independent school fees - can you tell me what it really costs?

[givemeaclue]

Trying to work out costs for private school as there are admissions issues with our local state schools so may not be able to attend a state school in our area.

Can you please advise me on the following as I would like to get a realistic idea of costs?

School fees at our local independents are aprox £6000 per year per child and there is a 5% discount for the 2nd child so I make that around £11 700 per year (I have 2 children to attend)

this includes before school club at some schools, not others - what is the rough cost of before school club (I work 3 days per week)

What is the cost of after school club roughly?

lunch is included in infants not juniors, then it is £3 per day per child so thats £30 per week

school holiday clubs x number of weeks school hols (minus 5 weeks hols I get) x 2 children for 3 days per week - any idea?

uniform? - any idea roughly?

any other costs? -extra curricular activites? books?

I was estimating total annual cost of around £18k for reception class- is that realistic?

can anyone advise please - have looked at all the local websites for local private schools but none of them give a comprehensive fees/cost breakdown

thanks for your help!

lljjkk-Insurance is for three things BUPA,DD's possessions computer phone etc and would cover school fees if she was unable to attend through illness-kicks in after a few days. £70/term bulk purchased through the school is actually much better value than I could buy independently.

Do agree that many things like extra sports footwear is 'optional' but that is difficult when everyone else has it.DD went to an schools athletics meeting last week,almost all the kids from her school had running spikes,as did the kids from other independents,I saw no children from state schools with spikes-guess who was faster...it made me really sad.

£9k a year fees (Prep), illness insurance is £100 per year, uniform is £120 per year (I buy the expensive stuff second hand), all after-school clubs are free, school holiday club is £20 per day but only operates for about 5 weeks a year. a 2 course hot lunch is included in the fees, as are all books.

Trips are no more expensive than state schools - £300 for 6 days in France most recently.

My Ds's school has the option of paying your fees in advance for the year and receiving a 1.5% discount. We take advantage of this as it suits us not to be transferring money from our savings every 4 months.

We budget £10K per year and this is about right.

We also find a broad range of incomes / lifestyles.

There are the "mega-rich" living in their tumble-down mansions in 120 acres with the odd title here and there.

There are the "new-rich" - designer clothes, 4x4's, dinner parties, gym and shopping together every day (not my cup of tea)

And people like me - working, modest house, 1 good holiday a year, non-flashy cars etc.

Most people are OK - you can easily the avoid the ones who aren't.

I also pay for 2 dc:

£1430 a month for 10 months of the year includes lessons, most day trips and lunch + milk for both & 5% discount for 2nd child. Fees are the same for all school years (pre-prep & prep)

I also pay £8 a day for them both to stay in after school club until 4:45, if I want them there until 6 then it's a further £8 (for both).

Uniform was about £250 each initially but they need a lot more PE kit in year 2 from Sept and a complete change from year 3 (skirts instead of dresses and blazers for both). Girls have different dress in summer term whilst boys can stay in trousers (or shorts) but there are regular 2nd hand uniform sales and the new stuff from the shop is comparable in price to the uniform for our previous state primary (but much better quality).

There are a lot of optional (but strongly encouraged) extra activites to do and these all cost ££! I pay out for ballet & judo @ £50 a term each, chess @ £15 a term plus an assortment of non-school activities.

Be prepared for clothing going missing for weeks at a time! It's all very well having the little darlings looking cute in matching school coats but none of 'em ever seem to check the labels.

Factor in the cost of parties and presents, I swear we've attended a party pretty much every week all year and it gets expensive.

We're definitely at the poorer end of the spectrum for parents so be prepared to see some amazing houses for playdates! One of them was literally a castle. With turrets.

Just bear in mind that once you start you need to carry on as its very hard/unfair to pull the kids out once they are settled.

When DS (now nearly 18) started at prep school it was approximately 1,275 per term. Easily affordable. Then in year 3 it almost doubled and went up and up and up. His (full boarding) fees now in U6 are just over 9k per term. Fees went up over 11% last year. I've done a very basic calculation (which almost made me cry) and I'm estimating I've spent in the region of 75k over the years on his fees.

DDs school fees are considerably cheaper but school trips expensive. Trips on offer for next year are skiing at around 700 pounds and history trip (to New York and Washington) at about 1000 pounds.

...things we have cut back on:

food (buy cheaper brands)
holidays (not going abroad this year)
clothes (kids in uniform most of the time anyway)
DIY (we've had no carpet in the hallway since October and will not get any until July when we have the first of our 2 months off paying fees)

We are unusually hard up at the mo though as the week before deciding to send them to private school last July we signed a contract to convert our loft and are paying back the mortgage on that over 3 years (because when we took it out we had no school fees!). We are effectively paying out the equivalent of having 3 kids in private school.

Fees for 2 DC are 24% of our monthly NET income.

I think 20% of gross income is too much tbh. We have stopped paying school fees that were around 20% of net income and that feels too tight for us.

