Low result on British Ability Scale cognitive test - advice needed

[petersham]

Hello, I posted on SN but there seems to be good advice on dyslexia IN PRIMARY SO HERE GOES..
I'm feeling a bit confused re above. DS is 6 and in MS - had a cognitive assessment - EP said it was the BAS covering 6 or 7 areas - never really reached 5th centile in any of the categories. She said that she would test again next year as he was distracted/not engaging/ was recently st traumatic physical abuse by his father whom I am divorcing.

HOWEVER... he has been reading Enid Blyton type chapter books since he was 5 and could talk about it for hours so comprehension is there. I know that he is a poor learner in a large class of 30 (dreamy, doodles, disinterested in social stuff) but school and EP have acknowledged that he writes in full sentences and learns well in smaller group, follows instructions etc. I support him a lot at home and I roughly know his level, strengths, weaknesses so it just doesn't make sense to me how he has emerged as being right down there.

Should I ask for a different type of test/different conditions (he is a child who needs hand-holding and guidance to get anywhere academically - the opp of an independent learner)? He doesn't get any 1-1 atm really but surely the results suggest that he would need it?

On the one hand, I know that the test may be meaningless if he was not engaging and I am satisfied that he is progressing from what I can see. However, it has knocked me for six and I now feel as though I was deluding myself into believing that he was progressing so well as surely progress is not just what you can demonstrate at home in a 1-1 situation, though should also be demonstrable at school as well? Where should I go from here?

If reading chapter books at age 5/6, he's clearly not in the bottom 5%! However he still may have specific difficulties affecting his learning/concentration/behavior.

I agree, the tests are worthless if he did not engage. I'd be pushing for another assessment in 3 or 6 months on the grounds that the results were worthless - a year is a long time to wait.

Talk to his teacher? The HT? about your thoughts and concerns.

I think that there has to be 12 months between each test otherwise this could invalidate it. This fact always made me smile as my DS's short term memory is so bad he wouldn't remember what he had done anyway. However, I would assume it would be possible to use another test e.g. WISC 4 which tests similar areas.

Can I ask why an EP was testing him

Well, he is not v good at concentrating in whole class tasks even though I obv have no such concerns and SENCO and TA say that he is fine in small group work. Is this test really only for dyslexia or other stuff?

She did say that she could not guide him at all during the test - he is not an independent learner so I am not surprised that he never engaged. He has never been in such a situation.

I am concerned because I don't know if they are implying that he is remedial and if so, for his future - yet, he is def the best boy reader in his class so I am really not sure what to make of it.

As I mentioned on other thread, SENCO (whom I am getting along with better atm though have not done so in the past) had a dig at me. When I said that I had no such issues myself as a child but I support him the best I can she said 'Oh, people who have had no problems at school make the worst teachers" which was rude and hardly a fact given that he was learning nothing when I left it up to them.

This test is designed to be done by young kids. It's highly significant that he can't do an age appropriate test independently.

Does not sound like he has dyslexia or any other cognitive problems.

But I do know Autistic children who are very passive and can't do any independent work. I think more needs to be done to understand why he can't work independently at all.

Has he been seen by a paedetrician?

Well, when I say independently, he does choose educational activities and undertake them - will read a book for an hour, do a fair amount of other but he daydreams in class, doodles, switches off

It's really hard to tell anything from what you're saying here, and I don't get a real picture of what he's like.

But I think it could be worth getting him seen by a paed.

Excessive day dreaming, to the point where school are concerned enough to get the EP to see him, indicates something. There's a form of ADHD where kids aren't hyper but are predominantly inattentive. Basically they just can't pay attention to what they should.

EPs don't normally assess kids. The school are worried about something. His scores are both concerning and not reflecting his ability. So I really think the next step would be a paedetrician.

I was going to post the same as Indigobell. It does sound like it could be ADHD, predominantly inattentive type to me and I have some experience of this.

