mentioned then say something silly eg make the sound of a car screeching to a halt and request that they reverse or say hold your horses or whatever will make them laugh.

Didn't mean to sound blunt earlier, DS2 posted for me before I'd finished typing shortly before smashing a bowl so have only just noticed how short the post was! Really doesn't sound like you need to worry but it's hard not to when it's your own child!

Op - tired's post earlier re sounding out but doing sound 1-2-3 then 1+2 etc is good advice.

... if she recognises the sound that 'ix' makes at the end of phoenix and she sussed that ph was 'f' in this case she's very nearly there.

I'm just fascinated to know what she's supposed to do with the 'oe' in the middle

I would agree with advice to sound out and blend a syllable at a time and build the word progressively. Lots of practice of this will result in faster L to R blending all through multi-syllable words.

I strongly disagree with looking for 'bits' she knows in random order. Completely destroys the L to R decoding and can easily lead to missing 'bits' out.. Not to mention playing havoc with good L to R eye tracking and the muscles involved.

In context if she is saying ffffff - nix then she has a fighting chance. Or just teach her oe as an option for ee. As you would ai for ay.

Or in fact if she recognises that a word ends with ing then her eyeballs will fall out through incorrect use.

IMHE looking for "bit" frequently leads to guessing words the child knows containing the same "bits".

Recognising f + nix isn't helpful to most children but less so to a child who has never heard of a pheonix

Of course it's much easier to guess words if they are already in your vocabulary [hmmm]

Despite a picture of a phoenix DD had not come across this mythical creature before and so as mentioned she sounded out f/oa/n/i/x, which is an entirely appropriate response to this new word.

Of course I had to help her and explained that in this word ... well this is where phonics hits it's limits for me.

It's great for the vast majority of words but once you start adding in all the rarer correspondences ......

So for the oe spelling alone I've noted:

Joel /oa/

(Is this the only correspondence taught in L&S or the equivalent phonics programmes?) and then

noel /oa/e
poem /oa/i
shoe /oo/
does /u/
doer /oo/er
coelacanth /ee/
oestrogen /e/
toea /oi/

Now obviously the last one is thrown in for fun and to make a point, which is that as an adult I had to Google toea to find out how to pronounce it. No amount of phonics training would have helped with that. My DD sees many new words (that aren't straightforward) just like that.

Is she really supposed to run through all of the possible correspondences that I've listed above when she comes across a word like phoenix? I think not.

Well, the answer is, yes. She is supposed to run through all the possible variations, yes indeed.

But, the problem is that if she doesn't know what a phoenix is, and doesn't know how to pronounce it, then after running through all of the variations that she has been taught, she won't make her any better off

because she still won't know which of them is the right one (if any.)

That information needs to come from someone who already knows the answer.

Which is why phonics (unlike Look & Say) wouldn't expect a child to read those words independently before they had the knowledge to work it out

My usual strategy when she comes across new words that she isn't sure of (no idea if this is the best way, but it is what we do), is to ask her to sound it out, first sound by sound, then in chunks, then try to blend. If there is a group of letters that could have more than one sound, then if it is a sound I think she has done, I ask her to think of different sound she knows for those letters then see which sounds correct. If it is a sound which is new to her I explain that sometimes these letters can make , we sometimes have a giggle about this if it seems like a fairly random correspondence (let's face it, English phonics is often a bit odd!), then get on with blending the word. She had a very good memory so will usually remember this if she comes across the word again. What I want to avoid is her seeing a bit that she recognises, then guessing, because generally she will be wrong (because if it is a word she knows she would be able to read it correctly without guessing, some she doesn't know it there is no chance of her guessing correctly!)

Many to say, she is also quite good at using her vocabulary to work a word out one she is almost there, so for instance with desperate one she had got to saying it how it is written (so the last syllable as ate rather than at), she was able to recognise what word it was and therefore how it is correctly pronounced; is it ok to work like this?

amoeba
coeliac
oestrogen (it's /ee/strogen)
onomatapoeia
phoenix
coelocanth
diarrhoea
oedipal

So frequently encountered by beginning readers...

columngollum and Shrieking Gnawer have clearly never worked with children who have been b*ggered by careless reading instruction.

My 5 year old has encountered 2 already, but that was hardly the point.

My point was that phonics only takes you so far due to the rare correspondences which are there from the get go - beginning readers do encounter eyes, one, two, does, of and busy (for example) early on but are you going to tell them that they should add eye for /igh/ o for /wu/ (not even one of the 44 sounds) wo for /oo/ oe for /u/ or u for /i/ into their toolkit for spelling sound correspondences?

Of course phonics is the best way to teach kids to read BUT our spelling system means that you can't use phonics to read any word ... many words yes, but all words no.

Do you disagree because if you do I may have to throw down the phonics gauntlet and devise a phonics screening check for phonics experts

Your child's school reading books contain the words amoeba
coeliac, oestrogen, onomatapoeia, phoenix, coelocanth, diarrhoea, oedipal!

and yes I disagree

I think one of DSs school books may have had coelocanth in it - but he wouldn't have been able to work that out by looking at the picture, at least he had soem chance with phonics.
The others, hmm, they could be interesting pictures to guess from

L&S don't give children coeliac, oestrogen, onomatapoeia, phoenix, coelocanth, diarrhoea, oedipal

and say don't come back till you've read them all!

They may not all cuddle up and practice digraphs together but they do have some sense of the possible!

No Look & Say gives children coelocanth and says what do you think that word is ... look at the picture ... child says fish teacher says well done