The other thing to remember is that school fees are due to go up at above the rate of inflation. If food/petrol also increase at a faster rate than salaries (my salary went up 2% last year) then everything will be more expensive.

Plus in my children's private schools, fees went up as they got more senior so it was alot more at secondary level than primary. (have you considered just paying for secondary btw, I have had children in both state and private primary schools and nothing has convinced me that private is worth it until about y5/6. )

There are alot of extra costs, for things like school trips, music lessons, drama etc.

We have decided that it isn't worth having a drastically reduced lifestyle to fund private education. Good luck in what you decide.

Also gave up the cleaner recently (£150 a month) and David Lloyd gym (£150 month). I agree that it's difficult to even think about leaving once you're in the system. I never planned to go private but we made a bad choice with our state school options and felt that it would be difficult to get 2 places in year 1 at a better school. I love the school they're in now but it is difficult financially at times and there is no way we'll be sending them to private at secondary level as the fees jump up massively. Luckily we're close to a good state secondary school.

Although I'd quite like to have our standard of living back to what it was I couldn't make them move school again now as 3 schools by year 2 would be awful so we are in it until the move to secondary (unless we have a financial disaster). I'm already almost embarrased about not going on to secondary as the school publishes where the year 6 kids are moving on to and 99% of them stay private.

I think it depends on the income Beattie.

We had four children in the independent sector and were spending about 40% of our income on fees, uniform, trips and extra curricular activities. We never really felt as if money was tight.

yes, I agree, 20% of £10k income a month is different to 20% of £3k I agree. Also depends on how much your mortgage payment etc is.

Having said that I do think y ou need a very high income to feel comfortable - my view is that I wouldn't pay for it if I had to make the calculations that the OP is doing.

If it's 20% of your gross income for them both, it depends on the size of your outgoings eg mortgage and the alternative schooling available. If you can afford the fees it's about how much value you put on your children's education vs holidays or cars etc

And doesn't everyone do calculations before making a long term financial commitment?

I now use state education and still value my children's education over and above cars etc.

Having said that I would not put my family into a position where they could not afford a family holiday once a year, I am sure that means I am now feckless.

Not at all. If you can afford it, it becomes about priorities. For you a family holiday comes first, for some people school fees comes first. If there are decent local schools available then I think most people would opt for the holiday. If the local schools are poor, then more would opt for the fees.

I think my point was not that you calculate whether you can afford large long term commitments, but if it is a close run thing so that relatively small amounts (e.g. lunches, after school clubs) could tip it into unaffordable, then you can't really afford it.

Just my opinion, having paid school fees for 10 years now. School fees are only going to go up, and as someone else said, it is difficult to get out the private school mindset once you are in it.

desperatelyseekingsnoozes why did you change to state education? I am also changing to state education for all but my asd son.

I went into teaching meaning that I now earn about 1/4 of what ! did previously. Dh could take on more work and we could cover the fees but it would be a stretch for 4 and we were not willing to sacrifice our family time.

We still pay for our stepson as he was about to sit GCSEs and we will continue to pay his fees through to a level if that is what he wants.

The others are all in state education.

We used independent schools because everyone we knew used them, we assumed - with no eviidence! - that all state school were like Beirut.

I am lucky that we have state schools that are good and we are able to top up with lots of extra curricular activities. I have some concerns about one child who is in set 2 for everything but the others are all doing very well.

as a few others have said there is a huge range of wealth in my eldests school.

There are a few in his class with no brothers and sisters, they have everything!! totally loaded (yes we have had a party at a house that i can only compare to a castle) but both sets of parents work hard, a few new money (football players) but my sons bestest mate, is one of 4, all privately educated, yes a big rambling house, but they holiday ever year in thier nans caravan! He asked is he could come to florida with us this summer (and he is so lovely if he were older i would take him) and we arn't doing Florida posh!!

Honeslty though it makes no difference, the children dont see it (though our eldest did ask if we could put his siblings up for adoption when he realised his one mate (no siblings) had an ipad2)

thanks everyone for the info, very useful and food for thought.

Our options are:
-stay here (we love our house and area) and trust in the council to put extra places on at the local school
-move (we are seriously considering this and have sold ours)
-if the council does not sort out the schools, go independent at seemingly a cost of around £10k per year per child totalling around £250k for thier whole eduction would need to make some cut backs that would not be major (due to the cost saving of £10k per year nursery fees and £6k per year overpayment on mortgage that we can stop) but could be more of a challenge when they are teenager and want the latest everything adn school fees are higher.

thanks for all your advice

Why can they not pay their own university fees?

And, just to add to the interesting discussion, its not just about education per se. We chose one of the (very good) state primaries near us over and above the local independents because we felt the ethos and values were closer to ours, and our (reasonably privileged) dds would get a more grounded start in life.
But we are very lucky to have good primaries in the borough.