No hot food allowed in school lunch boxes?

[Bayleaf25]

Just wondered whether your schools have a policy on this? Our head has sent a letter saying we are not allowed to bring in hot food due to health & safety. I have several issues with this;

1. It often gives a healthy & varied alternative (soup, pasta, baked beans).
2. Can't imagine those thermos flasks keep them really hot 4+ hours after being made.
3. If the school doesn't offer hot school lunches as an alternative then I don't see why parents can't give hot food of their own.
4. For working parents it is a good option for the child to have a hot meal at lunch time (sometimes).
5. Surely there are other risks at school - using scissors, outdoor play equipment. So don't see why this risk is any different?

Anyway, basically I am cross about this & wondered what your view are and whether your schools have a similar policy? Thanksx

Ask for sight of their risk assessment. This sounds like the usual "there's a tiny element of risk so instead of managing it we'll just ban it" bollocks that schools are so fond of.

Fortunately my ds' school has no problem with his flask of home made soup-and it's a proper rather than a kids thermos so it does keep it piping hot

No such policy at mine. Children bring in all sorts in flasks. No one seems to have been maimed yet....
But they do sit alongside the school dinners so there's hot food all around.

I would have thought the main issue is that the cheaper flasks don;t keep the food piping hot and you are trying to keep stuff warm therefore it might go off.

But then you have the same issue over stuff that should be kept refrigerated.

My mum used to send me to school with lobby in a flask but what used to happen was that no matter how careful I was the flask woulf get knocked or dropped and the glass inside would break.

. Can't imagine those thermos flasks keep them really hot 4+ hours after being made.

Precisely! My previous career in catering, for which a food hygiene certificate is obligatory, would make me very worried about a) food not being heated sufficiently to destroy bacteria before it is put into a thermos and b) all those undestroyed bacteria merrily multiplying as the food cools.

I don't know what the legal position for the school would be in the event of an outbreak of food poisoning...

I am at a school not offering hot food at lunch time. Though, nutritionally speaking, hot food has no advantage over cold food...

Although, as someone else points out, it is just as risky not refridgerating food properly (cold meats / rice salads / prawn sandwiches etc) have the same chance of giving you food poisoning as the hot food in a flask.

So you would have a storage risk whether the food was hot or cold??

I think you need to know which health and safety risk he's talking about. I would guess it is food poisoning, not burning.

Though as Bayleaf25 says, there are other ways of giving food poisoning to kids.

Seems very heavy handed.

Agree about speaking to school and asking to see the risk assessment.

If they are not providing a hot food option it seems very harsh to ban hot food.

Risks could be managed by seated kids with hot food on one table and assigning more supervision to that table, stipulating what type of kids flask was allowed etc.

if you think about it lunch boxes sitting around on shelves in the cloakroom are not particularly hygenic.

I think the hot food is a good idea if the school doesn't provide any.

What is the big deal with hot food?

Have you ever seen a busy primary school dining room? I guarantee you wouldn't want the average 8 year old pouring soup out of a flask in the middle of the melee! And what about spills? who mops them up.

My kids have the wide top food thermos', so they don't have to pour them out, they eat straight out of the container.
And presumably spills can happen with any school that serves food? Gravy, Custard, drinks etc. I'm guessing the lunch time assistants are paid to help clean up?

I think it's far more likely to be due to the risk of getting burnt. Schools have to play a lot of things safe - if a child got burnt, then all hell would break loose and parents would threaten to sue.

The difference with school dinners is that the children aren't near the hot dishes. In my school, all the food is served by adults, and all children have to do is carry a plastic tray of mildly warm food to their table, where the cutlery is already set out for them.

The TAs who cover lunch then run around cutting up sausages and potatoes for children who seem to have no idea what a knife is for (unusual in London!)

I, personally, would be reluctant to allow one of the children in my class to open their own soup flask, especially if it's still kettle hot. They spill enough crap food down themselves as it is, but at least they aren't going to get scolded.

they take flask out of bag/lunch box, put it on table and open it, some dont even screw they have a flip up bit? i looked at them for my boys but the decent quality ones were expensive, good idea tho they are short and squat so harder to knock over and the outside stays cool etc, i am not sure how hot they keep the food, but any child over say 6yrs old should be capable of sitting and eating it without spilling it, soup beans etc, give them some bread to dip in?

i am pretty sure they are allowed at our school, it serves hot meals as well, just a shame they are crap! but the flasks seem good for wintertime esp when sandwiches arent particularly warm and filling in the way that soup or beans are on a cold day.

i would be asking why they have this policy and if they have carried out a proper risk assesment rather than just decided they dont like them.

www.gltc.co.uk/fcp/product/-/home_school_car_packed_lunches/Thermos-Food-Pot/10000002086

that type of thing?! ^^ they are good, but i would need three, four next sept and at £20 a pop! that aint cheap!

