Need help with catchment areas and applications please

[AnnamariaHun]

Hi everyone,
my dp and i are trying to make the best decisions for our ds who will be starting preschool in jan next year.
as im not british i've never been trough this before myself (my dp had private education for part of his early life)
so what we definitely know is that we do not want to send him to the school that covers our catchment are.
Please correct me if im not right so what i can understand is that they'll start preschool the next academic year they turn 3, then they start school the next term they turn 4.
how do people decide which preschool to send their kids if there is no guarantee that the child will then be accepted into the school bit, unless you are in their catchment area???? and what happens if your 2nd and 3rd prefereed school still doesn't accept your child. i read that then the council will locate a shool (which will probably be the one i didn't want to send him at the first place)
So overall i find it increadibly stressful.
we also thought about moving to a nicer area where state schools are better but then the house prices will be a lot higher as well.
Sorry to go on about it for so long but i have so many questions....

Any advice would be appreciated
thanks

Hi,

I saw the preschool bit as entirely separate and just chose on the setting that seemed the most suitable for my child.

I chose the school on the same basis (luckily, my catchment school) and treated it as an entirely separate thing.

Porbably not much help...but good luck!

I would find the right pre-school setting for your DS first, which may or may not be attached to a school. You can have 15 hours funding for a private setting which will probably also offer you more flexibility. If it like our school nursery there may not be many places for January anyway.

If she is starting pre-school next January I am assuming she is 3 sometime next Autumn and will be four in autumn 2013, therefore Reception entry will be September 2014. If this is right you have until January 2014 to choose your school, so plenty of time to consider your options.

I agree, sort out the pre-school that you like first. These do not have catchment areas, you just choose the one you like and if they have a place it will be offered usually on a first come first served basis or depending on birth dates.
School is a very different matter! In many areas of this country all the good schools are oversubscribed as towns are so over populated. Some schools catchment areas where I am are 0.4 or 0.5 of a mile or less!! You are told you have a choice of school but in reality you have to list your closest school as your fist choice otherwise you run the risk of not getting any of your choices and as you already said you may get a place at a school you didn't put on your list at all but it may be the only school in the borough which has spaces. This may well be the school no-one wants! This is the reality where I live but is the worst case scenario.
You don't say which area of the country you are in but it might be an idea if it is possible to look at moving into the catchment area of your preferred school to give you the best chance. You do have time.
I hope this hasn't scared you too much, but wanted you to be prepared.
Good luck.
:)

LA pre-schools/nurseries attached to schools will have different admission arrangements to private settings. In my LA they share the same catchments as the school. Places are allocated by the same criteria if necessary. Also school nurseries have cut off dates for applications - it will be towards the end of September for January intake. Places for January are allocated after this cut off date.

You may find school nursery places are limited for mid-year intakes, ours often only has afternoons available in January and often no places in April.

Also when you come to school admissions come back here for advice. Although it is indeed advisable to put a school on your list that you are as certain as possible of getting a place at, you do not have to put it down first as all preferences are considered equally by admission criteria.

You need to look very carefully at the admission information for the local schools which will be on the Local Authority site that covers the area.
You first of all need to establish whether there is any connection between the pre-schools and schools as children move to reception class. In most schools there is absolutely no connection when it comes to the admission criteria for the school, though as raspberry pavlova says it some cases there is a connection.
If there is a connection and preference is given to pupils in the pre-school then it is obvious that you need to find the right school and then get in the pre-school.
However the vast majority of schools do not have any admission connections to pre-schools. I am amazed at the number of parents who come to admission appeals saying my child is in the pre-school, it will be disruptive to move the and therefore they should have a place. Sorry there is no connection to the school admissions criteria and therefore no you will not get a place.
You need to look at local schools and look sensibly at which schools you have a reasonable chance of getting a place at, having checked out the admission criteria - it being the best school is not a reason to be given a place. Having decided which schools you are likely to get an offer of a place at, then i would select a preschool which is near to the school, not select the preschool first.
I agree with parents that it is a wrench for 4 year olds to leave friends that they have got in pre-school, but it is the parent's fault in many cases when this happens in that they are choosing the wrong preschool for the schools that they have a realistic expectation of getting a school place at.

then they start school the next term they turn 4. Not correct children start school the September before their fifth birthday. There is (usually) only one intake of pupils a year in September.

