What would you think if approx' 8% of the school left in one term?

[AngiBolen]

In a 400+ primary.

All children from "nice" families. Some of them being children of governors, teachers and TA's who work in the school?

(8% is my approximation - I know 14 children left last week, and others have left gradually over the past term)

That some 'nice' secondary school has shifted its catchement or some rubbish has been spread about how kids from x school 'never get in'.

Personally, if you know the parents, which you seem to, I would ask them. Its hardly a secret. Especially those who work at the school, surely they know there will be questions. They may tell you 'none of you business' buts that up to them.

This does seem like a lot more children than I would expect to leave in the middle of the academic year. What are they giving as the reason and which schools are they moving to?

It's definitely nothing to do with secondary schools.

The only two parents I've spoken to say it's due to lack of progress their child is making.

My DC are in before/after school club, so I rarely see the staff/other parents to speak to. One of the reasons I know about some of the children leaving was the "thank you and goodbye" cards from children displayed in after school club.

The secretary is not one for mincing words or keeping quiet about her workload, which is how I know about 14 DC in one week.

I think this happens a lot in Edinburgh with the children moving to independents. Could they be doing that if it is an affluent catchment?

Something rather odd, but need more info.
I wouldn't want to work in school where my DC are, though, they could be finding the difficulties in that too much.

You really need to get pissed with one of the TAs whose children hasn't left & asked her what's going on.

Some of the DC seem to be moving to good/outstanding village schools. Others are just going to their local school (this is a Catholic school, which parents originally shipped their DC into).

lljkk, I did try that with one person who works in the school, who hasn't moved her child...but this person is standing 100% being the school, was giving out no info, and repeatedly stated "We are going nowhere."

Good for her!
Unless you are concerned about your own children I wouldn't worry. They may have been having problems that your child is not having.

I do have minor concerns about my DC, nothing enough to make me change schools yet, though.

I'm just finding it all very worrying.

DS went to a private nursery which was very academic. Well, as 'academic' as a bunch of 4 year olds can be :)

So it was a bit of an adjustment when we realized, after a month of Year R, that DS wasn't going to be pushed academically. We sought the advice of a friend who was a visiting music teacher at the local schools and she said that this was fairly typical of state primaries where it's all about nurturing rather than academic excellence.

At first I would whinge to the other mums about the lack of homework and how the pace of DS's learning was dictated by the slowest kids. There were only a few sympathetic ears but most of the mum's seemed happy with the school.

In our case the only option available to us was to extra stuff at home. I would imagine if I and a couple of the other disgruntled moms had the option we would have moved our kids.

Is it possible that the school isn't as academic as these other parents would like and that is why they are jumping ship? If that is the case then as long as you think that the school serves the needs of your DC then I wouldn't let it worry you.

IME, significant changes in the balance of children arriving and leaving a school have been linked to a significant (if gradual) decline in standards at the school.

In the cases I know of, the sizes of the schools concerned have declined by almost half in the course of 2 years, and have been followed by the schools being placed in Special Measures.

I would keep a close eye on how your own child is getting on, both in terms of academic standards and socially. If the school is in an area where many schools are over-subscribed, the children leaving may be replaced by children who cannot find places elsewhere (ie it can become the school-of-last-resort), which may change the 'balance' of the intake considerably. Research other options, so that you don't feel 'trapped' if significant problems do occur, and have a Plan B ready.

I would be wondering why. I was very concerned when half the teachers left my dd's school at the end of the first year under a new head. I should have shipped out then in hindsight. Things went rapidly downhill in the next year with governors, pta members, and after school club organisers all resigning. School was miserable, did was very unhappy and made no progress despite being bright and reportedly working hard. I'd do everything you can to find out what is going on.

Fortunately that head resigned from dd's school, rumour has it before she was pushed, and we now have a great new one who has really turned things around. I still feel guilty about dd's lost year though. If alarm bells are ringing then pay attention.

