Admissions 2012 - Waiting list query (theoretical) - Want 2nd place not 1st place choice!

[curiousparent]

We are yet to receive the allocations (23 April) but we may just scrape through and receive what we put as first choice on our application.

However, since our application went in, we no longer wish to go to that school but would prefer our 2nd choice.

If we do not get 1st choice then that will be a joy as we will be very likely to get 2nd choice but if we do get given first choice can we still go on waiting list for our 2nd choice?

Also, how are waiting lists operated in these circumstances? Both our 1st and 2nd choice schools are voluntary aided and therefore for our 2nd choice school we probably would have been within the PAN of spaces allocated but if we get allocated our 1st choice then obviously a place that we may otherwise have got will go to someone lower down the list.

In our circumstances we are a faith application (criteria 6) and our 2nd choice school usually has sufficient places for all faith places and then some on distance (criteria 7). If we were to go on the waiting list because we are allocated our first choice school does anyone know how the waiting list is operated? Is it the same as the criteria for admissions (so in our case would we still be considered on faith place - criteria 6 prior to someone out of catchment but who lived closer who is in criteria 7?).

Thanks if you have read this - and well done if you understood it! :)

You have nothing to lose by accepting the 1st choice place immediately, you are free to turn it down at a later stage.

You should definitely go on the waiting list for 2nd choice immediately - that way if a place comes up you might get offered it (if you're at the top based on criteria) if you're not on the waiting list when the place comes up then whoever is at the top will get offered it.

thankyou Dilys! (yes I have googled your name, thought maybe you were a George Eliot character :))

No, one of us is from a classic of 19th century literature, and one of us is from Fireman Sam. But I agree that DP does sound a bit Eliot-ish.

If I were to have a third child (heaven forfend) I quite like Dilys!

lucy I posted on the allocations thread saying I was in same position as you! I think the most annoying thing is that we would probably have got 2nd anyway if we had put it first, so am now hoping that I don't get 1st or that if we do that we can get a place at 2nd via wait list!

Good luck!

3 sleeps curious!

I have now seriously accepted i am not getting dd2 into school :(

I emailed LEA on Wednesday asking what time the results came out and within the reply was an email between 2 staff (1 had forwarded my email to the other) saying "can i pass this lady into your care as i wont be here on Monday to help :("

I replied "I take it thats a NO"!!!!! She said it didnt mean anything but i thinks its fairly clear - why else would i be getting in touch next week!!!

Im okay with it though to be honest (as long as i get 2nd choice as DD2 does have a couple of friends there!)

My mission now is just to make sure the 2 people i know who have lied and given make addresses don't get in They should be lower category than me but i know they have 'faked' their proof and the LEA still haven't sorted it .

Hope you get what you want - its SO stressful!!!!!

Oh I know sunny I was driving back to work a while ago and i was thinking well in about 66 hours I should know (how sad am I???!!!).

Oh I hope that you do get your DD2 in with DD1 - especially if others have lied and have secured places that way. It's not so bad if you lose a place because others qualify more than you, but if it is because they have used addresses that are fake then that is so wrong . Surely they would have to do something about that though won't they? They cannot allow over-subscribed schools to allocate places to people who do not genuinely meet the criteria?

I phoned our LEA yesterday and was told that the letters are going out today but they didn't know if it was first or second class. Official offers day is 23rd so hope it comes then - knowing what our post is like around here it could take anything up to 4 days

Me too, counting the hours! My DH is getting a bit annoyed with me as he's accepted her not getting in and i think my worrying and stressing is doing his head in!!!

Our school asked for both a utility bill and child benefit letter. Lots of mums have reported 2 of them, they show in another area on electoral roll for this year, their facebook (not that i'm stalking them or anything ) has comments and and images that show the area they live in! I even have one of their addresses!. Both further than me and several other siblings but the LEA said they can only do so much before being accused of harassment! Bloody joke! I plan to have it out with the head next week and I am going armed with all my proof and printouts! (i hate that this whole admission thing has turned me into a kind of obsessive private investigator!)

To be honest thats what's making is stressful for me - i can handle missing out genuinely but knowing i may not get a sibling place because someone put a fake parish address, no sibling or link to school makes me furious.

did you not apply online? Our letters are posted 2nd class Monday morning but I can view mine online at 6pm.

Well i'm with you on this one, they would have to be reported! And i'm sorry but if they have used fake addresses then they deserve to be harrassed!

My DH is the same - he is like "whatever the outcome is that is where he'll go" - why do they not understand

No I didn't apply online - you had to send your faith application form in by post anyway and so I decided to do it all that way (I was worried that they would otherwise process it as a distance application).

Sunny123,
Good for you,go and show the head teacher your evidence and make sure you leave a dated letter with them detailing the situation. The head and the LEA have to take action and withdraw any places given due to falsified evidence.

admission

Believe it or not i have a dated email starting in October telling them about one of these individuals and the evidence i had! I have lots of dated communication with them regarding fraud wigthin the school generally (rumours of lots of others too). Its so important as parish goes above non parish siblings like myself.

The LEA said they have passed all the info onto the school and they are dealing with it but they STILL haven't sorted it. The girl openly admitted last week that she had lied to loads of mums! No one has contacted her to my knowledge as we have shared friends who inform me she is not at all worried about getting her place!.

When one such mum told pre-school about her lying the staff said "keep it to yourself unless you need it"!!!

I rang the LEA in anger on Monday saying "the results are out Monday and she will get in above me as you still treating her as parish". They said they are investigating (6 months?), its difficult for them as most people admit to lying when challenged and she won't!. They refused to do home checks too and said its all up to school. This individual's sister lied last year also and was investigated and still kept her place (although she was only discovered after Sept so back tracking were she lived was difficult. HENCE the reason i reported her sister in October!!!!).

I suspect she had said she lives with her mum now instead of the family home, and that the school know this but can't prove it? They asked everyone for bills a few weeks ago so not sure how she got round that one. I have tons of facebook comments dated oct-today showing she lives there - honestly don't expect them to do much though. The LEA just blame school and visa versa.

VERY frustrating!

Quick bump for the experts!

If school do not act on the above (last year the girl who lied kept her place and signed disclaimer) is there anyone i can ask to look at it e.g. ombudsmen and is it recommended?

Good link: www.guardian.co.uk/education/2010/mar/11/no-school-place-for-liars
Any thoughts?

And this:
www.guardian.co.uk/education/2009/nov/02/schools-adjudicator-sanctions-parents-lie-school-places

I contacted the LA and the school the week after receiving confirmation of place. At that point there was no waiting list as the LA/schools had to give people the opportunity to accept. The waiting list was constructed 2 weeks after 1 March following their admission criteria. At that point I was able to find out where my dd was on the list.

Thanks for the links!

i know its crazy!! Would you still mention it at appeal even if they haven't caused me to lose a place ( i.e. if i'm not next on list). I think i should as it would still affect my position on the waiting list? But then i suppose that a lot of the definitive evidence i have e.g. facebook, they can't consider?

i do have their real address but lea says they don't do home visits!!! i am going to school tomorrow (been closed for 2 weeks) to ask to see head to clarify.