Learning to read in Y1 & Y2

[learnandsay]

How unusual is it for a primary school to focus its attention in YR on teaching the letter sounds, maybe some digraphs, perhaps one or two trigraphs (or maybe not even) and learning (whatever that means) lists of HFW, but not to any great extent turn attention to reading actual books (of any kind)?

And the school thereby, presumably, places the emphasis of learning to read books (of whatever kind) onto Y1 and beyond? And, if one's school has such a system how does one approach it if one's child already reads books quite well and has done throughout Reception? Getting the Reception teacher up to speed with the child's reading has taken a while, but it's getting there. Does one expect to have to introduce every teacher at every early years level to the child's ability to read?

mrz, that's exactly what I understand to be 'reading'.

These last few posts have made me realise that learnsay and I seem to have very different understandings of what 'reading' means.

In my experience the vast majority of reception children can "read" more difficult texts when supported by an adult and lots can "learn" their school reading books if they read it over and over but I wouldn't call either of those groups "readers"

DD has the confidence to try quite tough books (not saying she will get them right!!)

She definately does not "learn" her school book as she refuses to read it more than maybe twice (3 if lucky) as she then knows the story and wants to read something else.

We read her school book last night and will read it again tomorrow night and the teacher will listen to her on thurs and change it.

But there are kids I read with who "learn" their books and turn over 2 pages by accident and recite the page before from memory....

Hence the need for the middle ground. Books she can do without help or perhaps help with a few words, say max 4 or 5. Help of any sort. You open your mouth you are helping. :-). Start with the easiest books, keep going until you find the level where you have to open your mouth. Probably what school will do, possibly a bit more sophisticated :-).

That was for las by the way..

hmmm, I think you girls have a concern that I don't share. I'm not an examiner. I'm a parent. I'm interested in teaching my daughter to read, (not to do phonics, not to pass tests, not to read independently..not..not..not) There may be an indefinite number of skills associated with reading which numerous people are greatly concerned with. But I'm not.

I just want my daughter to read and to love doing it, which seems to be going well so far.

If Mr Gove wants to test her on phonics at some point, fine. If a parent helper, a TA a teacher or some other person (who isn't me) wants to give her a comprehension test at some point then fine. If somebody for no apparent reason wants to know if she can decode the word strawberry, then fine.

Let them do it.

I would say that reading independently is 'reading'. Reading with help is reading with help. School will be looking to teach and assess the former. You are doing the latter and calling it reading.

This seem to be the font of the disproportionate angst you experience about Floppy's Phonics.

We don't know that, do we? Floppy phonics was all she was getting. Now she's reading Ginn with parent helpers and doing fine by their comment in the diary.

What you're saying is a bit like feeding a rabbit exclusively on onions and then saying, that's curious. This rabbit likes eating onions!!!

Yes, we do know that EYFS assesses independent learning...

Yes, but the EYFS doesn't specify which scheme books a school uses.

How is that relevant?

The EYFS assesses in terms of independent learning. Some 4 year olds are independent readers without having been near a reading scheme book. Most use them as stepping stones to independent reading.

We're talking about independent reading, are we not, not the benefits/demerits of particular reading schemes?

It's relevant because you brought it up!

Neither you nor I know what my daughter can or can't read independently, (although it seems to be a great issue for you.) You don't know because you've never read with her. And I don't know because when she's with me she's not independent.

There will be other people out there who are reading with my daughter who have a chance of finding this out. But they've got to use a range of materials in order to calculate what she can read, or they'll be misled into thinking that she can only read what they've given her. They won't know whether or not she can read other things because they won't have tried them.

It seems that the teacher has recently worked this out because that's precisely what she has been doing for the past week, (not the nine previous weeks.) It doesn't seem as though the teacher has got the right combination yet. But she will get there eventually, (hopefully.)

I didn't bring up reading schemes - I brought up the difference between independent reading and helping a child to read and pointed out that schools teach and assess the former.

Yes you did. You were talking about my view of the ORT ones. Re-read your recent posts.

In the context of the disparity between your view of reading and that of the EYFS...

And I hold my view that ORT books need to be treated as a mere stepping stone to skip across rather than a source of angst in their own right, if a child is 'reading' a range of material at school and home...

You don't know my view of reading. This "argument" is stupid.

Ok so what IS your view of reading LandS? You've posted so many times on this subject that I think even you have probably confused yourself. So maybe you should simplify exactly what it IS you want and what your view on it all is

You seem to think you have all the answers anyway and ignore/argue with what I view as helpful posts

I'd head for the nearest dictionary if I was you, numbum.

I agree. When learnsay asked a set of questions. Posters respond in a variety of helpful and varied ways. learnsay twists herself up in knots, ignores anything she disagrees with and repeats herself.

I'm not having an argument with you learnsay. I'm just pointing out that your dd's teacher will be teaching and assessing independent reading, whilst you are doing something very different with your dd. This difference seems to be the source of your frustrations with the school.

You don't know what the teacher is doing. You're assuming.

In fact everything you've typed is an assumption.

If you have a point to make please make the point. But please don't make personal comments about me in my thread.

If you have an argument to make make it. I'd rather we didn't recover old ground. I found previous comments unhelpful. If you have new or different suggestions do put them.

It isn't 'your' thread, learnandsay - that's ridiculous. You can't control the way a discussion goes, unless you think they have broken MN guidelines, in which case you report posts to MNHQ. It's a forum - the discussion flows.

Making personal comments about the OP suggests logical weakness. Someone with a good argument simply makes it.

Well, I think there will a very small number (1?) who will not assume that the teacher will want to assess and teach your daughter to read independently.

When children are in the beginning stages of reading they require more help with sounding out, but once they have got the basics they normally follow levelled books so that they can gain confidence and skill as an independent reader. At home they may tackle harder books where an adult helps them and this will be up to the parent/child to decide on. I guess this may happen at school too, but generally not, perhaps only when the teacher is seeing how the child copes with the next level and whether they are ready for it- ie can manage 95% independently.

I think this is the way it works and most people buy into. If you don't then fair enough but please stop posting quite critical comments about school reading level and going round in circles as it is a little maddening .

The school informed us that no assessment of our children's reading would take place until after the first half term. The teacher also told me at parents' evening that she was aware that the books that she was giving my daughter were too easy.

Some contributors are posting assessments in the thread without being in possession of the facts and then are getting upset when those assessments aren't being accepted.