Primary school 'SATS' levels. Can someone explain me what it means?

[PeppaIsBack]

dc1 is in Y3. He has been tested as a 4c a few weeks ago when they did some 'SATS' (dc1 words. I didn't know they were doing SATS in Y3??).

I did a bit of browsing on google and found that 4c is the 'expected' level for Y5 and is 'above average' but not 'exceptional' for Y3. What does it actually mean??

It means he is working at a level in that test above that expected of the "average" child in his year group but not so far ahead that he could be considered exceptionally talented. The key words are "in that test". You really need to find out what his teacher assesses him at working on a day to day basis as this will be the "level" he is assessed at rather than just the results of one test. ( Year 3-5 children can sit "optional" SATs which are only optional for the school rather than the children!)

Well I know he is ahead and this is recognized by the teacher. There has been mentions of him being the new X and he is normally working on his own for maths (ie what even the most able children in his class are doing are 'too easy' for him).
So overall, I know he is considered as 'talented' by his teacher but don't know exactely at which level she is putting him on a day to day basis.
Also, when he did the SATS last year, I got the feeling they couldn't (wouldn't?) evaluate children above a level 3c (Different test papers?). Would that sort of things still apply in Y3?

What I am really trying to see is if this test is actually saying anything we didn't know before. I know that dc1 is 'bored' - not that he is really complaining about it - mainly because he can not understand why they have to go back again and again to the same things that he had understood right from the word go.
I am not sure they are able to stretch him enough, enough that he isn't getting bored and loosing the pleasure to learn iyswim.
How would that sort of situation being handled usually?

bump for the evening

As part of their assessing they have done a SATs style paper. They can do them anytime, it's just that they're only reported to the dept at end of Y2 and Y6.

4c at this time in Y3 is fairly good, but like you said not off the scale brilliant.

They should easily be able to cater for him in the normal class.

The national curriculum levels used to assess how children are progressing are used from sometime in Yr 1 (when a child starts working beyond the early years levels used before that) right through to the end of KS3. Most primary schools will give each class a series of SATs style tests about once a term as part of their on-going assessment of progress. It may be that your DS has scored level 4c in a single test but is not necessarily "secure" at that level ie not everything he does is at that level. Even if he is a secure 4c, the teacher should be able to give him extension work of more breadth to engage him. is this just maths you are referring to?

By the way, most curricular (even at university) work in a spiral wereby you revisit topics in a cycle and go into more depth each time - it's not just doing exactly the same old stuff each time!

Thank you.

At the moment, I feel ds isn't being stretched as much as he could as a general rule. I am a bit concerned that his teacher sais she would try and put a TA with him because she thought he needed it but this hasn't happened because she needs the TA to support some of the children who are struggling (which is just fair tbh). The issue for me is that he is loosing some of his enthousiasism for school, something not quite right for him as he really loves school, learning things and is actually quite academic.
He is also doing (very?) well in literacy.

One thing that I do not understand though.
ds knows how to do quite a few things but there are things like doing long divisions or multiplications with more that 2 digits (like 42*15) that he can not do. I thought this is something that is tought in Y5 so I would expected some stuff like thsi to appear in the questions for someone to be at a 4c (which is the expected level for Y5). How is that possible?

He probably can't do the multiplication because he is not really a 4c - he only got a 4c in the test. Which isn't quite the same thing.

There are 5 mathematical units. And to be a 4c you would have to be a good level in all 5 units. Whereas to get a 4c in a test all you'd have to do is get over a certain numberof marks.

So if he got lots of marks in shapes and word problems but fewer marks in numbers, the test might give him a 4c,whereas a teacher wouldn't.

The reason most kids aren't a level 4 in maths in year 3, isn't because it's so hard - but because they haven't been taught enough level 4 stuff yet.

That makes sense.

This would then mean that if one was to teach him the multiplication then he would be a 'proper' 4c. (The issue here is that he doesn't know because no one has ever taught him. But he knows all the multiplication tables and I know it wouldn't take him long to understand how this work).

Does it also means that if he did get more marks in numbers then he would a level even higher?

Sorry the system seems to be mind blowing for me (my issue here!)

Most people assume that all kids learn are addition, sub,mult div and these are what parents practice at home. Many parents do not think about extending their maths knowledge at home in different ways.

The reality is there are so many other sub levels in maths, shape, time, geometry, algebra, at least 20 other areas that children need to understand properly before they really are secure at a particular level. Some of these are never taught properly in schools, or they just cover the basics, but without this knowledge they wont succeed in high school.

I have done a lot of research of contents and levels and previously would have proudly boasted that my DC were at level 5 at an early age, but when you look at the whole Level 5 maths content, much of it is quite advanced. Some level 5 questions are easy, but many are not. The content of Level 5 in year 6 is very limited.

Most primary schools will give each class a series of SATs style tests about once a term as part of their on-going assessment of progress.

I wouldn't say 'most' schools. I think termly testing is an outdated style of assessment - most schools use lots of different types of assessment to arrive at a judgement.

Iam I totally get what you say which is why I am struggling to see how a child in Y3 could just 'above average' if they are at a level expected for Y5.

I can get that some things about geometry can be learnt 'out of school', some ways of reasonning etc... But some of it needs to be taught (unless the child is truly exceptional) so how can it be??

ds came back home saying 'I have a level 4c. That's what people have in Y6' and I cringed tbh. No idea who put that idea in his mind but it does feel wrong.

Feenie, I am pretty sure that they use other ways to evaluate pupils throughout the year. I know they have targets etc... I do like 'testing' though because I think it gives a sense of 'that's where I am at the moment'.

Level expected for Y6 is the wrong way to think about it.

If a child gets a 4b at the end of Y6 they are on target to get a C in their GCSEs.

If a child gets a 4b at the end of Y4 (which about a third of them do) then they are on track to get a 5b in Y6 and an A or A* at GCSE.

Your child is on track to get a 4b by end of Y3. Which puts him comfotably inside the top third - but outside the top 1 percent :)

Hopefully he'll get an A* in GCSEs - but who knows how Things will pan out.

Interresting. I like that way of looking at things. Yes seen how he is, that's the sort of target I would expect for him.
and just as well that ds isn't in the top 1%, I am not sure it is a nice place to be in tbh