Deferring Primary entry (Scotland) for a july born ds

[ln1981]

Hi there, can anybody out there help?!

DS2 is due to start school in August 2012, but his keyworker has expressed concerns about how well he will cope with the step up to Primary1.

Heres a bit of background-he has been under SALT for the last six months as his keyworker was having difficulty understanding his speech. He was a late talker and its only recently (last 3-4wks) that he has began forming proper sentences, with proper structure and having understandable conversation (IYSWIM). Anyways, his progress has been great, though he does still have issues processing some of what is said to him (ie doesnt always answer questions appropriately, has difficulty following instructions), and will only sometimes initiate conversations with children in his class.

I get the impression that his speech therapist sees no reason why he cant go to P1 with the rest of the group, and up until having a recent meeting with his keyworker, neither did I! But she has really put doubt in my mind about it. She thinks he is very immature for his age, he shows no interest in writing and when he does speak to other kids its only if an adult is there to 'talk through'.

There is a bit of me that worries he would be overlooked in a classroom as he is very quiet, and undemanding-in fact hes so laidback hes horizontal! But OTOH, I know that he is bright and funny and he takes in so much...

I appreciate that it is still a long way off, but I just wondered if anybody has been through similar? If so, is deferral the way to go? I also know that deferral for a July born child is practically unheard of, but I really want to get as many opinions/viewpoints as possible, as I really want to get this right for him.

In a way its funny as ds1 is feb born, and if he had had the same problem, I wouldnt even be thinking twice-aarghh so confused!!

Any comments/help/info greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

The key worker is talking pants. He'll already be one of the oldest in his year. A sen is not a reason for deferral, he should be kept with his natural year group and be given extra help by a salt.

I don't think you can defer a July child? He will presumably be 5 in the July so would be starting in the school year after his 5th birthday. Check with your council but I think it will not be possible.

Ds1 April born went into primary 1 this year and due to speech delay was incredibly shy and although nursery did bring him put of himself his primary 1 teacher did say she thought she was going to have to work really hard with him but he has soared in school. He is a different boy is speaking more and has showed everyone else what I already knew. That he is clever and funny. August is still a long way off and I know this time last year I was in the state of worry you are now but the changes thar happened with an amazingly supportive school in that time were honestly phenomenal.

It would be very unusual to defer for a July born child. It might be possible for a child with serious learning difficulties, but for a bright child with slight speech delay, I doubt if it would be possible or appropriate. Also, if you did not send him to school, it is unlikely nursery would be funded for another year, so the likelihood would be home education for a year and entry to P2 in August 2013.

I absolutely would not worry about his lack of interest in writing; this would be an unusual interest for a 4 year old boy, though by all means encourage him to occasionally do quiet pencil and paper activities like drawing, colouring, or dot to dots etc.

I doubt if he will get overlooked at school. Primary 1 teachers will be on the look out for quiet ones and will encourage them to join in as much as possible. They will also be able to differentiate according to abilities.

I am sure your DS will make a lot of progress in the next 8 months and will be much more ready for school by next August.

so he's four and a half now?
And the cut-off date in Scotland is new year's day, not September as it is in England?
And in Scotland it's usually only if you're born in the last few months of the year that you get the chance to defer?

I year-deferred my son and it has transformed his life-chances. So "no comment" to the second post on this thread!

My son's issues were very similar to the following, by the way: "He was a late talker and its only recently (last 3-4wks) that he has began forming proper sentences, with proper structure and having understandable conversation (IYSWIM). Anyways, his progress has been great, though he does still have issues processing some of what is said to him (ie doesnt always answer questions appropriately, has difficulty following instructions), and will only sometimes initiate conversations with children in his class."

My son was however a late-August child in England where the cut-off date is 31st August so he is only the oldest by 10 days or so.

nb this child has problems processing what is said to him. This is competely different to "speech delay".

Cut-off date in Scotland is end of February, so you can't defer a July child.

they have to start school when they are still 5, so you would probably not be able to defer a July born child as he would then be 6 when he starts school. From Scottish childcare site:

Children become eligible to start primary school in the August when they will be between 4 ½ and 5 ½ years old. Parents have the right to defer their child?s entry to primary school provided that the child is still 5 years old when he or she starts school. Parents of children with birthdays in January or February, who choose to defer their child?s entry to primary school, are entitled to continue to receive a free, part-time pre-school place for an additional year. The children will start school the August after their fifth birthday. However, children with September to December birthdays will only be able to access an extra year of free pre-school education at the discretion of their local authorities. If you wish to defer your child?s entry to primary school you should discuss this with your local authority?s education department. Further information on entitlement to pre-school education and starting school are available on the Parentzone website (www.ltscotland.org.uk/parentzone).