I am amazed at the comment about busy lunch rooms.

Dd has pack ups 6 days a week, so I frequently send in hot food. I make the same lunch for me and her mostlty. Soup/pasta/jacket potatoe in a flask.
She has taken the last two since she was 3 and in preschool. It is a food flask so no pouring involved. I obviously checked she was able to open and close it herself before sending her in with it and don't over fil it but she doesn't spill it, it's yoghurt that ends up on her clothes.

It actually really put me off another school we viewed when applying for reception places banned thermos flasks.

Honestly, watching 200 or so children eat their lunch is probably the best diet one can ever be on.

However nicely children eat at home, they don't when they're at school. They swing around on their benches, they gesticulate with knives in their hands, they knock one another over, they eat pieces that are far too big and so end up hanging out of their mouths, they spill beans all over their faces/ hands/ clothes etc.

I really don't know what my school's policy is regarding flasks, but having ran away from watched the carnage that is a school lunch hall, I would not be comfortable with one of those children having something piping hot.

The Infant department of DC's school don't allow hot food from home but the Juniors do.

I think it depends on the lunchtime set up. Where my SIL works all the children from reception to yr6 have packed lunch in their own classrooms, there are two teachers and two TA's on duty who patrol the 12 classrooms, so really the children are unsupervised for much of the time, needless to say they don't allow hot food.

My kids have been taking thermos food flasks to school since they were in reception without any problems. They love them. I checked that they could take the lids off unaided. Initially I was concerned over food safety and contacted the food agency when my daughter started reception way back in 2003. This was their reply:

"Thank you for your Email dated 9 July to the Food Standards Agency Helpline asking about the safety of thermos flasks. This has been passed to me for reply.

As your daughter?s vacuum thermos flask is designed for use with hot food, I see no reason why the storage for a few hours should present a problem. Please ensure you follow the manufacturer instructions for the use of the flask.

I hope you find this helpful.
Yours sincerely

Pam Robinson
Microbiological Safety Division"

I've not poisoned them yet! Nine years, and three different schools so far; no bans. The more liquid the food, the hotter it stays. Soup could stay hot enough to burn so I understand a school's concern, but thankfully the schools so far have been ok.

I agree about set up, dd's school has a lunch room, and separate halls for assembly/PE. My sil also works in a school where the children eat at their desks,which I found a bit yucky a d not great from an allergy/dietary restrictions pov, I cod understand a no hot food rule in those circumstances.

see i have seen kids eating at school and ours go in in smaller groups, so not 200 all at once, but they dont eat like juniper describes! and there are staff on hand to go round and help those that need it, they are sat in groups of say 6? on small tables and good behaviour is expected, that included eating nicely, they get a 'sticker' for good lunctime behaviour but messing around etc is not allowed, nor is waving cuttlery around. some kids will spill stuff yes, but the majority dont seem to, or else the school uniform would look distinclty manky by the end of the day with spills down it and it just doesnt! (mud from playing football and rolling around on the field yes, spilled food not so much at all)

the worst culprits i would say food spill wise are probably those yogurt things in squeezy tubes as they squeeze before they get them in their mouths!

4madboys - my mum was a dinner lady for many years and she said exactly the same thing. In fact i think her school did ban those in the end. But they kept the flasks!

we rarely get them, occasionally when they are on offer they are a 'treat' they are full of sugar anyway but yes even when they eat them at home they are a nightmare so they rarely take them to school!

I would ask them how many incidents there had been in school - ever - as a result of bringing in hot food and therefore what basis does their ban have.

I'd also ask for accident figures for any injuries caused as a result of cold packed lunches and for school dinners.

Depending on the actual figures, if they are all pretty minimal and equal I'd ask them why they are not also banning cold packed lunches and school dinners on the basis of similar accident results - to point out the illogic-ness of their policy :o

Seems like contacting the hse is another option to be able to go in with a letter like the one previously mentioned - think they are getting sick of people banning all sorts of stuff in their name that they wouldn't. If letter comes back to you like the one above I'd then go in and query policy with the head - with the letter for back up!