Do children who are ahead in primary school, get bored in yrs 7,8 and 9?

[Runoutofideas]

This is a genuine question - not a boast, I promise....

My dd1 is currently in yr3. She has achieved "low level 4" in reading and maths and at parents' evening her teacher mentioned being "on target" for taking level 6 papers in yr 6. While I am glad she is clearly doing well, what happens when they go on to senior school? At this rate she should be sitting GCSEs aged 12/13 which clearly she won't be doing. Is there a risk that if they are pushed too fast at primary school, then the first few years at secondary just go over what they already know? If so, what is the best approach?

She certainly shouldn't be- remember that there will be lots of new subjects in secondary school- and almost all secondary schools set, so she should be with other clever children. But it's certainly something you need to think about-!look carefully at the league tables for your chosen sceondary- find out what they do with their high achievers.

Also remember that children don't necessarily make linear progress- she might plateau for a bit before zooming ahead again,

No!
Secondary school do not "just go over what they already know", the present NC is based on repetition, but repetition with pushing further ahead each year. Also the levels are not measuring quite the same things at secondary as at primary.

Getting a 4c in year 3 whilst very good is not that exceptional (cf. the boy who achieved a GCSE in Maths in year 3). So schools should be well prepared for pupils with this degree of "brightness". You may want to look at bigger schools where she may have more chance to have find other pupils who think like her.

However do also praise her for hard work, not just being smart.

I think it depends on the child and the school. My ds found the lessons boring but he was GCSE level for Maths when he started y7 and the other subjects didn't really stretch him either but he enjoyed school because he enjoyed being with his friends and the sports and extra curricular activities.
I suspect other schools may have done differently and done it better but ds was an oddity really.
Dd on the other hand who was a high achiever wasn't unduly bored but she has a totally different personality to ds and didn't have the exceptional ability he had either.

Dd1 was L6 sats in year 6, and has gone to a standard comp. She hasn't been bored as a general rule and most of her levels are round about L7 excapt for new subjects.
What she does find boring is some of the silly behaviour of some of the members of the class.

I would have thought it would be difficult for a child who takes a modicum of responsibility for their own work to be bored across the line in secondary: many of the subjects are of a nature where there really is no ceiling, no limits apart from your own natural ability.

In history or English literature or geography or any of the essay writing subjects, there would be nothing to stop you from doing advanced research and writing an essay of PhD level quality; teachers aren't going to be hovering anxiously above you to tell you you mustn't read more books or think more deeply about your subject. The sky is the limit.

In PSHE or RS or citizenship the learning experience is going to be very much about the quality of the classroom discussion: again that will depend very much on what your dd and her peers choose to make of it. My ds is pretty lazy, but he still watches Al-Jazeera every day and uses that in classroom discussions.

As for her foreign language/s, once she has been introduced to the basics of grammar, there will be nothing to stop her from picking up a book and a dictionary in the evenings and running with it.

Maths might be more of a problem, if the top set is not very advanced, but there are often opportunities for enrichment programmes. And even if that does prove too easy, that is one subject out of 14 or so: it would hardly make for overall boredom.

In secondary school, learning is far more about independence and taking responsibility for yourself. They are growing up.

Thank you very much. All of the comments seem make a lot of sense. I am only just starting to consider secondary education, as she's only 8. It was just that her school report made me consider how it will work in the future, as it stated levels, and where that level was in comparison with national expectation. (I haven't had this information for her before...)

How can you tell from the league tables, which schools actually do well by their more able students? Surely they will all claim to do so, if asked?

The Ofsted report does comment on that (it is a criteria), and they have a lot of data to form their judgement. Otherwise look at the % A/A*s. Also talk to the school, even better talk to her primary school. By the end of year 4 you could ask to speak to the Head and see if they have any advice on secondaries, in a verbal "off the record" discussion they may be able to give some candid advice. But remember its a complex decision and you know your child best.

Have a look at the league tables on the Department of Education website, as these now include information about how well children across three ability groups achieve at each secondary school. You will be able to see a value added score for the 'high achiever' group, and details of how many children achieve the Ebacc too.

