How much holiday do you think teachers really get?

[Fairenuff]

I was reading a thread about inset days and inevitably it led onto the amount of holidays teachers get and I was wondering whether Joe Public thinks that the teachers get the same number of days off as the children?

Alright, they are not actually in the classroom, but the teachers I know all work during holidays (and also evenings and weekends). My estimate would be that they plan a fortnight summer holiday with the family and the rest of the time they are planning, assessing, marking, report writing, etc.

Perhaps they should be renamed 'child holidays' rather than 'school holidays' to help clear up the confusion?

As a lawyer in the public sector (CPS, LA) you would get a salary, a pension and reasonable holidays.

As a lawyer in the private sector, it would depend on the type of work. A criminal defence lawyer doing mainly legal aid might get a salary and that's all.
A lawyer in the city would get a salary (high), a pension and health insurance (but boy will they work for it).

Cakebump. How lucky you are that you don't find the job stressful.

I came from industry,very high powered stressful job with lots of air travel. Not as stressful as teaching.

Perhaps as a Year 6 teacher you haven't been hit by the relentless change of new GCSE's and A levels?

Perhaps one day you will be in my shoes. Teacher for 15 years, never found it stressful. Until one day I was hit with carrying 2 long term sickness absences, new A levels and GCSE's and a colleague who did sweet FA.

Result: 6 months off sick with stress

The teachers I know seem to get about 4-6 weeks in reality. Along with mostly 10 hour days in school time.

I too used to be up all night, bank holidays etc.

Still not as stressful as teaching. Or perhaps junior is less stressful than secondary? (apologies to all otherjunior/infant school teachers)

I'm a teacher. I work 8-5.30 in term time, though I'll stay later once or twice a week - usually till around half six, though if there's a parents' evening I'll be in school until 8.30.

This half term I did about six hours in school and an hour at home. I'll probably work three-four days at the tail end of the summer holidays too. I might do some marking this weekend as years 6 and 7 have had internal exams this week.

I am very efficient, though, and make a point of not working during the holidays if I can help it. I don't teach primary, either - I think primary teaching is a much heavier workload, to be honest, and I have no desire to do it.

can't be that bad as there seems to be no shortage of people wanting to be teachers

Ex bf was a teacher and used to spend 4 weeks of the summer holidays in Africa with Tearfund, he never worked more than one day a week in the holidays.

I know better teachers do spend more time but the other thread where teachers were complaining about a colleague coming back from ML only to off for 6 weeks shows that they obviously weren't thinking "she'll be spending all that time preparing for the new year".

Any teachers in Ireland reading this?! I can't believe the hours you all work. We have 8/9 weeks off in summer alone, I spend one of those weeks on a professional development course and about 2 days before schools starts in September sorting out my classroom. I have often gone away for 6/7 weeks over the summer (DH is a teacher too).

But ime every profession requires this. Most jobs require home working, doing extra hours, having to be available outside your designated working hours. In this respect teachers are no better or worse off than a huge amount of other jobs in both the private and public sector

I would agree with this too. But many people still think that when the school is closed, the teachers are on hoiday. Their overtime is not recognised in the same way. On a residential school trip, teachers will be on duty 24/7 for the duration (up to a week) for no extra pay. Not many other professions would expect that kind of commitment.

can't be that bad as there seems to be no shortage of people wanting to be teachers - that's what I mean about the job being different to how it is perceived. I think the reality comes as bit of a shock to some NQTs nymets.

can't be that bad as there seems to be no shortage of people wanting to be teachers

Yet 50% leave within 5 years.

feenie I think a lot of people who start off on the raod to becoming a teacher are seriously not cut out for it.

Of my friends who wnet into teaching quite a few had no interest in children!!

I work in a school but I'm not a teacher (I'm the one with the cheque book, so verrrrry popular ). Before I started this job, I used to think that teachers had all sorts of time off and didn't really work that hard. Now I know differently. They work bloody hard and it's bloody exhausting.

None of them work as hard / long hours as I did in my previous "City" job but that was an insane 90-100 hour weeks type of job.

I agree with the posters who say it really is a calling. I couldn't do it!

That may account for a handful, although it is surprising since teaching practices are very intensive. But there's no way that 50% after qualifying are not cut out for it, having passed. Workload is a huge factor cited in reasons for leaving the profession, and holidays are not enough to keep them, it would seem....

Yes, I have come across teachers who don't seem to like children very much, or parents for that matter.

Do many teachers not pass then? I htought most did.

And like any job, you can only see who is and isn't cut out for it a little while in.
Many a fresh graduate will pass training with flying colours, but do they really want to teach day in day out? Or have some of them fallen into it?

"there's no way that 50% after qualifying are not cut out for it, having passed"

Actually there were plenty that passed my PGCE course a few years ago who were clearly hopeless. No general knowledge, crap academics, no real affinity with children. They were dreadful.

In fact, the standard of teaching of the lecturers on the PGCE was appalling, so I'm not surprised if quite a large percentage of the students end up dropping out of the profession after 5 years. My dog could have passed the PGCE, seriously...

No, wordfactory, 50% leave the profession within 5 years of qualifying.

My DH is an assistant headteacher of a secondary school, I am a manager at a "professional services" firm. Our full time salaries are almost exactly the same.