Reasons I've seen this happen:

• eye on next school and getting up the admissions ranking
• moving to private
• moving to private with view of getting into grammar at 11
• parents didn't want this school in the first place and are biding their time waiting for a place to come up at their preferred school
• the school has just had a bad Ofsted (regardless of whether the parents were happy before)

I would wonder why but as long as my child was happy and learning that's all I would do.

We had a poor OFSTED and lots of parents jumped ship only to regret it when they couldn't get back into the school because places had been filled.

I know of 3 schools where this happened.
In the 1st, Parents learned that the awful yr 3 teacher would have their DCs again for yr 4 and half the year left for private or other faith schools. A weak new head didn't help matters. There had been efforts to get rid of that teacher , head went off sick with stress and guess who took over?
In the 2nd, a new head in a very academic prep decided to 'weed out' about 1/3 of the DCs in yr 5. Many more left because the atmosphere became so bad.
In the 3rd, it got round that very few in yr 6 has gained places at grammar/ selective indies under a new teacher and yrs 4 and 5 emptied out.It was a high achieving and very middle class state school and it sank like a stone.
There's no smoke without fire.

The minor concerns you have, are they very specific to your children or could they be a widespread problem?

redskyatnight yes, the school has recently had a poor OFSTED, but really no worse than the previous OFSTED. New head is a bit of a wally. Parents haven't warmed to him as he's reluctant to engage with parents/children, delegating that side of things to the deputy. I think everybody was hoping he would ensure the school was good, which he obviously hasn't.

My concern with DD is her lack of progress, which although her teacher acknowledges, doesn't seem at all interested in. I'm guessing this is a common theme.

Only time I've witnessed this is when I worked at a secondary school. It had a poor OFSTED and went into special measures. Lots of children left, as did many staff. TBH I don't think anyone regretted it. I (was a teacher at time) left a couple years after but wished I had left far earlier tbh.

What I wonder is has the ofsted perhaps highlighted a wider issue which chimes with parents' own feelings about their child?

This can lead to bulk transfers, as parents previously thought it was just their kid or just a blip, then Ofsted report highlights a school problem over that issue.

Did Ofsted highlight kids make below expected progress? Because maybe loads of parenTs were wondering about this and then realised it might not be down t the child not being motivated?

AngiBolen - move your DD.

I say this as a parent who moved DSs from a small private school where children were just not progressing fast enough and teachers were like yours 'not interested'..A lovely school in so many ways but just not covering the ground. Many other parents have since followed us.

Honestly a poor Ofsted and you are actually already concerned about progress - it really is not going to get better. The parents with children who are leaving are the well informed 'nice' ones (ie pushy, professional and ambitious) as well as insiders like teachers, TA, Governors.

I dont think you need any more information.

Morebeta - you have said clearly what I was hinting at...

I would say that a child failing to make progress, if you have a viable option elsewhere, is a sufficiently serious alarm bell to start thinking about a Plan B.

In one of the cases I refer to above, i was teaching at a neighbouring school, who received many of the exodus. Even those who had been thought 'more able' by the previous school were a long way below where we would have expected ... I think that the oarents had thought they were OK because they were 'ahead of their peers' / 'on the top table' / 'everyone says he's bright' but a comparison with children in similar schools would have showed that they were way behind IYSWIM (hard to tell, sometimes, though - their NC levels seemed OK, and that was what the parents saw, but on inter-school moderation they were found to be significantly inflated).

Excuse truly terrible spelling / grammar. Spent some time trying to anonymise [sp?] and ended up with some howlers!

I would be leaning the same way as MoreBeta and looking at other options.

YellowandGreen - x posted with you but yes I agree with your theory about the Ofsted precipitating a 'final straw' decision by a group of parents who probably already had doubts and may well have been talking to each other for some time (ie well informed ones).

Interesting that the teachers, TA and Governors would have had this info earlier than most parents and have been among those moving.

We ignored an Ofsted with a few red flags and we kept getting told we were 'unreasonable' when we complained and that 'no other parent was saying the thinsg we were saying'. In fact it turned out there were a lot of us complaining and we were all being told the same thing once we started comparing notes.

Yes we were in the well informed 'nice' (ie pushy, professional and ambitious) parent group. Sometimes you have to be.