If you choose a big secondary school there is every likelihood that your DD will be grouped with pupils of similar ability. The top set at our school are working at L7/L8 and are certainly not bored.

Sorry should have clarified, working at L7/L8 in Y8 (mixed ability Y7).

Also here's a link to those performance tables.

Thank you all - very helpful.

I think you also have to realise that children that appear to be ahead in primary may not be the ones that are ahead in secondary as they start to be measured on other criteria ie analytical skills instead of just reading, writing and maths and as others have said there will be top sets full of children who perform just as well or better.

When my DS took his year 3 sats (last year) he got 4c in all subjects - the teacher failed to tell me that the highest level possible for the tests that he took was 4c (so I didn't know if he could have achieved higher). I actually spoke to my SIL who is a primary teacher and she got my ds to do the higher level test, just for info purposes, and he got 4a for maths and reading and 4b for writing.
Level 4c is well above average, but is not exceptional, probably in the top 5% nationally if they manage 4c in all the tested subjects areas.
Did the school tell you which level of tests she took and whether they think your dd could have got a higher level on a more challenging test?
As for the original question - research repeatedly shows that children who are not sufficiently challenged academically in the primary years are more likely to get bored, resist challenge in the secondary years and fail to reach their potential. So I would concentrate on making sure that she is sufficiently stretched and challenged now and I'm sure she will do just fine at secondary level.

DD2 no she got SATs results that let her go straight into the top sets.

DD1 got very very fed up in maths because they put her in set 3 redoing L4. Complicated fuck up, involving the dyslexia/poor working memory unfriendly nature of SATs and CATs.

Understanding concepts and being able to do arithmetic and recall your tables quickly are not the same thing.

They have gradually sorted it out and I wouldn't be surprised if they both fetch up with an A at GCSE.

So to answer your question OP, in general brighter DCs are fine at secondary, setting, new subjects and new friends keep them busy. But it can take time for school to get to know very bright DCs and awkward critters like DD1.

This is all quite reassuring - thank you.

Runningchick - I have no idea what test she sat. Not sure how I can ask that question without sounding like I think she should have been marked higher.... which I don't, by the way!

She's not bored currently - enjoys school hugely, in fact. I just want this to continue for as long as possible!

BTW - according to our local league tables, the private schools all get 100% of their higher attainers 5 x A-Cs. The state schools typically get that for 92-94% of their higher attainers. It worries me that they seem to not manage to get up to 8% of their able children fairly standard grades.... I would have thought that most children, without special needs, should be able to get 5 x A-c at GCSE with decent teaching, not just the most able, or is that desperately naïve?

No. It's a completely different ballgame. Different teachers, different depth level, different level of working, allowing for much more self-powered work.
And on top of that, I can't think of a Year 7 i've ever welcomed that has had ANY of the levels correct. We quite often get students assessed at L6,7,or 8 when they clearly are not, we end up having to explain to parents that in fact they are a 4, or 5. Inflated levels at the end of primary has always been a problem.

Our local comp gets 30% pass rate at grades A-C...
I think it very unlikely 70% have special needs.

As for the sets and ending up in the right set, it is worth remembering, once again, that your dd will be an awful lot older and more able to take responsibility for herself: if she thinks she is in the wrong set it will be her job to go and see the Head of Year and ask what kind of knowledge she has to demonstrate to move up. There really is a big difference between an 8yo and an 11/12yo.

You also have to understand that some children have specific problems with Maths or English, and may really struggle to get that exam pass. Eg. my DS got A* for Maths, good grades for 3 seperate Sciences etc. BUT is struggling still to get the magic C grade in English. He is dyslexic, he just finds putting things into words very very hard (and that is with extra time and the use of a computer).

As a secondary teacher its a bizarre phenomenon. They come in year 7 bright as pennies and super keen.

Then they enter puberty.... start forgetting pens but bringing hair straighteners.... role models change - engineers, inventors and composers become boring and stuff like Geordie shore and that Essex thing takes over their lives. The lads spray Lynx Africa like its a magic potion and there are no consequences worth changing behaviour for.

its really hard.

But I do love them :) ANd they come through it.... and have learnt stuff really.