Confused by catchments - is it OK to do this?

[LittlePickleHead]

We have DD 3.5, and we will be applying to primary schools in January.

We currently live in (and own) a 2 bed flat in a SE london area that in the past couple of years has become really popular with families. We have been looking to move, mainly to get more room as we would like a 2nd DC and we have no room at all here. But the need to move suddenly seems more urgent as despite being surrounded by a number of very good primaries, our upstairs neighbour has a son a year older, and it has transpired that this year we were out of catchment for all the schools (majority less than 400m away) apart from the one her son got into. However they had a 2011 bulge class, so we would be two years on from that and likely to fall foul of increased siblings. It would be very close anyway.

I know catchments change from year to year, but it worries me as I know of other parents locally who didn't get any of their 6 choices and got a place 3 miles drive away (2 miles straight line but not much use if you can't fly!) which in London traffic is a nightmare commute in the morning.

I really want to stay in my local community so we've decided to try and speed up moving to closer to a school in the area (i.e. less than 300m, crazy). However there has been nothing coming on the market in our price range at all that would guarantee catchment, and I'm starting to panic a bit knowing how long moves can take.

A rental property has come up in catchment of a great school in an area I love. We need to make a very quick decision as I'd imagine it will go tomorrow, but I just wanted to check, if we rent this place and then rent our place out (so we would definitely be moving and not intending on moving back) is this legal? I know there are some issues with parents renting properties near schools just to get in, but as we would be intending on staying in the area surely that would still be OK even though we would still own our previous (out of catchment) property?

Any advice gratefully received, we are a bit stressed about having to make the decision to rent so quickly so I want to make sure we are doing it all right!

TIA

If you genuinely move, and live in the rented house, that is indeed ok as far as school applications go.

Phew thanks Panda (got myself confused by reading old threads)

Wish us luck with actually getting it now!

My borough covers this possibility in its rules. I think as long as you can show you have rented your previous property, and are genuinely living in the new property then it's fine. You could look up your borough's information on primary school admissions to be sure, though.

It is absolutely fine as long as you are really living there. The problems were where people rented properties that they didn't actually move into in any genuine sense. Some authorities therefore make you submit utility bills etc to show you really moved in.

Its fine to move for a better school, just not OK to only pretend to move.

some LAs also want to see rental contracts to check it's not a short term let.

As long as you move there and it's your home at the time you apply, it's fine. The problem I think you've heard of is when parents rent a "second home" or claim to have split up so one parent then claims to be renting a new home with the child, whilst the other remains in the family home (in reality they don't move at all, just collect the post from the new address for a few months). But renting a house within catchment and living in it whilst you rent your own house out is perfectly legal.

Agree with tiggytape you need to look very carefully at the admission arrangements for the LA and school you are considering moving next to. If it seems that you are covered then I would definitely then look to get a written answer from the La that you can use the rented property as your address, to cover all your bases. You do not want to be fighting to get a place back if you have had the time to prove categorically that you will be renting long term before the cut off date for admissions.

Oh no, so not clear cut then. I'll check specific admissions policies for our borough, but it seems unfair, we would genuinely like to sell and move but there is so little coming up in our area we could be waiting ages. I'd view the new place as our home, but it's impossible to prove what we will do int future. Selling and then renting isn't possible as we'll lose our mortgage

Anyway I'll check before I get too down in the dumps...

Still no wiser- it says we'll need council tax bills, closing accounts on previous property (i assume they mean utilities) and a lease of more than 12 months on the new property (all fine) but also need proof of end of tenancy or of completion of sale on the previous property which we obviously wouldn't have. I suppose I'll have to call and see if a tenancy agreement for the flat we would be renting out would be enough - at least it should prove we are not living there?

It all feels so difficult, I just hate the uncertainty of it all.

I'm going to call the council when I get into work, but out of interest, if they say they won't accept the new address whilst we still own our (albeit tenanted) flat, wwyd in this situation? Leave it to chance and stay put (not really an option due to lack of space)? Start the moving process and keep fingers crossed we are completed in time? Or apply as a late applicant to school if not? Move away from the area we love completely to somewhere it's all a bit easier? It's stressful, just don't know what to do and we don't have a lot of time to work it out!

Is there any reason why you can't rent this flat in catchment and put your current home on the market? This will show the council that it is a genuine move and when a suitable new place comes up you will then be in a better position to buy as you will have no chain below you.

I guess the first decision is whether you actually want to move or not, and this will depend on whether your current address works for you in terms of enough space/school applications. Stressful, I know, because you never know how applications will pan out and because schools can change quickly.

If you do want to move, then it makes sense to start thinking about selling/buying rather than a protracted period as landlords/tenants, I think? Your OP said that you've been thinking about moving to have more space/another DC, so maybe now's the time? On one hand, you say that you'll definitely move back after 2 years but also say that you want to move for more space - that's the decision you need to make first, I think.

Is the rental property nice enough that you would buy it, if it was up for sale? If so, it may be worth asking if the the owners are willing to sell. The house next door to us is rented out, but I know the owners would love to sell ( they tried a few years ago )

Just to clarify - we want to move regardless as we do not have enough space, the school situation has just made it seem more urgent. I would not want too move back to our flat as I'm hoping to have another baby in the next year and so we would not have enough space.

We can't sell and rent unless we complete on another sale within 6 months as we will lose our mortgage deal and it's unlikely we'll get as good a deal as now. I guess I'm worried with the way things are at the moment we wouldn't get another mortgage.

I would love to buy, but in the last 6 months our area has become very popular, and we are literally waiting for properties to come on the market (along with everyone else wanting to buy). We saw a shithole property the other week, and we were one of 8 viewers (couples, not developers) viewing on the first day. I just think we'll be incredibly lucky to be able to move and be completed in 6 months.

I do have reservations about renting as it does seem like money down the drain in some respects, but it's probably the only way we'll be able to live in that specific area (if the owners did sell it would be out of our price range for sure!)

I would honestly advise sticking to the rules whatever you decide to do as a child was removed from my dd primary school (in fact its happened twice) as it came to light that parents had played the system. I dont know exactly what had happened - we just saw a child there for two weeks and then removed to another school in the town. I guess other parents notice if child is suddenly driving somewhere and not walking to the house 100 metres away.

I understand that new girl and I have no desire to not stick to the rules, I'm just trying to establish exactly what the rules are. I really do want to walk to school, an it's the fear of being out of catchment and having to drive 3 miles that is fuelling my panic!

I've spoken to the council and the lady I spoke I said they would take whichever property we pay council tax on as our permanent address, so that does seem to suggest its ok.

If you price your house sensibly you'll definitely be able to sell by January. Most mortgages allow 6 months of putting mortgage on hold before charging redemption fees, which is plenty of time to buy a new house if you have to rent in the meanwhile.

You must get that Council Tax statement in writing - an e-mail would do. You need the proof if they turn awkward next year.

you have my complete sympathy you really do - been there myself