Teachers who've done the phonics test, what did you find out?

[MerryMarigold]

Just wondering what kinds of useful info it showed up. Is it worth doing? Mrz mentioned it had thrown up some interesting findings...

thornbury,

You seem to be putting so much in place that I am sure you will have far more children reaching the standard next year.

Can you not say on your reports not only that the children haven't quite reached the standard, but also what is being put in place to support them? I'm sure that parents would appreciate that and be more willing to see the check as a diagnostic tool (which is what it was intended as) than as a SATs like educational hurdle!

I think it is such a shame that this check has been presented and interpreted in such a black and white manner. A child who has missed the standard by a couple of points is quite different from a child who, say, could only decode 10 or fewer words, yet siome teachers seem to be lumping them all together as 'failures'.

That is the official wording, and what the Head and I agreed I would use, and that by putting it in the reports we would avoid giving it undue significance (it may otherwise turn into the extra page parents give with Y2 or Y6 results on). However, many of these children came into Y1 with no reading or writing skills other than misspelling their own name, and their progress and achievement will be evident from the rest of the sentences I write. I will, of course, explain to parents in writing and face to face how the school will continue to support them and how they can support their child at home too.

No thornbury that is NOT the official wording

"Teachers must tell parents whether or not their child met the required standard to ensure they are aware of their child?s progress in developing phonics skills. This must be done by the end of the summer term at the latest. Schools will have been sent the threshold mark with the phonics screening check materials. Schools can use their judgement about the best method of communication with parents and may wish to include additional information such as how parents can support their child to progress with their phonics and reading at home."

When I say 'official', it is what it says on the mark scheme.

Ours did pretty muchas we thought. No bug surprises bar one child who did far better than expected and definitely didn't reflect his day to dy reading/phonics - pleasant surprise though. Of those tht didnt make it most were just 1-5 words off. But we've done some analysis and the children were getting the words right within their phonics phases. So I have the weakest group fr phonics at phase 3/4. All but 2 got all the words with sounds from those phases correct plus some others. Another got most right in those phases but the errors he made are ones we already knew he didn't knw fully and what he is allready working on. But we've not had him long so still work in progress. weakest only got 3 but he is dal and sen and already in lots of intervention groups. He knows lots of sounds but only just starting to blend? Tbh if he'd done the test ony a fortnight later he'd not even have got those 3.

We've not passed info to parents yet.

Head shouldn't be surprised by any results. We had pupil progress meetings last month and discussed where key children were at anyway.

So no big surprises, just reiterates where we are at and confirms our next steps.

Not on the mark scheme I have here thornbury it says

"Children who score between 0-31 marks have not met the expected standards in phonics decoding."

nothing about failing

I was discussing the test with some friends yesterday. We all have Yr 1 kids at 4 different schools. Of the 4 schools, 2 sent home "practice" words and asked parents to go through them with the children. The school my nieces go to also asked parents to do this, and had a parents' meeting about it. Another friend's DC's school did the same. My DTDs school didn't even mention it, and my girls did not refer to the activity as a "test". The didn't even tell me they'd done it (not unusual - they do the "can't remember" thing most days) until I managed to ask the exact right question, whereupon they said that they'd gone into the library with their teacher and read some words, and some of them were monster words.

I am interested in teachers' views on this - how many schools sent home preparation material? Did it make a difference? Do you think it's right to have done so? Dsis is an Yr 1 teacher as well as a parent of a Yr 1 child (different schools) and was about doing the test with her class, but at the same time, attended the meeting and did the prep for her own DD.

If you view the purpose of the test to identify those children who may struggle so that support can be put in place early to prevent possible later failure (as the government claim) then sending home prep material may hide some of these vulnerable children

mrz - do you think that schools felt the need to send prep work home because they know that they will be judged on their results?

I am no fan of the test, btw - no fan of a great many things the current goverment is throwing at schools.

I think lots of teachers panicked

Personally I don't think there should have been a need for a National test (because schools should be assessing pupils internally ) but it obvious from reactions that many weren't.

mrz, where in my posts about this test have I used the word 'fail'?

Thornbury, you have reflected the exact words mrz wrote. As a parent though, if that were written I would still wonder if my kid got 31 or 5! It does make a difference as to how much extra support I would be giving at home, and how much extra support I would be asking school to give. It also makes a difference if my child got 5 and the average was 6. That means there's a lot of kids with problems, but if the average was 32 then my kid should be having some special, extra help.

Merry, the rest of the report comments, the parents' evenings and the frequent opportunities to discuss any concerns throughout the year will hopefully provide sufficient information for it to be clear how concerned parents should be.

Well I'm a concerned parent, but the parents' evening/ report never throw up anything to be concerned about! It seems to be designed to make the teacher, and the school look great, rather than to be an accurate description of my kid.

I guess I don't fully trust the school to highlight problems (unless they are really massive) because:

• It can be reflected back at them as a problem with the teaching
• It's more work to rectify the problem!

Apparently my ds is working at 'average' levels. Whether these are national averages, averages of the school or averages of children with educated and supportive parents (unlikely!), I have no idea. But you see, it does make a difference which one of those 'averages' he is. I am going on instinct/ comparisons with peers/ comparisons with my other ds who is 3yrs younger that there are some obstacles to ds1's learning.

I agree with MM.

I'm just labelled as an over anxious parent - despite having hugely legitimate concerns.

Schools insist on dressing everything up as positives.

Are you ever honest to parents? Do you ever actually say 'you should be concerned'? Because IME schools will never ever say that.

School report does say 'working well below average' - but whenever I try to talk to school I'm told not to worry

Indigo, I have a feeling that Y2 SAT's will be a real 'revealer'. We'll see... I was going to boycott them at one point as I didn't want ds1 going through the whole 'trauma' of it. But now I see it as a potentially useful 'weaponry'!

I suppose it's good that they admit to 'working well below average' but to say, "Don't worry" then makes the school sound ridiculous.

You can't boycott them, MerryMarigold, they are continuous teacher assessment, exactly like the assessment carried out all the way through Reception and Year 1, but with a test as a small part of the process.

Merry, I'm also the SENCo, and I tell how it is (but not in such a way as to be horribly distressing and traumatic!)

Oh, can't you boycott the test part? Really?

Don't hold your breath for accurate or revealing KS1 sat results.

boy are you naive

DDs results go up and down levels like a whores drawers.

Your child is starting to read now. No way will he gets W. No way will school admit that a 1 is bad.

thornbury the administrators guide says

"Schools can use their judgement about the best method of communication with parents"

so it's up to you how you present the information

Well, it's up to the Head, actually. I'm going with what she decided.

I think there's some distance between being horribly distressing and traumatic and the softly, softly 'official language' approach. I have a friend who is a SENCo, a good friend who is a head of Foundation stage, and my dsis is a teacher. I have to get them to decode reports sometimes!

oh my head doesn't tell us what to put in our reports

Thornbury your school sounds like mine... We use Nessy to teach our below 1b children phonics, and after about five weeks, I had one boy get 36 in the test, another got 30.... Was much more effective than ELS.
We got 55% in my class. The words were ridiculous, too many consonant blends in words that were already pretty tricky as they had phase five digraphs in....
We didn't teach to the test although we did spend a week exposing them to the whole pseudo word thing. Our phonics teaching is spot on but as with you, have a deprived cohort on the whole and very poor speaking and listening on intake. They all did their best!