Security of primary school site - advice

[CoronationWigeon]

My DD starts in Reception at the local primary school this September. I was surprised to see that the main gate into the playground (which is the main entrance to the school) is not on a buzzer - you just lift the latch and go in. It's not locked during the school day either. The latch is too high and heavy for the children to open, but any adult can open it.

When I was there recently, it was a hot day, and several of the classroom doors were wide open, opening directly onto the playground, so in theory a stranger could walk straight into the playground and into the school building itself. Even when the doors to the actual building are closed, a stranger could walk in the playground and right up to the building.

Is this normal? The other schools we visited all had a buzzer system where you had to ring to be let in (when it wasn't start / end of the school day). Does Ofsted have any particular requirements here?

I was particularly because I know another nearby school has recently just changed various things to do with its three entrances / exits in order to make it more secure, and they are all already on a buzzer.

Our primary was like this until a couple of years ago but is now completely surrounded by a 8 foot fence with security gates and a buzzer entrance - however whilst it would stop someone randomly wandering into a classroom if someone really wanted to get in it wouldn't stop them.

Thanks for replies - no, not a village school - right in the middle of a suburban area of a middle-sized town. Hm...

What are you expecting a stranger to do once in the building?
The liklihood of anything untoward happening are very small.

Dd's school has one of three gates open all day, but you then have to buzz into office, to get into actual school. I. Theory it would be possible to go in through open gate on a hot day and walk round to back of the school where classroom doors are open and gain access.

In reality you would be spotted pretty quickly by someone either visually or monitoring CCTV.

I am happy with this, surely anyone wanting to gain access for dodgy reasons would either make up an excuse to get through buzzer operated gate it would turn up at pick up drop off when gates are open?

No, I really do appreciate that the likelihood of something happening is tiny. I am really not someone who sees danger round every corner. But when a school is frankly less secure than my own house, it seems a bit odd that I'll be leaving DD there for most of the day.

Also, the open classrooms are directly opposite the unsecured gate, about 20m across the playground, rather than tucked away around the back.

As long as you are comfortable that you dc cant get out, I'm not really sure what your problem is. My dc school sounds like a similar set up - there are two main gates that are close during school hours, but easily opened. I went to the school last week and waved to my dd because she was sitting by an opened door. It would still be very difficult for me to pick her up and run off with her without anyone noticing.

But the likelihood of any child been alone is remote. I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but there is a danger of turning schools into prisons.

Also, I'd like to add that I didn't go to the school to wave at my dd, I did need to go there for another reason.

Our catchment area school has no barriers to its playing fields, playgrounds, etc, you can just walk straight into them. But you cannot enter the school building itself. And it's a metro/urban, larger than average primary school, according to ofstead.

Ok, this is reassuring - I didn't know whether it was the only school in England which didn't have a buzzer (although still slightly concerned about overtherooftop's post). No way DD would be able to escape, so that's good.

Am trying to separate legitimate worries about starting school from PFB-itis , so thank you for replies!

I think it's a bit odd. Our school isn't great on security but has a buzzer. We recently had an intruder in the school who walked in behind a parent, the moral being:

a) a buzzer won't prevent intruders necessarily but
b) there are such people out there and you don't want them getting unduly easy access to your school.

We don't know what "our" intruder was after. A teacher intercepted him and threw him out. But it was not good.

One of the things I love about our school is that it doesn't have a buzzer at the gate. That said, there is a decent height metal fence, and the only access to the 'inner' school - and the classrooms - is via a Lobby which is manned at all times by the office staff. The door from the Lobby into the main school is usually on a safety lock thingy, too.

But anyone can walk into the Lobby. Which, personally, I really like - and we have not ever had a problem.

they probably need to look at it, as I understand that security and safeguarding are something ofsted look at!

It doesn't sound very safe to me. My worry would be if an adult entered/exited the school via the gate but didn't close it properly behind them (or is it self-closing?).

The footpaths to the classrooms at DDs school have locked gates during the day (unlocked at drop off and pick up time). The rest of the time all visitors just wander freely into reception - although they need to be buzzed through from reception in the actual school.

I am really swaying from thinking "don't be silly, it's fine, you're over-reacting" to wondering if actually it's not acceptable: tiny risk of anything happening, but mightily bad consequences if it does...

This isn't about people just being able to get into the playground (but locked out from the school), this is about people being able to walk straight from the main gate directly into at least 3 classrooms opposite (when their doors are open in summer), a short distance away from the gate.

My dd's school - you can enter the playground, which is the entrance to the school. When children are in the playground then there are staff with them. To get into the building, they have to be 'buzzed' in by Reception, or walk though a firedoor and into a classroom where they clearly would be spotted by someone!
You have to get a balance between the site being relatively secure and not turning it into some kind of prison environment.

One of our schools is like this but with all the latches, hinges and bolts it takes ages to open and close them. The other has locked gates and a main door with a buzzer which is a lot quicker and easier to enter. Both are very secure sites without resembling prisons :)

There has to be some realism about this, so a main gate with a mechanism that is not easily opened by pupils will be OK. What needs to be considered is what normally happens with visitors? Do they go to a visible main entrance, sign in and get a visitors badge? If so having the outside doors open in the hot weather would probably be considered OK as every pupil and staff member should know that any official visitor will have a badge and any that don't need to be challenged. If however there is no proper system for entry to the school then I would as a school inspector in Wales be minded to say that is not appropriate and there is an insecure site whether the classroom doors were open or not.

Thank you for the replies .

Admission - I have been to the school two or three times (as a prospective parent and then last week as a new parent) and have never been asked to sign in or wear a badge. There is a buzzer from the entrance lobby into the main school (which is round the side of the school from the main gate, but that's no good if the classroom doors are open directly into the playground, facing the main gate.

In fact, on the visit I had last week (which was an open session for new Reception parents and children (starting this Sept) to visit the school whilst in session), I did announce myself at the main entrance buzzer, but I could have just wandered in through the classroom doors. And in fact when I did walk through to the classrooms, no one asked me who I was or what I was doing (although I did have DD1, 4yrs and DD2, 13 months) in tow, so I didn't look very threatening! And it was at the time of the scheduled visit. Although perhaps that makes security even more important because you have all sorts of people coming and going). The whole building is completely open plan too (2 form infants school), so once you are in, you are in to the entire school.

I DO know that any possibility of something happening is tiny, and that children are supervised at all times by adults. But it just feels a bit odd. I work last year in a central government building and we had waaaaay more security, for frankly less important reasons.

ds's school used to be as you describe. Only the governors heard Ofsted might be on their way and were looking hard at security and safeguarding. Now it's got six foot high security fencing and buzzers. (Ofsted didn't turn up in person that time, just looked at the paperwork. They've now changed what they are looking for so won't care about fences and buzzers next time, apparently.)

DCs' primary had completely open grounds, not even fully fenced. One side was bordered by a man made lake (not fenced). Mind, this was in the Netherlands where they view such things differently. British schools looked far too much like prisons for my liking.

It depends what you are used to I suppose.