How does Tetherdown Primary compare to independent education?

[bumbalo]

I would be extremely interested in first hand experiences as to how good really is Tetherdown Primary in Muswell Hill (besides its outstanding Ofsted report). I would also be interested to hear whether anyone has rejected an offer from an independent school to go to Tetherdown or has moved from Tetherdown to an independent school. I am basically trying to weigh my options and decide whether it's worth moving within the catchment area of Tetherdown or whether I should go for an independent school if my daughter gets accepted to any of the schools we have applied (e.g. Highgate, Devonshire). (There are no good schools in my area unfortunately.) How does Tetherdown measure against some of the advantanges of independent schools: e.g. independent attention to pupils due to smaller class sizes, extra-curriculars, quality of teaching/teacher's freedom to walk the extra mile/teacher's motivation. Do pupils at Tetherdown get private tutoring (is that potentially one reason how its good national results are achieved)? I understand that Tetherdown parents are asked to commit to work with their children towards those results (by monitoring and helping out with homework). Just curious on this point: don't parents need to get involved as much in independent education? Grateful for any views on these points.

Don't move into the catchment of Tetherdown, please. It is not appreciated when people who can afford private schools take school places by moving in and pushing ordinary children out.

My DC go to another "outstanding" primary school in Muswell Hill, albeit one with a less academic reputation than Tetherdown. One of the mum's in my DD's class (year 2) had a look around Highgate with a view to her son sitting the 7+. In the end, she decided not to move her son as "they were doing exactly the same level of work". She loved Highgate, however, and plans for her son to sit the 11+ entrance exam.

Re. tutoring. There are a great many children in Muswell Hill state schools being tutored, including Tetherdown. From my experience and anecdotal evidence, the majority of tutoring seems to start from year 5 onwards, although some children are tutored earlier if they are struggling at school. Children are tutored not only for selective school exams, but also to ensure they are put into top sets at Fortismere.

Good luck with your decision!

Wow, horse. that's not very helpful. And how can they be pushing 'ordinary' children out? If there's a house available in the catchment, they are entitled to buy it, as are the parents of 'ordinary' children if they so desire. As long as they pay taxes they are entitled to go to the state school. Good grief.

Bumbaloo, hope someone with knowledge of the area and more helpful disposition is along soon.

Ah - like woodrose!

Thank you for your comments so far. I am keen to receive more input from anyone... really trying to decide how money would be more well spent between two very expensive options... (for the benefit of the child obviously and NOT from an investment point of view). By the way, please leave out any comments relating to financial status... Sorry I didn't make this clear from the start. Don't we all know that there are lots of ordinary people out there who are forced to go private because the system forces them to (e.g. because they are not attending church?).

Sorry I touched a sensitive chord Horsetowater. It was really predictable you would come along but you are not helpful I am afraid. And perhaps you need to rephrase as surely you are not suggesting that children whose parents can afford to spend way over a million to live near Tetherdown or rent at excruciating amounts are ordinary? And surely you don't mean that people who can afford private education should be banned from state schools... Gosh, have you just expressed the view of an "ordinary" Tetherdown mum? Plus, it does look to me (as from WoodRose's example) that people that go to Tetherdown are equally able to afford expensive fees at a later stage (whether independent education at secondary level or expensive tutoring...). And I quote from the Good Schools Guide: "Smug parents, who?ve sorted it all by the age of four, tend to assume their children will proceed to Fortismere and the vast majority go on here. The rest to north London grammar schools or leading independents (?This is Muswell Hill,? said one mother, ?parents tutor without hesitation.?)".

"lots of ordinary people forced to go private" - ummmmmm

If you've applied to Devonshire House I really don't think you'll be turned down so you've probably got nothing to worry about. I categorically disagree that state schools are doing the same level of work as say Highgate. Yes many many Tetherdown parents tutor their children from Year 5 onwards and I can imagine it gets quite competitive.

"It was really predictable you would come along" - blimey that's a bit personal! I have indeed struck a chord.

"By the way, please leave out any comments relating to financial status" ??? what's the title of this thread again?

"lots of ordinary people out there who are forced to go private" as Rosemary said Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.

I can't wait til they bring in a lottery system for schools like Tetherdown.

Thanks yesbutnobut. Would you mind elaborating on your second statement regarding state schools... This is not about any state school but about a school as good as Tetherdown is supposed to be, which is exactly the point of this discussion. Are you speaking from personal experience?