My DH doesn't do much in the holidays (apart from around results weeks when he has quite a bit on). But in term time he works very long days (not back home till about 7, then does couple of hours after children in bed). All in all I'd say he works in the 39 weeks he's at school the same amount of hours I'd work full time over 47.

It's quite nice both of us doing different things - he appreciates the private sector isn't all about lavish lunches and big bonuses, I see that teaching isn't a 9-3 job that you only do for 39 weeks a year.

Also agree teachers get terribly defensive, but then they do seem to get a lot of unfair stick, too (not least the implication they are only doing the job because they weren't clever enough to do something else!)

'Actually, just to rub it in, I teach in an overseas international school and get the full 15 weeks a year. I probably do a half day's planning at Christmas, Easter and in the summer....

At reports time I do an extra couple of hours each evening, for about a fortnight.

But then, we have no silly governmental red tape, don't do ongoing assessments, no form filling etc etc. I literally plan, teach and mark.

It's bliss.

Oh, and I have 13 in my class'

I can see why you are not finding your job stressful Cakebump. I don't think I'd find it stressful either.

Quite

I tend to compare teaching to other professions where they have spent similar lengths of time in university and training, with similar levels of qualification expectations.

For example, my DH is the same age as me, went to the same school and we did A levels together, etc. We went to university for similar lengths of times and both have a 2:1 degree and both have post degree qualifications. We both did training beyond this in order to be fully qualified.

I trained as a teacher. DH trained as a solicitor. We live in the north, so not big city type.

In my first year of teaching I earned more than DH. In my second year, we earned the same. From the third year on DH has earned significantly more than I have and the gap has increased more and more with each year. I actually no longer teach, but if I did the gap would be immense, more than 3-4 times more than me.

The gap between what I would earn full time as a teacher and what friends of similar levels of qualifications and training who have gone into other professional routes is generally rather large. Not all granted, but for most it is.

Which is why I think that the benefits of the longer holidays is just that - a benefit. Just like a higher salary is the main benefit for DH. Or the car is the main benefit for our close friend. Or the pension is for my other friend. etc...

And the only time I ever hear teachers whinging about such things is here on MN and it is always as a response to criticism - normally of our holidays, the pension or INSET. I never hear it out and about tbh. And I know a lot of teachers.

I really object to the idea that teachers are all moaners who have no idea about the real world. I also do not think that we work harder than anyone else in the world, I actually do not want to be the person who is valued so little by their employer than they are forced to work ridiculous hours .

I have repeatedly said in this thread that I am lucky to be a teacher, I earn a decent wage, great pension, immense satisfaction and 13 weeks a year off , there is not much to be unhappy about. Yes there are moments of stress but I think that is the same for most professional jobs. There are certain schools that you can work in, and I have in the past, which are immensely stressful. This is mainly to do with deprivation and poor behaviour, I have deliberately chosen not to work in that environment any longer as I could feel myself burning out. I have the utmost respect for teachers who continue to work in that environment and I accept that they have a much harder lot in life than someone like me in a leafy comp. in the same vein I think primary teachers work far harder than me.

I do think that during term time I do work longer than most other professionals. An average working day for me goes from 7am until 6pm and then from 9pm until 11 or even midnight. At busy times I get up at 5am to get in an hour or so before work and will then work until the early hours. On a Friday I do knock of early and finish at 6pm and then don't do anything at home. I then have work at the weekend which varies. I am not moaning about that because in return for those hours I get 13 weeks of holidays. So over a year I probably work the same if not a bit less than other professionals .

I also do not think that teachers are ignorant of the hours and conditions of other workers, we do not live in a bubble, well some do but not many. We are often married to non teachers and our relatives and friends do other jobs.

Most of us are highly skilled and could have chosen what career we wanted to follow. I chose teaching because as well as feeling it was my calling I felt like it offered me a quality of life that other careers could not, I would therefore be daft to say that I am hard done by.

Yes hula I earn a fraction of what most of my peers from university earn , although I have a very good quality of life it does not compare in material terms to their lifestyles. don't really care because I made my choices and I would not trade my holidays for that extra money. I also have a great pension which I think balances things out.

I agree that it is too easy to pass a PGCE, perhaps it is becaue teachers often want to see the best in people and that leads us to overlook their flaws. I suspect that many of the 50% drop out should never have passed their PGCE in the first place.

Levels of stress really depend on the school you are intoo and especially what the senior management is like.

My second school had me at the end of my tether, my stress levels were through the roof and I was verging on depression. The school was challenging to say the least, pupil behaviour was dreadful and worst of all SMT were weak and did nothing to support. I was not alone in the way I felt at that school. You can search my name on here back to that time and it was actually with the support of some lovely MNetters that I actually left teaching. I went to work in an adult high security prison instead - it was a nicer environment to the one I left in a secondary school. And I was a good teacher too - have all the paperwork to support that, I;m not just saying it. But having a 13y child slam a chair into my 7 month old pregnant tummy, being sworn at, having children laugh when told the lea advisor had a heart attack (after teaching them infact), and the lack of support - no, did it for me. I actually vowed never to go in another school ever again at the time and didn't for a long time.