Y2 Maths issues - reality check needed!

[gabid]

I am planning to go and see DS (6) headteacher as I think that DS is being taught maths below the level he is at. Am I overreacting?

My DS was a little behind with his maths last year and in the summer I decided to practice with him a bit, and since September we have practiced a bit every day. He has improved little by little, but things seemed to click for him in the last couple of weeks. He adds and subtracts 2 digit numbers and knows his 5 and 2s time tables (and is keen to learn more times tables! ).

DS is in a Y1 group and last week I have seen one of his maths lessons, his book and asked DS what he had done in maths. According to this he orders numbers (words) up to 20, number bonds to 10, adding up with 2 dices, and I saw calculations in his book (3+4, 10+4). He worked well in the lesson, he seemd to like the fact that he can do it easily, but I don't think he is learning anything. Shouldn't his teacher notice if a child can do more?

I spoke to his class teacher (not his maths teacher). She said DS often doesn't pay attention and therefore wouldn't be able to do the work in the Y2 class. Also, she said there are 37 in the Y2 class and she doesn't always have a TA. Did I misunderstand that 37!?

She told me what she is doing with the Y2s and that I could practice that with DS (partitioning, giving change). I explained partitioning to DS this weekend and he seems fine with it, just needs more practice. So, I am teaching maths to my DS now and the school tells me what to teach?

I am planning to go and see the HT next week as I don't think this is right and that the school should teach him at an appropriate level/differentiate and make provisions for him (I feel I have been told: sorry we can't teach your DS as he often doesn't listen and the Y2 class is full).

Any thoughts?

Hi Gabid:

I think even for this early in year 2 it sounds like your DS is doing well.

Should the school be doing more - well I can only speak for myself, but yes, I think that if your child isn't being stretched they should try to either set more challenging work or move them up a group.

I feel for you Gabid - I'm also in a situation where I feel I'm teaching maths at home. However, our school is perfectly content for children to not have mastered their times tables (x1 to x10) by Year 6.

Our school seems to be content to leave a sometimes immature boy who tends to dream and not listen in a group of mostly Y1s who are still calculating up to 10 or 12. DS seems happy in that group because he knows everything and finishes first.

They have classes that are too big without adequate support, so where should DS go, they can't move him up because he doesn't listen to instructions half the time. I am not happy with that situation and I am seeing the Deputy HT tomorrow to find some solution for DS.

Joyn - I just had time to google app grids and af strands. Thank you so much.

Now I know that I am working working at a level 2b with my DS but have to check that he can comfortably do all the things listed for level 2a.

Now I know that at school DS is working at level 1b aiming for 1a (from what I have seen and heard from DS).

Now I know what I have to do and practice to move him on.

Now I know that DS is not behind in his maths (not any more) and destined for bottom set.

Gabid - I would push for more differentiation for your son in the group he is currently in , rather than try to get him moved into a group which is too large to comfortably accommodate his needs. FWIW it sounds like he is doing similar things to my dd1 (age 6 and in Yr2) and the teacher told me at parents' evening last night that she is in the top group and the teacher expects a level 3 from her by the end of the year. It doesn't sound like your ds is struggling to me, but it does sound like he is not being provided with appropriate work at school.

I went to see the Deputy HT yesterday. I wanted to know what DS is doing in maths, what level he was at and what I and the school could do to support him.

I don't feel I got any of that information really, just general stuff and she said that they don't give levels to parents, but that DS is slightly below the level they would expect him to be (last summer I was told he was where he should be - unlikely, as I am quite sure that he was more behind than he is now). I am finding a bit odd that I can't get any details.

For the moment we have left it at an arrangement that I see the classteacher every couple of weeks to ask what I could practice with him. Fine for now, but I find all that 'secrecy' a bit worrying. Where else is he struggling they are not telling me about?

My DS2 is in Middle set in Y3 (in a Y group of 91, so classes and maths groups are 30,30,31).

One term in, and they expect the middle set to KNOW 2,3,4,5 and 10 times tables, to be adding and subtracting to 100, to be able to do division as well as multiplication for the times tables that they know. They expect them to be able to tell on the hour, half past the hour, quarter past the hour and quarter to the hour. They expect them to be secure in how to make up different sums of money with the coins they are given. They expect them to recognise ALL 2-d and 3-d shapes. They expect them to recognise the nets of simple 3-D shapes. All by Christmas of Y3.

And this is the middle set, not the top set - sounds like my DS's school expects quite a bit more than this school. Bottom set in Y3 is working around level 2b, Middle set in Y3 is working around 3c, Top set in Y3 is working around level 3a right now. Is that unusual?

And 37 in a maths set. . I know top set classes are usually larger than bottom set classes but WOW!

Gabid, I've never heard of schools not telling parents levels before. That's odd! Schools obviously avoid saying he's third best in the class etc, but they should be telling you how they are doing in line with national expectations. Surely that's what part of having these levels is about? Sorry your meeting didn't lead to anything more productive.

Cat, sounds about right to me. Ds is yr 3 & working on 3a. The things you've described for the group working around 3c are the things he did in ks1. I'm sure they actually have done some of them before too, so it's probably not as much as it sounds, some of it will simply be consolidation & extension, (eg Dd is in yr1 & she's doing 2,5,10 times tables, +&- within 100, telling the time, money facts & 2d shapes).

They have to tell you. It may not be common practice for them to share their levels with you, but the data laws mean they have to let you see any information they hold about your DC.

The Deputy HT said there are 37 in Y2, so I might have misheard. But still, the classes are big (over 30 in Ds's maths set) and his class teacher said as much as that he couldn't be moved as the other set is 'full'.

In terms of levels, it makes me trust the school less and I still want to ask why they didn't tell me, but at the same time I want a 'good'ish relationship with the school. Also, I do think I worry too much (as a friend told me) - so I think for the moment the best thing to do would be to just practice a bit with him every day and let the class teacher know what I do with him and what to work on next. Next year he will go to junior school anyway.

Thanks for all your comments and advice.

The work he is doing sounds about right for a child working towards level 2. It is possible that some of the Y1 children will be at this level as well so don't really think the year group is an issue. The important things that you need to know are what level your child is at now and what their target is for the end of the year.

Gosh those class sizes sound enormous!
I had a simple approach to Maths at this level when I went through it with mine and that was to focus absolutely and totally on tables.
Someone once told me that NO child knows their tables well enough ( in other words they can always improve) and a child who can zip through their tables forwards, backwards and answer questions instantly will do much much better in Maths than one who doesn't know them so well.
Of course what they learn beyond this is also important but if you wanted to do some work at home with them I'd recommend tables.Iit's boring but essential and most people I think give it up far too early.... it is v hard work to keep going with once your child says they know them.
It sounds like they won't move your child up ( and I'd wonder what would happen in a class size of 37 anyway). Sometimes Parents need to take matters into their own hands.
I did a little Kumon with mine but then found a home study course called lessons in the post..... if I have done it right and they are still around then this link might work www.lessonsinthepost.co.uk I used them for Maths only so can't comment on anything else they do.