I really don't think you'll be able to defer - he is due to start full-time education in the August after he turns 5. Your only legal option would be to educate him at home for a while if you think he'll do better that way. But if/when he later joined school he'd go into the class for his age-group so it wouldn't make any difference to where he ends up.

So if you sent him a year later, he'd go into P2, which I think would not help him any.

Better for him to go at the start of P1 at the proper time, and you talk to the teachers about his issues and how you can all work together to make sure he doesn't get left behind/overlooked.

I might be wrong, but I think it might be possible (to defer primary school entry).

In my daughter's class (in Scotland) there is a girl who is 1 year older than the others (this girl's birthday is in December, so I don't know if that makes a difference). Also, in my son's class there is a girl that is 1 year older than the others (and she's not a jan/feb born, although I don't know exactly when her birthday is, but I could find out if it helps). I think the decision to wait to start school was made because there were concerns about motor skills or something like that (I don't know details) but the girls are lovely and are coping very well in their class, and the teachers are very supportive, and you wouldn't know they are 1 year older by looking at them.

I think that if a parent thinks their child would benefit from waiting to start school, there must be a way to do it. Maybe it will involve lots of time, effort and energy for the parent/keyworker to convince the school/LEA, but I would try. What about talking to the headteacher of the school and ask for their opinion?

Good luck!

Its not hard to defer a december born in Scotland, (the cut off is Feb), July would be much harder, and would not just be at parental request.

Yes, albachiara, the December birthday does make a difference. She would have been 4 years 8 months in August, so was not obliged to be in education at that date. (She is not really a year older, as such; she is 14 months older than February borns, but only 3 months older than March borns.) Any child born from September to February can be deferred; parents do not have to do anything, they just need not enrol their child for primary school. But the reality is that, in most local authorities, they are unlikely to get another funded nursery year unless their birthday is in January or February.

You need to talk to the school to see what they think. When my dd started school there was another girl in her class who was almost a full year older than some of the oldest in her class so it was definitely possible. I have no idea of her particular needs but she did end up at a different high school rather than mainstream. There was also a boy with speech difficulties who started with his peers but then repeated p1 and after that he came on in leeps and bounds. That may be another option but discussion with the school and other professionals who look after your ds is definitely the way forward

Hi there. Thanks for all your replies.

I didnt think it would be possible to defer his entry due to when his birthday falls, but his keyworker seems pretty adamant that if its something I really want to do, then it can be done.
TBH, i think that deep down I would much prefer him to go with his peers, but i guess i just worry that he would be left behind. His progress has come in fits and starts, rather than a gradual progression, so as much as I know that he will likely be ready to go to school (with help), it doesnt seem all that likely just now!! However, I would hate for him to start, and then be kept back.
Another pro for going is that there is already support staff within the school, as there are several children with various SEN within the school.
As lovely as his keyworker is, she has really got my head spinning on this! The nursery teacher in charge has been a bit more balanced i have to say. The Ed Psych (at the request of SALT) is also due to go and see him in nursery sometime in the new year. I think once she has been in, I will go and see the DHT who is in charge of the P1's and see what she says.

Thank you again everyone! Its appreciated!!

The nursery headteacher and the SALT are propbably going to be better able to give advice on this than the keyworker.

If you did defer your DS then her would be at least 4 months older than any other child in the class, and up to 16 months older than some of them.

August 2012 is still quite a long way away, nearer the time you might feel more confident about it (or more sure that you want to try to fight for a deferral)

Whilst it is not easy to defer a child outwith the Jan/Feb birthdays it is possible. I know because only a few years back I had a child in my P1 class a whole year and a bit older than everyone else (she had a Feb birthday but was doubly deferred - so turned 7 during her P1year iyswim). However, this child had severed developmental delays and this had been advised by her nursery workers. Incidentally she missed out P7 altogether as no-one thought she should still be at Primary school at 13!

So, I don't know your ds so can't advise what would be best but I think that if professionals make a strong case for deferral then it could happen and would not mean the child would go straight to P2.

You need an ed psychs report to defer a July birthday. It's becoming harder due to funding etc
You may have to pay for the extra time at nursery.
I teach in a Glasgow school and there are many defered students but mainly October - feb. good luck x