It also depends of which 6 or 7 subtests the EP looked at e.g. core scales, achievement scales, or diagnostic scales. They look at very different skills. The fact that he couldn't access them independently is very significant as Indigo has pointed out. It is really difficult to make out the difficulties he has from the information here, suffice to say the school probably wouldn't have asked the EP be become involved if they didn't feel there was a problem.

The fact that the EP couldn't 'guide' him in the test would concern me as it would suggest that he is highly self-directed to the point where he cannot / won't follow adult instruction. Are school concerned about his attainment?

as others have said, why was he tested?
with the limited info available, i would be suspecting add, but you are clearly concerned about dyslexia for some reason, which does not seem to make much sense?
i don't know anything about bas though, so can't comment on what they were looking for...

that said - is he getting support from camhs wrt the physical abuse he has suffered? has he been withdrawing more recently? i wonder if it is all linked to the abuse and whether the tester was unable to 'reach' him and elicit cooperation as a strange adult?

i think in your shoes (if you don't know the answers to these questions) i would be making an appointment with his class teacher and senco and going through exactly what concerns they have - and maybe thinking about a camhs referral if he doesn't have access to a counsellor etc already.

Is this a state maintained school because EP time is like gold dust and not something a school would use unless they are very concerned OP. You need to talk to the school and find out why they felt it was needed.

The fact that the EP couldn't 'guide' him in the test would concern me as it would suggest that he is highly self-directed

Sorry - I meant that she could not offer any instruction/ hand holding other than the test materials themselves and reading out questions.

i wonder if it is all linked to the abuse and whether the tester was unable to 'reach' him and elicit cooperation as a strange adult?
Yes, this is exactly what she herself offered as an explanation.

I was wondering where I could find out more about the content of the test online as Google did not seem to produce much.

She suggested art therapy would allow him to discuss his feelings though not with a trained individual. DS is very cultured and well read compared to most boys at his school so unless the teaching assistant was also, they could feel that he is talking a load of nonsense really

mrz - Yes, it is a huge state primary, even if he has ADD, I really don't think clarification of this is likely to open any doors for him. He is achieving, how could it enhance that really?

i have had freinds who have used play therapists very successfully in similar situations, but it can be v expensive.

is camhs involved?

Peter - finding out whether or not your child has ADD matters hugely.

There clearly is a problem here bcsuse school asked for an EP assessment. But do you and school need tecmiques to help him overcome his abusive past?or techniques to help him overcome his ADD?

They require two totally different strategies so it would be helpful to everyone to understand what his main problem is.

So yes, even if he is achieving academically, understanding what his problems are will help open doors.

Thanks - I like to think that I am so tuned into DS' problems, the quality of the play therapy I provide is better than what the school could come up with - if it aint broke....

Indigo - I would not go down the meds route, he has fish oils, I am seriously looking at GFCF (which he practically is anyway) so I am really not sure what other cost-effective strategies they could provide? I think that I could fully support him in all subjects until sixteen. They were averse to both flexi-ed and home-ed.

It's not simple.

The more you research ADD the more strategies you will find that can help.

For example, some studies have found zinc supplements to be as effective as ritalin.

So, if he does have ADD, then zinc ( and magnesium ) would be suitable. Whereas if he doesn't than play therapy would be.

Which fish oils is he on? There is a huge amount of research going on to try and determine which fish oil is the best. It's very likely the one you're on is not the most effective one for him.

GFCF is not the only recommended diet for ADHD either. There's a huge number of different recommendations. Again a lot of research and trial and error on your part will be required to find out what helps him. If he has ADD.

You can also look into neuro development programs, vision programs and auditory programs.

A huge number of kids are misdiagnosed with ADHD when all they have is eye tracking issues.

So there is a huge number of cost effective strategies for ADHD you haven't tried yet.

Whereas the number of things you could try for abuse victims must be equally long and complicated.

You can't do the best by him if you don't know what his problem is.

