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Original poster

Help! Almost free reader but guessing many words; phonics too 'clunky' at this stage

27 replies

Newt · 05/12/2011 15:43

My dd is nearly eight and nearly a 'free' reader in terms of the books she gets from school (Copper book band, level 12). However, when she comes to a word she does not know, eg aeroplane, she guesses wildly (there was even a picture of it in the text 'True Life Survival' but she did not 'get it'. I try to suggest that she sounds out the word, but at this stage, it ruins the flow for her and being a reluctant reader, I can see that the phonic method of sounding out puts her off reading as it is slow. Aeroplane does not sound out easily either, so I told her the word during her reading. This is what I am tending to do, to correct her guess in order for her to keep the flow going. Should I force her to sound out and risk her losing interest in reading..(this happened about a year ago so I stopped forcing her) Not sure what to do...will she get these word eventually with repeated exposure or do I bite the bullet and slow her down with sounding out? All thoughts appreciated

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ChazsBrilliantAttitude · 05/12/2011 15:49

Perhaps help her but note the words down at the time and go over them after. That way she doesn't lose the flow but she does revise the word.

Indith · 05/12/2011 15:50

Some words they do just have to learn though as we have a bloody stupid language that doesn't really lend itself to phonics very well. Why don't you note down words she has to guess/be told as you are reading then make your own flashcards to mess around with and help her learn them?

If you want extra phonics based stuff to do at home have a look at the "Read, Write Inc" flashcards. They are way, way better than Jolly Phonics type and have all the funny sound combination, all the "bits" of words, eay phrases for remembering the effect of one letter on another even when they ar not next to each other in the word and so on.

I think you have ot stay relaxed though and let her lead the way. So long as she enjoys reading she will pick it up when she is ready to.

Original poster
Newt · 05/12/2011 15:52

Good thought CBA. Has anyone else had this sort of dilemma with dc? I'm sure it must be quite common but I don't see it on the threads.

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Original poster
Newt · 05/12/2011 16:03

Thanks Indith..funnily enough I used RWI ditty books and storybooks which we worked through religiously to get dd started on reading as she was struggling all through yr 1. So she actually started reading this time last year, ie when she was nearly 7. These books really worked for her, but she always wanted to read 'fluently' so as soon as she could dispense with phonics she did!

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Indith · 05/12/2011 16:52

I'm sure she will guess less and less the more she reads. Ds is only in reception so just learning. he has twigged the whole concepts of reading the past couple of weeks and reading everything he can get his hands on, it really brings it home how artificial the reading books are as they try to keep withing the phonemes that have been covered so far, then you hit "rel" text and find yourself saying every other word "now this is a tricky one, you can't sound it out you just have to learn it".

Iamnotminterested · 05/12/2011 16:54

Sorry, but if she is struggling with words like "Aeroplane" I would question her becoming a free reader, whatever that may mean in your school.

FairstiveGreetings · 05/12/2011 17:02

If she can't read the word, tell her what it is and look at the word together. Get her to break it into syllables and see how she can sound out some of the syllables - 'p' 'l' 'a' as in a-e 'n'. If she has been taught phonics at school she should be able to do this. Also find rhyming words that you know she can read, 'cane' 'lane' mane'.

mrz · 05/12/2011 17:53

My dd is nearly eight and nearly a 'free' reader ... I can see that the phonic method of sounding out puts her off reading as it is slow.
As a teacher I would be extremely concerned that these two sentences are describing the same child.
An almost free reader should be blending unfamiliar words quickly and automatically and the fact that she is slow suggests that she isn't secure in her phonic knowledge.

Original poster
Newt · 05/12/2011 18:34

Iamnot .. I guess she is some way off being a free reader, but the book she is given has fairly challenging words..'lieutenant' 'Sumatra', err 'Phuket'..

Fair ..it is this breaking down of syllables which she finds so tedious when reading, puts her off.

mrz .. This is my point..she is not secure in her phonic knowledge, therefore what do I do now?

Her school reading schemes - ORT, Oxford Project X and Collins Big Cat among others in yr 2.

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Iamnotminterested · 05/12/2011 18:45

"She is not secure in her phonic knowledge, therefore what do I do now?"

Erm...talk to her teacher and suggest she continues with reading scheme books for a while? She is clearly not ready.

Original poster
Newt · 05/12/2011 19:00

Teacher says all is ok if she guesses some words while keeping the flow of reading....

Not ready for what, Iam..this level?

She is on reading scheme as I mentioned, and sometimes brings home Horrid Henry books (seem to be at similar level)which she loves and has a good stab at. Its' just that guessing thing which leaves me puzzled. I was hoping to get responses from others who experience this..it can't just be me!

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IndigoBell · 05/12/2011 19:06

Maybe do dancing bears at home with her to help her finish learning to read.

Original poster
Newt · 05/12/2011 19:09

Dancing bears? What is this?!

