Is it usual for primary school children to be taught that god created the world?

[strandednomore]

Dd1 is in Yr1 at our local primary school. It is a church of England school but very much our local, community school, walking distance to the house, where a lot of her friends and neighbours go etc.
She has come home from school today with information about what they will be doing this term. This includes "looking at god as the creator". I hadn't realised that "creationism" was being taught in schools. Ok if taught "some people believe..." but I fear it is being taught as the "truth" to a class of 6-yr-old sponges.
I will probably speak to her teacher about this but before I do does anyone know if this is normally taught in UK schools?
Thanks

BECAUSE IN MANY AREAS, CHURCH SCHOOLS IS ALL THERE IS

There is very little difference anyway between faith and non faith. All it really means for faith is church services and a closer relationship with the vicar.

I don't think that you have read the whole thread, nappysan. Posters are asking questions that were covered way back.

This is the 4th day-a lot has been discussed if you read it first it might help.

..Only two more days then, and we get a rest!

PMSL @ igggi

Sorry I was a bit snippy saying read the thread - I just get ever so slightly annoyed with the people suggesting I take my daughter out of the school because of this, I think I have covered the reason why I won't do that and many others have agreed.
Do you know I would love to start a discussion about what or who people actually think this "god" is (presumably not a man with a white beard sitting on a cloud!) but I really won't.
I will conclude by saying I was discussing this with another parent today and she said in her view the school is teaching the children that "god created the earth" and that that is now what her daughter believes, despite her telling her otherwise. So I'm not the only parent unhappy with this situation so I am glad I mentioned it to the school.

stranded there are two issues there - you've been told by the school what they are actually saying in the class and what they're actually teaching, so I'm not certain why you are disregarding this based on the hearsay and opinion of another parent? Is she in the class when it's taught? Is that how she knows?

Also, shouldn't the other parent's child be free to have her own opinions "despite her telling her otherwise"? I know they're young, but as they get older (especially with atheist parents) they will question their own minds, research their own ideas, and come to their own conclusions.

I tell DS about God because I'm a Christian. However, I encourage him to learn about other religions and ideas too, and I will not force him to be a Christian just because I am. It's for him to decide what he believes.

And yes, you were snippy. But apology accepted!

Greythorne -

This is probably for another thread, but...

I know people say they believe that evolution is fact, but at the same that God is the creator of the universe, but I don't think the two are really compatible explanations.

Evolution explains how intelligence and consciousness evolved over millions and millions of years out of some basic chemicals and a lot of time.

"God created the universe" asserts that intelligence and consciousness (indeed perfect intelligence and all-consciousness) existed before any of that started, and has nothing to do with chemicals or time.

Just saying "it wasn't really 6 days" doesn't make two fundamentally incompatible explanations consistent.

himalaya how exactly does evolution explain intelligence and consciousness? I've always thought that was still one of the great scientific mysteries - what makes us us . I can see survival of the fittest and track how different species changed to adapt better to an environment, but I've never seen any explanation as to how consciousness or intelligence came into being. Do you have any links?

Also, I can't speak for other Christians, but I personally feel that the two explanations are completely compatible. I view it like a blue print for creation - a path that the universe was set on. The anthropic principle looks a lot at this, the fact that human life is possible because the constants of physics and the parameters for the universe and for Earth lie within certain HIGHLY RESTRICTED ranges.

Again, just my personal belief!

NoWayNoHow
www.newscientist.com/
get a subscription
your post shows a deep lack of scientific understanding of evolution and natural history and these boards are NOT the way to become informed.

NoWayNoHow - a good book to read (a bit heavy going, but not too heavy going) is Daniel Dennet's 'Freedom Evolves'

The theory of evolution says that there was no blueprint for creation. Intelligence and consciousness are just a 'good trick' for survival in the same way as a fungal spore's ability to lie dormant for many years, or a plant's ability to capture energy from sunlight. 'We' not the predetermined end point of evolution, we are just one branch - no more or no less special than any other in the grand scheme of things.

It is really difficult, I think to really understand this and and at the same time to think that there is a god who has a special relationship with humans.

Nowaynow

Intelligence is in itself an adaptation.

Animals who adaot survive.

The adalptaions can be flippers of long necks or webbed feet or big brains. Just different physical adaptations to the environment. The ones who adapt best, survive best.

Humans have adaoted to their surroundings by evolving big brains and high intelligence.

Himalaya

Yes, maybe time for a new thread!