And Devonshire is selective and most likely oversubscribed, so could you clarify what you mean?

My hesitation of going private just because I might be able to afford it (going private is more of a back up option at the moment as I am still trying to add up the numbers and make provision for the worst case scenario....) is due to the fact I am an ordinary person in an ordinary family... I am trying to understand what one would miss out by going to a very good state school (which is my preference) compared to a good private school. There are definite benefits in going to a state school and living in a small community around the school, i.e. you get a mix of different backgrounds and are more likely to stay down to earth than if you only mix with pupils from affluent backgrounds, you get to have friends locally and see them more often than not etc.

My opinion on Tetherdown is based purely in a day's supply teaching a couple of years ago, so take it with a massive pinch of salt, but while it was a perfectly decent school it didn't seem particularly special. I suspect it's impressive results are mainly down to the intake (that isn't to say the teachers aren't doing a good job, but they are just as good in many other schools as well).

The biggest difference you will get is class size and selection. I'm sure many Tetherdown parents put in as much effort as private school parents to ensure their children are well supported.

Personally I think you are trying to compare two different things, living in community with a very good school at the heart of it, is different than just choosing a private school, it's a lifestyle choice as well for the whole family.

Making that choice means you offset things ie being part of a community, verses bigger classes.

Tetherdown is an excellent school, but if you want all the other things that come with private education you may be disappointed, but if you are looking to go to school and live in a nice place then it's an excellent choice.

Hope that makes some type of sense.

Isn't Devonshire house the one that advertises heavily in all those free magazines? Not sure how over subscribed it is in truth and usually such schools are only selective in weeding out any obvious sn/sen.
I never get this comparing sought-after state schools with privates. I always thought the biggie for choosing private is the small classes not the poshness of those attending...

Take it from me that Devonshire House is as selective as someone with diarrhoea looking for a loo. If you are prepared to pay, your child will be admitted.

As a local resident, I'd go with hockeyforjockey's pov.

Tetherdown is a perfectly good school and gets 'outstanding' results because of its catchment area. It's very small catchment area, all very, very expensive housing, pupils well supported at home and tutored.

I do have some sympathy with horsetower's pov. There are over 40 children in the area without a school place at the moment, and it's likely they'll be allocated schools a few miles away. Realistically, most of those families will choose to go private, but it's not nice for your kids not to be able to go to a local school.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't move into the area because of this, but this is a sore point of quite a lot of local residents.

No uniform......?? Wouldn't like that!

Hi Bumbalo. I would suggest you don't waste any time on Devonshire House (all form, no substance). If you want a co-ed, Highgate is worth the money in my view. Or you can try Hampstead Hill (only until 7, but they are amazing) or The Avenue.

I went around Tetherdown, the facilities seem good, but they have no uniforms, there are still 30 children in each class and in general it is not comparable to a good independent school.

However if the only alternative is Devonshire house, Terherdown wins.

I have visited many girls and boys school in north/ north west London (around 20, from
Mill hill to Sarum hall etc) so if you have any question, just ask.

I agree Tetherdown is preferable to Dev House. It is a very good state school and if you're a sociable person it has a great sense of local community and you can get really involved. Dev House advertises everywhere and has a high turnover of pupils due to its being in Hampstead where a lot of foreign bankers live for a couple of years before moving on; possibly an over generalisation there but I think Dev H is seen as a stepping stone to a school you really want your child to go to rather than a destination in itself. It does get kids into very good schools afterwards though.

Tetherdown is at the end of the day a state school and is constrained by the national curriculum. I have a friend who taught there but sent her own children to independent school ... go figure. Highgate is a much sought after school, not the best school by any means, but will stretch the children further and has great facilities and offers a lot of what I think they call 'enrichment'.

HTH Bumbalo

Just re-read your OP, Bumbalo. You won't necessarily meet children from a wide range of backgrounds at Tetherdown due to the small catchment comprising pretty much of houses costing over £1m! There are a lot of Jewish children there, though, from families in East Finchley.

If you want to be part of a community then you will like Tetherdown. Highgate also has that to a certain extent.

