When term time holiday is not authorised...

[Lukethe3]

....how do you politely tell the school you are going anyway? An email on the Monday morning or a letter? Or do I just tell the class teacher?

I have only read to end of page 1 so not sure if anyone has actually answered your OP since then but what I did was write to the Head and say something like "Thank you very much for considering our request for term-time leave. I appreciate that you are unable to authorise this leave but we have decided to take XXXX out anyway. I do apologise for any inconvenience this may cause you" etc.

Faster you sound very proud of your DP and if he is committed to his work that's lovely - people should be passionate about their job.

But... here's the thing ... every year loads of teachers come on to these threads and quietly admit that they don't actually mind if kids go off on holiday for a week as long as they are a) primary school or b) first two years at secondary school AND it isn't an exam or assessment period.

I am much more concerned about the kid who misses a day here and there every week than the child who brings me in a note saying the family are going skiing for a week in January. So are most teachers tbh. Your DP has his opinion on this and if he's in SLT he will be facing the tick box pressures. But there will be minimal impact on most children if they go on holiday in term time unless their parents are stupid enough to take them away during GCSEs etc (yes, I have seen this happen morons )

Holidays can be educational - take them in holiday time.
Seeing family is important. You have 13 weeks and every weekend to do this.
Flights are expensive - save. Thats like saying 'I cant afford to see my family in Canada so you have to pay me more cos otherwise its well unfair.'

No missing a week probably wont disrupt the child's education so much in KS2 (KS1 I would argue it would because of phonics), still incredibly irritating as a teacher that you have to dedicate your time to a child when you should be with others for genuine educational purposes not 'I haven't done mixed to improper fractions cos the week you did that I was in Florida' child grins happily, all other children instantly dislike this child for saying this and getting the undivided attention of the teacher

If you genuinely think holidays are more educational than school then home ed. To say this when you chose to send your child to state school is disrespectful in the extreme and frankly unbelieveable. Your child would learn to read and write if they spent all their time on holiday would they? No? Then this comment is meaningless.

The reason you shouldnt take term time off is because its against the rules. It doesnt matter that its just one day or one week of whatever. You wouldn't (or shouldnt) skive off work just because you felt like it so why tell your children that this is ok?

passthetwiglets is right about writing a letter. Saying that they could fine you. Can't you arrange a sit down to discuss their initial response? Ask them to demonstrate why it will impact on the kids and explain what you are going to do to offset that (see my post below).

Not sure if OP is referring to secondary or primary. However, as a volunteer in a primary I see half the time they are just arsing about to be honest, doing touchy feely stuff or a bit of art etc. Genuine hard core learning is quite limited in time. Nothing that can't be caught up on. If a parent commits to teach 'fractions' say while away - then what the hell.

However, as a volunteer in a primary I see half the time they are just arsing about to be honest, doing touchy feely stuff or a bit of art etc. Genuine hard core learning is quite limited in time.

Yeah this ^ reveals that you have absolutely no understanding of how children develop and learn so I wont both responding to your other equally incorrect comments.

The reason you shouldnt take term time off is because its against the rules. It doesnt matter that its just one day or one week of whatever. You wouldn't (or shouldnt) skive off work just because you felt like it so why tell your children that this is ok?

But it isn't against the rules if the head teacher authorises it. There is a distinction.

FAster, hve you any idea how patronising and unpleasant you are coming across on this thread?

Jinsei I meant if it isnt. Parents seem to think the 10 allowed days are a right and that if a Head doesnt authorise it then they're just being difficult. They are for exceptional circumstances, not cheap flights.

twiglets OP here. Thanks for that, I will copy and paste into my letter. My son is in Reception by the way.

I never asked for permission. I just wrote a letter, Dear , Ds will not be in school . Yours, Modre.

It was never for more than a couple of days tagged on to the start of a school summer holiday, and as far as I'm concerned, if its my child it's up to me as long at attendance is fine for the rest of the year.

wellthen, I agree that there is no automatic right to ten authorised days, or indeed, to any other time off during term-time. However, for some families on very low incomes, the cost difference between term-time and school holidays might make the difference between having a holiday or not. And in some circumstances, the head might judge that the child would benefit more from a family holiday than from a few days in school. I think it's right for the head to have that discretion.

For us, saving a couple of hundred quid isn't the issue, but I would prioritise my dd's right to see her grandmother, even if the head said no. I make no apology for that.

My son goes to a grammar and I home educate. The two are not mutually exclusive.

For parents in NI, Heads differ in stance and strictness, the DENI guidelines to parents are

In very exceptional circumstances schools may authorise a family holiday for example when it may be judged to important to the well-being and cohesion of the family, following serious or terminal illness, bereavement, or other traumatic events

Perhaps this is as a result of the heightened likelihood of traumatic events here or simply a common sense approach to the mental health needs of families as a whole when a crisis hits.

The thing is, most teachers and heads have a common sense approach to this and tend to act accordingly. AT Our school, i think because its a church school, a letter has to be sent to the governers. It is accepted that holidays will not be authorised. But at the end of the day, i do not care what it says on paper. I DO care about my child's education and would actually exercise my own discretion on whether or not i feel taking a holiday is going to have a detrimental effect. I would base this on things such as - the time of year when the absence was to take place, what the teacher recommended unofficially of course, how much school had already been missed and the year group my DD is in.