I am no religious apologist. I am an atheist.

But, I feel it is logical to say that evolution is a fact. The vast, vast univse is a fact. We have no scientific explanation for the creation of the universe.

Therefore, some people believe that God the creator started the ball rolling, with the big bang. He lit the blue touch paper and then retired, letting 15 billion years of time create the world as we know it today. It was part of his plan to have trilobytes and dinosaurs and primitive homo erectus and eventually human beings.

I don't agree with that belief, but I don't think it is incompatible with evolution.

ID on the other hand, yikes,

I don't think anyone believes in a sort of Santa figure sitting on a cloud playing with celestial play dough. The problem,as I said ages ago,is how to account for the very beginning which is really beyond our understanding. My dh is a devout RC and says that to him,talking about a 'Big Bang isn't much different from saying,'God said 'Let there be light.'' Now I dont know-nor does anyone else but it is surely a scientific fact that 'nothing 'can't suddenly become 'something' so to me the force/intelligence/power that was 'in the beginning is God-the creator if you wish.
If we could understand God then God could not exist,it is only by being beyond human comprehension that the concept of deity is possible. All this is way too complex for children (and most adults) so talking about a creator helps them to come to terms with the universe in all its wonder. To me it is the height of arrogance to assume that our flawed humanity is as good as it gets

As a scientist I am afraid that even we don't say evolution is fact - its called the theory of evolution. There are massive indications that it's true but we can't definitively prove it. However, I obviously teach it in school and believe it true myself, but those of faith can make their own minds up. It's a very interesting debate that the kids get quite heated over, but hopefully they learn to tolerate others views. I'm not going to disrespect someone elses religion, but if they want to pass their GCSE they have to understand the Theory of Evolution !

Surely if you're a scientist you understand what a theory means?

I do. And it's not a fact. It's the next scientific stage down from that.
Theory "an explanation which correlates and interprets facts"
Fact "something which can be observed or measured".
Here endeth today's year 9 science lesson. It is also Einstein's theory of relativity, which has always been accepted as true, but parts of which are now being questioned as maybe a bit wrong. I am a firm believer in evolution, however until there is measurable and observable evidence it will not be a fact.
This is actually quite an important debate as I have to deal with these queries every day with teenagers and fighting parental misconceptions can be difficult. I'm off to bore year 10 with the delights of fractional distillation

I thought that there was some guidelines that said Evolution and Creationism in faith schools should be taught alongside each other in the curriculum for purposes of giving a balanced arguement.

My brain might be a bit addled though as DD is teething and kept me awake most of the night (she's sleeping soundly now) and I could be getting mixed up with America!

I think you're getting mixed up with America. Well, I hope you are, or I'll have to go and shoot someone.

Mumsneedwine- a scientific theory is one that fits all the available evidence, and can be regarded as fact until another piece of evidence comes along to change it.

It is not the same as an opinion. Or an idea or a belief. Evolution is a theory. Creationism is a belief.

There certainly has been discussion of how and when creationism needs to be discussed in science lessons in school. One is if a pupil argues with evolution from their own belief in Creationism of some sort (not just fundamentalist Christian's BTW, also Muslims). The other is when discussing a history of Science. Lamarkism is also discussed in Science lessons, and is in the GCSE, but no one complains that pupils maybe being "indoctrinated".
Actully creationism is very important to be at least mentioned when discussing the development of plate techtonics, and the reasons the early ideas were rejected. Then the evidence for the theory of plate techtonics is shown, and why this wasn't available in the 19th Century.

Lots of Scientists btw are Christian (or of other beliefs). Also lots of scientists believe things that are not "true", because the evidence is not available yet.

However a primary school discussing God as Creator, is probably just touching on the topic that God created the world, however he did it. Which is a useful concept if you want to understand a lot of art and literature. Just as it is useful to understand a bit about Islamic belief's to fully appreciate Islamic art (so why its abstract, and not perfect).

Do agree seeker, but in science we don't call anything a fact until its measurable, observable and many other scientists have tried to prove it wrong. It is unfortunate that some religious fanatics use this explanation to say evolution should not be taught AS fact, which it pretty much is, and I agree that beliefs are an entirely different thing. The big bang theory is another example of how we teach things as probably true, but doesn't sit well with religion and so we teach what we know and let kids make own minds up. But, again, if you don't know the theory you will not pass your exams. I have had parents shout at me for teaching these things to their kids !