Garnering opinions please: Independent pre-Prep or local state "First" school...

[Muckamuck]

...up until age 8 before moving the DC to an Independent Prep (from 8-13)? I appreciate that much will come down to the specific schools but - generally speaking - what I'm trying to ascertain is whether there's much point in paying for a private education in the early years (4-7), or whether a state school would do broadly the same thing.

Beyond the obvious advantage of smaller class sizes, do children at private pre-Prep schools gain much from the (supposed) extra resources and activities available, or is it all a bit wasted on them in the early years?

Currently trying to decide between a local village First school (state) and an independent pre-Prep which is quite a bit further afield. (Already decided to opt for private Prep from the age of 8). Money is not growing on the proverbial trees (will hopefully be less of a stretch a few years down the line) but can be scrabbled around for made available if it's felt that that's the best option for the DC. Trying to keep matters financial out of the decision-making process and focus instead on the individual merits of said schools (easier said than done).

I appreciate this subject (broadly) has been done to death but I don't think any of the previous threads have dealt with this specific issue, in particular considering state "first" (as opposed to a state primary) school versus private pre-Prep education.

No flaming please. I am state-educated, DH is not. We don't have any pretensions and aren't presumptuous (I hope). Would really appreciate your thoughts/experiences. Thank you.

Fair dos I hadn't got the infant school business. However if you go on a forum asking about the merits of two non specific schools in two sectors then you will inevitably get some feedback on state and private.

On the point of resources, one important thing to consider is your ability to access such resources outside school if you go down the state route.

Just as a 'for example' - my children are state educated (though I did at various points consider private options). My daughter is a very able dancer, while my son is a very able all-round sportsman with a specific talent for goalkeeping in football. Their current state school does not offer specialist dance teaching - which some local private schools do - nor high-level specialist sports coaching - which some local private schools do.

HOWEVER, my work patterns - as a SAHM, a trainee teacher and now a teacher - have allowed me time to access the excellent dance teaching (very serious ballet school locally) and football coaching (professional club centre of excellence) available in the community for my children.

If you live somewhere where extra-curricular activities such as sport, swimming, dance, whatever are hard to access (our old rural village was like this) or if you have work hours which you know won't allow you to access them easily, then that would be an argument in favour of the pre-prep because it offers all those things in a single package. If you have the time, motivation and local resources available to create a 'DIY programme' then state school + extra-curricular opportunties may well match the 'in house' resources of the pre-prep. As someone said above, state school + swimming lessons at the local pool are a significantly cheaper option than pre-prep with a pool - but if you know that you cannot get your child to the swimming lessons because they happen at a time when you are working, or are 15 miles away, then the 'all in' package the pre-prep becomes the better option.

Polly, being pedantic: Infant school finishes at Year 2.

First school finishes at Year 4 [for the OP - in some systems it finishes at year 5].

As you can probably guess, I work in a 3-tier system and think it works well. The children are in a small nurturing environment for their first few years at school. they then move on to - typically travel to - a larger middle school where specialist subject teaching is the norm for Year 5 onwards.

They finally join an Upper or High school as a fully-fledged teenager - not the same contrast in size, maturity and physical development between a 13 or 14 year old and a 16 or even 18 year old as there typically is between an 11 year old child and an 18 year old near-adult.

Polly, to be fair, it wasn't just you. There was another earlier post which you could easily miss if you blinked which was entirely disingenuous in tone. I did say before that I accepted I'd left myself vulnerable to these sorts of responses - and don't get me wrong, I can enjoy a good old debate - but these things can be communicated more constructively IMHO. The point you were making may have some relevance, I accept, but wasn't necessarily applicable in my case.

teacher - once again, very helpful points. Thank you . My circumstances are similar to yours. A certain amount of flexibility at the moment but an intention to return to work/retrain at some point in the future. There are plenty of options for after-school activities in the local area.

It does sound a sensible system.

Think if you do go private you may need to get a thicker skin and not worry about justifying your decisions. We are considering pre-prep and in RL people make their views known in subtle and not-so-subtle ways!

As for the "holding pen" argument, that's snide but lots of children leaving can be unsettling for both those who leave and those who stay, but on the upside means that places come up at 7 in the popular schools. My friend's DC is at a primary that goes to 11 and a lotof DC leave at 7 for private.

The reason that the infant, junior / middle school system is being phased out is presumably cost.

Dozer,

Where there is a 3-tier system in terms of first then middle then upper, it seems to be completely stable - as in I know of none which are due to be closed or converted to 2 tier. It is genuinely quite awkward to convert, as several schools have to expand - e.g. if you remove middle schools, then several first schools + the upper school have to get bigger. Some first schools are beginning to share heads, though.

I do know of some infant / junior schools (as in R-Y2 / Y3 - Y6) schools which are converting to all through primaries. This is easier because they usually already come in pairs, are often located near each other, and only 1 school has to expand for them to combine.

Not read the whole thread (will come back and do so).

Just wanted to say we have a great local 7-13 prep and could use a state school for infants and then move him there (would make lots of sense financially). However, DS is late August born and will inevitably be behind in some areas when he starts school, be it academic or social. The impact of this on him will be greatest in his earliest years. For that reason I want him to be in a small class for FS and KS1 so he can have more attention.

I think you should consider whether you have any reason such why you think an independent school would meet your DC's needs better in the early years than the local state schools.

"For that reason I want him to be in a small class for FS and KS1 so he can have more attention."

Can I add an extra point to this, which may work with the small size or may be on the other side of the 'pros and cons' of each school?

One of the differences between SOME private schools and the state sector is the degree of formal learning encountered during the early years at school. In SOME private pre-preps there is a much higher percentage of the day spent 'sitting still doing pencil and paper tasks' than there is in the FS of a state school. So on the one hand, a class may be smaller, so giving a child who is a little behind in some areas (due to age or other reaons) more attention. On the other hand, in some private pre-preps, there may be a high emphasis on formal learning from a very early stage, which may not suit a child like this. A very 'young' child can sometimes benefit even more than an older one from an extra year of learning primarily through play while developing the maturity to whizz through more formal learning as it is introduced later.

It is absolutely not a 'blanket' reason for one type of school or another, just a difference to be aware of and to ponder how it might affect your particular child.

I second teacherwith2kids- even at DS's non-selective non-academic pre-prep there is less free-play. This was fine for him as an older child int he year but may be more difficult despite the small class size, for younger children.