As someone said upthread, more worrying are the children who are kept of school if they sneeze ( i know a set of excellent parents who ran into trouble with the school because they were so protective of their DS that they kept him off school at the drop of a hat), those with parents who can't be arsed to send them so if they get up late, etc they don't attend. Or who regularly let them have time off during the week for dubious reasons.

We had a lovely holiday on the isle of wight last year, it wasn't about cheap flights, the holiday cost us nothing (apart from tesco vouchers) and it it simply wasn't available during school holidays. We hadn't been away for nearly 4 years and we NEEDED the break, my DD needed to spend time with her Dad and we needed the time together as a family. WE have lots of lovely memories and my DD will remember that week im sure for a long time. We wont make a habit of it, especially as she is getting older now but i am so glad we did it and her schooling has suffered, not one jot. Oh, unless you count the unauthorised absence listed on a piece of paper somewhere that will mean absolutely bugger all to DD whatsoever, at any time.

Lukethe3 - have a wonderful holiday, he is in reception - he doesn't even legally have to be in school until after his 5th birthday, you could have kept him off the whole year Just write the letter, im sure the school will understand (if they have an ounce of common sense)

I have just applied for DD (Y1) to have 3 days off to attend her grandmother's wedding abroad. The wedding is on a Thursday morning. Unreasonable?

These threads occur every year and opinion is always divided.

My children have excellent attendance - luckily have robust health

I do not have a great deal of choice over holidays - which have to be booked a year in advance and balance the needs of service (24 hour service care) , likewise my husband (who works for a different hospital).

Last year the only way we could have a family holiday (in other words get the same leave) was for DD2 to miss the last week of summer term. A week she was unlikely to do much (lots of games playing and treats etc), she was not leaving the school so not missing last times with friends, had already had changeover day with next year teacher.

I spoke to the headteacher - whilst she would not approve the leave, she thoroughly understood why we were going and wished us a happy holiday. I do not regret the decision.

Can we not just all accept that:

• parents have different views on term-time absence

-teachers have different views on term-time absence

• primary legislation allows scope for schools to decide policy on this

-there may be guidance that differs from. la to la

Our school have a nice little policy leaflet, this states schools do have the right to grant up to 10 school days leave for the purposes of an annual family holiday but that in most cases leave will be refused. Some examples of exceptional holidays it gives:

Parent, grandparent or close relative is seriously ill and the proposed holiday is likely to be the last such holiday; following significant trauma in the family with the headteacher considering that an immediate holiday might enable the child concerned to better deal with the situation; a one-off occasion which can only take place at the time requested.

The leaflet does state leave is unlikely to be authorised if the child's average attendance is below 95%. Also states if the leave is granted it will be for the purpose of an annual family holiday - i.e. a single period of absence occurring once in the year, rather than a series of long weekends.

And to the OP, i would send a note to teacher saying x will be off next week, we will practice reading/ maths, we dont expect or require additional catch up tuition when we get home.

Hope you have a lovely break.

At one stage, DH worked for a line manager and his line manager who were (to put it politely) absolute wankers.

They both had school age children. When the company holiday calendar was published they would both 'bag' virtually the entire school holiday period. They implemented a policy that no more than one member of the team could be off at any one time. As they both had six weeks' leave per year, that meant (between them) twelve weeks' school holiday time gone.

DH got the dregs. As he was lowest in the pecking order, he had to ask them for time off. His holiday requests were never granted.

He found another job. Whilst it is most unchristian of me, I was smugly satisfied when the company went into administration and both of them ended up receiving government statutory redundancy payments.

Luckily, we didn't have school age children at the time. However, as a teacher this 'policy' meant that DH and I really struggled to get a holiday together.

There are lots of people who work in organisations where they cannot be guaranteed leave that corresponds with school holidays. Stupid rules like seniority and 'numbers of staff off' mean that some parents can't necessarily get school holiday time off - despite their best intentions.

Presumably, based on some of the opinions on here, they shouldn't be allowed a family holiday?

We took my stepchildren on 'holiday' after their mother died - that was authorised. My stepdaughter is now dying and we'll take her brother away on 'holiday' afterwards too. I expect that to be authorised. Faster, you seem unwilling to see that a holiday can actually be necessary in exceptional circumstances. I was planning this post as I read, and was interested to see that NI explicitly recognises this is issue.

Stiffy I'm really sorry to hear about your situation. How awful for you all.

Of course you are entitled to a holiday, they are absolutely necessary under these circumstances.

Thank you. I didn't mean to post for sympathy but I was a bit irked by the suggestion that holidays are always frivolous.

What radical says

I have little flexibility in my job. Bosses bag all school holidays and I have exacting month deadlines. DH is self employed so holiday is always hard to take. On the outside, we may seem affluent. Truth is, every penny is accounted for and if we can scrabble enough money together for a holiday, it HAS to coincide with our childminders holiday as these are the only weeks in a year we don't pay CM fees. And of course our CM takes her hols in term time because its cheaper.

If we didn't take hols in term time, then there would be no holidays. Where are your childhood memories from? Bet you remember EVERY holiday but not every term in school.

We have had one week hols in last three years.