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Original poster
Newt · 05/12/2011 19:14

Dancing bears..just googled it..yes this could be helpful for her ..thanks for that

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ll31 · 05/12/2011 19:29

but surely everyone goes through this stage learning to read - I would tell her words she doesn't get in her reading for pleasure tbh - they'll come to her eventually...speaking as someone who absolutely hated with a vengeance the "look it up and you''ll remember" attitude when you were in the middle of a great story and didn't want to stop! for her school reading/homework I would however go over them with her...

CecilyP · 05/12/2011 19:31

If she is reading to you, you can get a bit ahead of the game and work out what she would find impossible to sound out and just tell her, rather than letting her guess.

In your examples, I doubt if any phonics scheme would enable her to read lieutenant without being told, and as for phuket, the first attempt might be a bit embarrassing. On the other hand, some unfamiliar words, like Sumatra, should be fairly easy to work out, so I would encourage her to have a go at things you think she will get, even if it stops the flow a bit. However, if far too many new words for the reading to flow, it suggests that the books are a bit too hard for her.

Original poster
Newt · 05/12/2011 19:59

Yes..everyone must go through this stage learning to read.

I think the books may be too hard for her..unlike other mums, I always say to teachers and TA's 'please give her easier books' ! If I ask her to read a book to me of her own choosing, she will go for books suitable for average 5 yr old I guess. Wondering if she has mild dyslexia or something similar..

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FairstiveGreetings · 05/12/2011 20:45

I does seems as if the books are too hard for her. She should read at a level that allows her to read mostly fluently with the occasional 'sounding out' of an unfamiliar word. This should not interrupt the flow of reading too much. I think you need to speak to her teacher about a different reading scheme. Ask if she has been assessed for phonics. She does not sound like a free reader to me.

Original poster
Newt · 05/12/2011 21:48

That's a good idea..an assessment for phonics. I shall get on to it tomorrow. Thanks for all the advice ..off to bed

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blackeyedsanta · 05/12/2011 23:37

how about playing some games with her with some long words. write a few on some paper and she has to read them to cross the river? put them on papers on the floor and she has to segment and read them to use them as stepping stones to cross the room. collect some long words she has to break up into chunks to read. use them as word cards. particularly good if you have some similar words with slightly different endings.

bribery works quite well.

dd is the same. will make up a nonsense word rather than sound it out. it is very frustrating.

underbeneathsies · 06/12/2011 00:05

Have you had your DD's eyes tested for convergence newt convergence in eye muscles. MY DD had a similar problem and it turns out her eyes do not move smoothly over the text, but rather they hop from one word in it's entirety to the next. It's difficult for her to focus on the words as one of her eyes is pulling outward.

It has been very hard to teach my DD to read phonics as she can't seem to break up the word - her eyes can't scan, only hop, if that makes any sense, so she either gets the word or not - she cannot slow down to read the word grapheme by grapheme as per phonic method, as her eye muscles pull her eye away from where she wants to look.

Now that my Dd has been given exercises for the muscles in her eyes by the Ophthalmic optitian, her reading has come along dramatically, and she has jumped a few levels over two weeks, as her eye muscles strengthen to enable her to look at the word long enough for her to decode it.

Worth a try.

BTW, is your DD car sick a lot? That was one question the Ophthalmic guy asked and he said that it is really common in kids who had convergence problems in their eye muscles.. My Dd was car and motion sick, and I never knew why, but now I do.

Tgger · 06/12/2011 09:29

No first hand experience but I would judge it on how many words she is wildly guessing. If just a few then I would just tell her them, but if lots I would go back to phonics and do a combination of sometimes telling her (to keep her keen reading) and sometimes sounding out and going over sounding out for hard words quite a lot. Sounds like she's doing great.

Tiggles · 06/12/2011 10:21

With a word like aeroplane with my DSs I would get them to sound out the plane part first as that is very simple phonics and then explain the first part of the word to them. However, if you are finding that disrupts the story too much how about skimming through the story yourself first and finding what look like new words and then getting her to work them out before you read the book. Once you know she is capable of working the word out it doesn't matter if you remind her what the word is when she is reading to maintain the flow.

Original poster
Newt · 06/12/2011 12:31

Thanks so much for suggestions.

underbeneathsies Convergence in eye muscles..I am looking at this keenly now, as dd id carsick (she has window down in depths of winter). Also accident-prone.

She also generally says 'the' for 'a' when reading and vice versa. Hopping rather than scanning sounds like the way dd is reading. Are there any exercises you can recommend for getting her eyes to scan?

I checked out some of Indigobell's posts and she links to

www.easyreadsystem.com/dyslexialab/eggi/eggi.html

which looks like it might help too.

blackeyedsanta I will try the bridge game..sounds good

LittleMissGreen thanks for suggestion..strangely ~I cannot always anticipate which words will fox her, sometimes she reads the 'hard' words easily

Tgger thanks for support..in a way she is doing great..she has gone from practically no reading to this stage in one year, but as she is such a late starter, I want to make sure I am helping her as much as possible using the right approach

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blackeyedsanta · 06/12/2011 13:03

oo that eye thing sounds like a possibility. she is car sick and has mild astigmatism, though it is not supposed to effect her Hmm I think i will look into the eye person we have been recommended. recently refound the name we were given.