Pre-schools do not have catchments areas and you can apply to as many as you like. Usually you apply directly to the pre-school.
However for schools you have to apply to the LEA for a place.

so what we definitely know is that we do not want to send him to the school that covers our catchment area. This can be a very risky strategy in some areas as in many cities most primary schools are very oversubscribed. In the city where I live some parents who try this end up not being allocated any school places. In the next year or so you need to do a bit more research to find out whether this strategy would work in your area.

Thanks very much for your replies, we have already put him down to preschool about 10 min from us in a very nice and small village preschool that's also connected to a school. we live in warwick BTW.
unfortunately it's very unlikely that he'd get into the school bit as they take very few pupils.
a lot of you mentioned that i should choose the preschool first but i feel that it's very risky as what if he then doesn't get into the school bit?
admission you seem to say that i should look at the addmission criterias but it seems that most schools have the who lives the closest criteria as the main one or am i wrong?
the reason why we are looking into it as we are suddently panincing and realised that sept 2014 is not that far. my dp also looked at private schools which i don't think we can afford for both ds but then he doesn't want a boy only school so the warwick one is out of the question.
the reason im worried so much because he made me think that unless he has a private education, he's going to have a big disadvantage to start with in life and it makes me panic....
can someone reassure me that it's completely possible to achieve success in states schools???

'can someone reassure me that it's completely possible to achieve success in states schools'

REALLY???? I'm gobsmacked!!!

You seem to be worrying about your child attending the same pre-school/nursery as the school he will eventually go to. Lots of DC don't do this. Mine didn't because I preferred a different setting for them and didn't want them in a school environment too soon. Some people use a daycare setting because that works better for them - school nurseries will often have rigid sessions. My local 60 place infant school takes children from around 15 nurseries every year despite having an over-subscribed nursery.

School nurseries can have catchments - ours does - and out of catchment children won't get places in January or April.

Blimey OP, if it's not possible to achieve in state schools then you've just written off most of the population..

What do ypou see as being the risk about putting him in this pre-school?

UNLESS the school which you would like your child to go so has an attached pre-school or nursery class from which pupils get priority in school admissions, there is no risk (there is a small social disadvantage in that he may go to a different school from his pre-school friends - but that is not usually a big problem at that age)

All children - whether they attend pre-school or not - have to apply for school places for Reception. There is no automatic progression from pre-school to school. UNLESS there is a line in the school admissions arrangements for the school you want your child to go to giving priority to pre-school children (this is rare) then all children will be allocated in the same order - usually children with statements of special education needs, looked after children, siblings of existing pupils, distance.

So treat the two as separate. Send your child to the pre-school you like. Then find a primary school that you want him to go to BUT check that you live within the maximum distance allocated to non-siblings in recent years (e.g. if the last child was admitted from 500m away and you live 2 miles away, you will never get a place there).

You will have several choices on your admission form. You should ALWAYS put a school you KNOW you will get a place in - even if it is the catchment school you do not like much - as one of your options. Otherwise you will be allocated an even worse school even further away, as you will be given a 'spare' place once everyone else has had the places they put on their forms allocated.

thanks for your replies i do realise how ridiculous i sounded. i think i get overstressed about this whole thing. i am not worried of him going to a different pre school from where he'll go as school i just thought if we could find the school we want to send him, it'd be best to send him to the pre school bit but from your post it's becoming clear that loads of preschools have kids that might not necessarily end up going to that school anyway.
teacherwith2kids sorry i didn't quite get what you meant by
check that you live within the maximum distance allocated to non-siblings in recent years (e.g. if the last child was admitted from 500m away and you live 2 miles away, you will never get a place there) ?

Maximum distance allocated to non-siblings means how far away from the the school was the last child who got allocated a place. This varies from school to school and year by year, but as teacher says, if you live 2 miles from the school and no child has recently been admitted who lives more than half a mile away, you are not going to get a place in this school.

thanks very much for that, i think what we are going to do is have a look at a few schools then check what their recent year of admission has been then maybe try and see if we can get pre school place there, if not just wait and put the application in when it's time

thanks again for all your advice, it really has helped

The state schools in Warwick are very good - yes there are also excellent private schools in Warwick but if you want to use the state system it is also very good

www.warwickshire.gov.uk/Web/corporate/wccweb.nsf/Links/9D9DA86851D70DCB8025785A0047EA74/$file/reception+2012+breakdown+-+WEBCopy.pdf

the schools you want are in Central Warwickshire - this gives you an idea of reception places offered - pre school is not as clear in Warwick I don't think it makes a difference regarding reception unless you are looking at faith schools