He takes EyeQ as he could not stomach the Eskimo supplement. Whilst I am aware that there are strategies out there, I doubt that the school would be involved in seeking them out.

He eats a lot of seafood - would that not cover the zinc requirement?

You seem v knowledgeable - what would you suggest I should begin with Indigo?

Well, between my 3 kids, I have become knowledgeable about ASD, ADHD, Dyspraxia and Dyslexia.

I have spent the last 5 years researching these conditions, and am coming close to working out what my kids need. So that's an awful lot of 'trial and error' I have done.

My current top recommendations are Is That My Child and The Brain Food Plan but in 6 months when I've learnt more my recommendations will change :)

My current recommendations for diet are low sugar, low carbs, high protein, no additives / e-nums.

My current recommendations for supplements are:

• Vegepa
• Zinc

But I'm not sure these are things I could've started with. These are things that make sense after I've tried and failed with a lot of other stuff :)

I would def recommend starting with a proper eye test by a Behaviour Optometrist

I would say while a diagnosis brings very little help and support through school, it's helped me to know that I'm researching the right problem. It's helped me to not give up but to keep battling over the last 5 years.

And that has been the hardest thing to do. Your child is very young. You have many years of the education system ahead of you.

Many thanks - I'll look into some of these. Could I just ask whether your children continued in MS school or whether you looked at indies for specific issues?

Absolutely MS. I believe MS are far better set up to deal with SEN and inclusion than most private schools.

I don't believe small classes help.

Because the problems are in my children and not in their teaching.

So I have been (successfully) looking at ways to improve my children. Not blaming school for them not learning.

That was a very hard lesson to learn. I did change school. And I did waste an awful lot of time blaming school for my children's problems.

Changing to a better MS school was the right thing to do. But partly just because we all needed a fresh start after me spending so long blaming school.

If this school fails DD (which it may well do) then I will HE, not go private.

I absolutely refuse to send DD to a 'dyslexic school' and surround her with other kids who all have extreme literacy difficulties.

just as an aside - i didn't mean play therapy through school, i meant a professional play therapist.
ms if you are continuing to school, definitely.
we are considering he for ds1.

i'm quite interested in the behavioural optemetry too, indigo. ds1 has been doing this bizarre eye rolling thing on and off for a few months, but it's hard to kow whether it's just tiredness, an aspie type tic, a stim, or whether there is something underlying going on with tracking. i suppose it's the next thing i need to read up on, really.

But why is ms better than any smaller-scale alternatives for a child who thrives in a 1-1 situation? Ds accepts school, is not exactly reluctant to go in, but his confidence has only come after I got him to a certain level in the 3 Rs and quite frankly, he is socially abnormal more so than ever before. However, the children seem to like and accept him as a curiosity rather than a real friend I suppose. I dread performance type events tbh.

I would have loved to HE. Infact, for the short periods of time that I did HE, Ds was a lot happier and confident than he had ever been at school. But def no support from the LA, the school and above all, DH (who in the short space of a month, became a monster at the flick of a switch and went from passionately supportive to making me out to be a freak for even entertaining the idea). Obv, given his joint parental responsibility, HE will remain a pipe dream.

1-1 support can actually be detrimental for some children ... unless a child has medical/physical needs that require constant care they need to learn some level of independence if they are to succeed

There are 3 reasons why I'm not a fan of small private schools:

1. Private schools just don't have to be inclusive. They can kick your child out any time they feel like it. Very few private schools will keep a child who has the difficulties you describe.

1. I don't see any real difference between 1:30 and 1:15. Neither of them are 1:1. The teacher still won't be able to give your son the kind of attention you say he needs.

1. Odds are twice as good he'll find a friend amongst 30 kids than amongst 15.

I am a huge fan of HE though :)

But I also think your child will be fine in MS - once you've got your head around what his difficulties are, and started to treat them.

If you put all the effort you've put into teaching him, into treating his problems, you should be able to make amazing progress.

I certainly have.