No state school is going to be comparable to a good private school but with few exceptions a state school can offer a sense of community which can only come from having most of your friends on your doorstep. If you go state you need to accept that you are not going to get a Highgate /HABS education for free but at somewhere like Tetherdown you will get a good state education with similar kids you would find at the private school who have ambitious parents and will ultimately come out of school at 18 with broadly similar qualifications. You won't get a prep school for free. Oh, and if you are worried about being with "normal" families then you may well find that the holidays, extra curricular, fancy cars and the lavish lifestyle is more prevalent in the state school than the private school as the catchment for tetherdown is v affluent. There are far more families doing fantastic holidays, trips, buying new cars and living in bigger houses at my sons state school than there are at my daughters private school.

I would also find somewhere other than Devonshire House, there are much nicer preps around

I find your comments very helpful... I am glad this thread is going to the right direction and would like to encourage more comments...

Any ideas about what "constrained by the national curriculum" exactly means when it comes to state education, including Tetherdown? In what ways do independent schools surpass the national curriculum and presumably make teaching more challenging? Any examples? Is bureaucracy part of the problem?

I am amazed to hear your opinion Maybetimeforachange... My general impression is that there is a lot of parent competition in private schools... e.g. who is going to throw a more expensive party, or buy more expensive presents... But it seems to me there would be some social pressure at schools such as Tetherdown, too. I had not counted with that, I admit. I would have thought that most catchment areas around a good state school are expensive and therefore whoever can afford them is by definition at least a little above average when it comes to finances - but without necessarily leading an extravagant lifestyle... Does the lack of uniform at Tetherdown increase the pressure? Without wanting to change the subject of this thread, any helpful suggestions about nicer preps? I had no idea about Devonshire House...

Palmers Green High School is an excellent girls' prep - small, academic, excellent results, very down to earth (parents not competitive), ethnically diverse, the girls are local, neat, well behaved and nice to each other. Check out the recent ISI report. The downside - very little outside space (no grass etc).

Why have you just picked Tetherdown in this area, OP? There are actually a lot of very good primary schools in the Muswell Hill area.

Bumbalo yes house prices are generally higher in catchment of good schools, but the streets arounds Tetherdown are mainly Edwardian, large and very expensive, (£1.2m + on average) of course there are flats and smaller houses on roads that are a bit further away, but I don't know what the catchment for Tetherdown was this year, it did go up when they first went to 2 form entry but I imagine it's still rather small and it is located in one of the most expensive bits of MH.

There is certainly plenty of families with spare cash for extras like holidays, tuition, parties etc. I don't think it's that competitive as the school seems to have a close community (outsiders view mind went to another MH primary), but it is probably considered the poshest MH primary.

I don't think the non-uniform thing is a problem although it probably has a bit more of an effect on the girls, but if you then send them to Fortismere which many ( but not all) parents do, they do not have uniform either and that isn't an issue there either (personally I think it's mainly parents who like uniform).

Personally having children in both private and state, I think you need to decide what you are looking for because as I said before you seem to be trying to compare two different things.

I moved to MH for schools before my first DC started reception, knowing it was a great choice for schools both primary and secondary, but it was also a lifestyle choice, as I knew from others that MH has a great sense of community and that was something I wanted to be a part of for me and my children as I was at that point a SAH mum and wanted to have other mums around me and I can say MH definitely delivered on that point.

I am in Muswell Hill. Out of my group of friends about half are going state and half private. The ones going private have found the process extremely stressful - most places are oversubscribed, have entrance exams and waiting lists etc. I can absolutely see the attraction of the smaller class sizes, more resources and greater personal attention. But my DS is at nursery at the local state school (Rhodes Avenue) and there are such advantages of staying local - a two minute scoot to school, and all his friends live locally. At primary level I do feel that's really important.

Tetherdown definitely has the 'poshest' reputation in MH as well as a reputation of being pushy. As well as the superexpensive houses, I definitely know of people who've rented a house nearby for a few months just to get their kids in. The social and ethnic mix is very limited, probably in a similar way to a private school. Having said that, the parents I know of kids there think it's great, and have charming and polite children.

Not sure that helps much but that's my perspective on it. Do look around at the other schools in the area too. I'll admit Rhodes Ave is at the posher end of the spectrum but definitely more of a mix especially now it's expanded.

I have children at Tetherdown Primary School. Its outstanding status is undeserved. The Sats results are largely due to the catchment area, parental effort and extra private tuition and not due to the teaching at the school. The teaching is generally mediocre with a few exceptions. If I could afford it, I would send my children to a private school. I don't know much about the private schools. I have been disappointed by the general standard of teaching at the school. The school community is generally friendly. However, if you want your child to reach his or her potential at this school, you need to arrange additional private tuition.