Funding for schools and the role of PTAs. Need info please

[PavlovtheCat]

DD is in yr 1. I am about to join the PTA, as there are some things I feel need to be worked on at the school and instead of wingeing, i want to be actively involved.

one the concerns being raised by some parents is the lack of outside equipment for play, such as climbing frames/that kind of thing. The lines on the playground are faded and as such hopscotch, snakes and ladders and all the normal childhood games can't be played. And, it looks tatty.

Parents were told by head teacher last year that it cost too much to do the lines (£1500), and play equipment cost too much. Other schools in the local area have much better play equipment etc, but they are larger schools (400-500 compared to this school of around 170 children).

And it was left at that. But I don't think it should be. So, when i join I am going to raise these questions (not immediately, will at least say hi first ) but don't want to be ignorant of facts.

So, who is responsible for paying for this work? is there a budget the school has that can pay for this, but goes elsewhere if other things are deemed more important? is there specific play/recreational/sport funding that is received for this? or, is there any that can be applied for? can sport lottery funding be applied for to pay for this kind of thing? can the PTA raise money for this type of thing? should they? or should it come from school funding sources?

I really think there should be some budget somewhere to pay for this, but don't know the financial details of how it all works in schools.

Could you help me figure this all out? it is my aim to get the school to support this and have at least the lines on the floor re-done done by 2013, wether we need to apply for grants, or put pressure on HT or raise funds ourselves.

I am CoG at an infants so some experience of school budgets. Under Labour the school might have had some ringfenced budget for 'healthy schools' which could have been spent on sports/play equipment. Almost all school budget is now a general pot rather than being ringfenced so there almost certainly won't be specific funding for this now.

IME a large part of the budget will go towards staffing costs, the rest towards curriculum supplies, building maintenance, insurance etc and there is really very little to spare, it is likely that budgets will get further squeezed at a local level over the next 2-3 years. So the school could decide to repaint the lines in the playground, but the cost of it could be less supplies for classrooms, fewer teaching assistants - it really is that tight.

This is exactly the kind of thing that the PTA in my school raises money for and it wouldn't get bought without them. It's great that you are enthusiastic but you need to find out the current priorities for fundraising and understand those, as well as pushing what your priority is.

HTH

Hummm, sounds like not a hugely supportive or constructive approach from you HT.
But, this is exactly the sort of thing our PTA raises money for -at my daughter's school in the last 5 years or so, PTA has bought: Trim Trail, large climbing frame, large outdoor equpiment for Reception outdoor space, and currently funding the building of allotments for each class. At my son's school, PTA bought outdoor theatre last year.
Seems to me to be a classic area where funding isn't sufficient & PTA funds can plug a gap. HTH

As with PP, at our school - and we're a similar size to yours - the PTA mainly funds playground equipment. We recently bought a play trail which (I think) was about £7000 - 2 years of fundraising for our school. Obviously you can buy smaller items and see a more immediate impact.

YY - large items are very expensive - think our large climbing frame was something bonkers like 10k (inc all the landscaping around it)

I'm in the PTA for dc's school and outside play equipment does come out of the PTA budget. Outside play toys for use at playtime (e.g. hoops, skipping ropes etc) come from the sainsbury's active kids vouchers.

One thing I've encouraged the school to do is at the end of each year get the PTA to send out a letter to parents letting them know how much has been raised through the year and what the money has been spent on. Stuff like climbing frames are very expensive.

I'd suggest you go along to the meetings and find out what goes on. IME they're usually crying out for volunteers and a few fresh ideas, although from the outside they can seem a bit clique-y.

One other thing - I don't know how normal this is, but in our school, the head & deputy have a very big say in what the PTA money gets spent on - so if your head feels that outside equipment is a low priority, it may not be as easy as simply getting the rest of the PTA on your side - may also need a charm offensive to convince your head...

abgirl that is right, I don't want to go wading in, wants facts and know how things are normally done, so what we suggest is realistic and won't be seen as 'oh do shut up that is not how we do things pavlov'.

so, while say a climbing frame might be out of range, it is possible that the lines being repainted at £1500 is realistic? in time? if the budget is not available within PTA, can it be raised through specific things, sponsored this that and the other, cake stalls and the like? this is done for PTA funds anyway, but it is a small school so I doubt it makes much, but if it was done for specific piece of equipment it could probably raise more.

I agree I won't go wading in. I will get to know them and how it all works first and learn about what they have planned. I don't think there are that many new people on it, small school, those with several children are on it, have been for years, that kind of thing.

what is a trim trail?

Trim trail is this sort of thing www.playlinedesign.co.uk/trim_trails.php

• expensive, but more children can use it at once vs standard climbing frame - and better for motor skills.

Repainting lines sounds totally feasible to me - depending on your school & how much money they pull in.

Our PTA always agrees at the beginning of each academic year what our key fundraising goals are for the year. Makes it much easier for parents to feel involved as they know what the money is going towards, so I think it helps you raise more.

We recently bought a set of this www.poddely.com/ - which is imo much better value than large play equipment and really flexible, can be used very broadly - school are very excited about it!

Good on you Pavlov for wanting to get involved. I have spent 9 years or so on 2 different committees, and really enjoyed it (mostly...)

Agree with what others say about treading carefully to work out what's what initially. Also bear in mind that the school may urgently need PTA funds for other things - often schools rely on PTAs for ICT stuff.

You could maybe suggest a playground "project" - get people thinking of ways to improve the look of it, maybe having a "work day" there if head is agreeable, & if there are things that you can do yourselves. Then head may be moved to your way of thinking.....equipment looking a bit scruffy...can PTA fund/part fund some replacement(s).

Good luck!

Agree that offering to organise a workday to just do some clearing in the playground is a great idea - no cost & it's amazing how much better the space can look if 10 people spend a couple of hours on it. We've done this every year for the last few years & it's always really good fun. We do things like giving equipment a good clean, pruning/tidying planting areas; planting bulbs/flowerbed; sweeping up; clearing an area for kids to do 'digging' painting fences; going through outdoor equipment and clearing out etc etc. Usually have a few staff to supervise plus parent volunteers and do it one Sat am. PTA provides cakes & tea

We raised the money for this at our school as PTA, lines etc were in part painted by parents volunteering. We have an incerdible under 5's area (which sadly ds4 has developed a phobia of so cannot use ) as a result. I know how awful the books are- I used to read with year 5 in 2010 and the class reading book ended with the line 'we wish Daley Thompson the best of luck in the 1984 olympics and wait to see how his hard work pays off...'. This is a decent income area Church school with an additional bursary so goodness only knows how tight other schools have it, and that's why the PTA is such an asset. Becuase it can manage outside play equipment in a positive way.

Oh as well as parent volunteers, we have had people donate left over paint, and once a year they do a non uniform which they 'pay' for with a plant for the school garden.

The PTA at DD's school have funded outdoor play equipment, and yes, there are funds which can be applied for for certain things - which voluntary bodies such as PTA can apply for, which schools can't.
The Head at this school has requested the PTA fund certain things, but the choice is with the PTA, not the Head as to what the money gets spent on. But there will be agreement on what is bought.

There is no question that the school budget includes funding for maintenance issues and repainting the lines on the playground fits completely into that category. However as Abgirl says the actual funding is a lump sum and the school then has to split up the available funding between all its necessary expenditure. Funding is getting tighter and tighter and therefore as in many other organisations the first things to be cut back are things like maintenance.

I think that you need to find out more about the actual situation before you go in all guns blazing. For instance if there are only 170 pupils in the school then is that the maximum that the school can take or is that there should be 210 to have 7 full classes. Those 40 pupils that are missing are worth about £120000 a year to the school in funding, but the school will probably still have to have 7 class teachers for the lower numbers. So is there a possibility of getting more pupils in the school? The other point is where is the school financially, is it already in deficit. If so then any expenditure is going to be difficult for non essentials. Be careful when you ask that question of the head teacher, they might be touchy about the subject!

Second question i would be asking is whether the playground is actually in a suitable condition for new lines to be painted on it. If the tarmac is on its last legs then that needs to be replaced and then you are not talking £1500, you are talking probably some where in the region of £20000 to £30000. Which then raises another point, maintenance has to be paid for out of the normal school budget, but every school does get a small amount of what is called devolved formula capital to spend on capital projects which have a cost of £10000 plus. It used to be a reasonable amount of funding but Mr Gove has cut it right back. If the equipment etc is also tatty and needing replacing is there a possibility of the school using their DFC for what is a very worthwhile project?

As others have said the PTA is separate from the school and it is entirely up to the PTA how they spend the money raised, but most talk to the school staff and agree suitable projects. I wonder whether you are actually in the wrong organisation, to me it sounds that actually you should be looking to become a school governor rather than just on the PTA - how about asking when the next round of elections for parent governors is coming up?

Ooooh admission that is exactly the stuff I need to know, thank you! Tarmac looks fine but I am no expert! I will tactfully seek answers to some of these questions,c once I have been to a couple of meetings...

Our PTA spent a lot of money repainting the lines in the playground. DD says the kids don't use them, they prefer to "just run around".

Its unlikely the head will shared detailed info re finances with the PTA, thats more a school governor meeting.

Budgets are shrinking, paying staff and trying to maintain some support staff is what schools spend most on. Ours is a small school and all playground equipment and toys come from the PTA as we simply have no spare money for them.

Try lightly as you need the Head on side and there are many new ideas you could bring to raise more money than previously.

We've raised money for a trim trail and gazebo on the field.
We've also paid for computers, which I feel should be done by school as they are curriculum not extras.

There had been some good stuff done, don't get me wrong. We had an artist come in and do wall painting gs outside with foundation class and mosaic murals on the walls, veg plot updated. Just more needs doing. I want it to be more progressive I guess, make it a place children want to come to. I don't mean me personally! Just want to be an active part of it, not just baking cakes

Not sure about whether school is at max. I know last two years have been full classes but there are also two mixed year classes due to small classes...that is because there is an element of transience as there is a forces presence locally.