Appealing for a school not stated as preference?

[cswilliams78]

Hello,

Hoping someone can help me with some advice here as beoming more confusied by the minute.

Currently trying to find a reception place from my child which is closer to home than the one offered (and now accepted) which is 3 miles away and not one of our preferences.

We think there may be a chance of getting a place at the school where DS attends pre-school, they have indicated that they have only received 24 our 30 acceptances for places - today is deadline day so really crossing our fingers now.

The school are being very supportive of our case and our actions so far we have, emailed the council asking them to change one of our preference schools to this school (we didn't originally state it as we naively thought it was too far away). My Husband is going to collect and fill in a form as it is a Church school (C of E) and they have their own admissions criteria.

The school has a criteria relating to health and social needs of the child and we are going to attempt to qualify on this based on my husbands chronic illness (which was diagnosed 3 days before allocation letter). We are going to argue that the current school place allocation places additional pressure on the family and could hinder DH's recovery (which is based around rest and pacing) which will in turn have a negative effect on the whole family including DS as there is allot of evidence to say that children are disadvantaged by parent's illness. We have a letter from a consultant confirming the diagnosis. We are also going to include the fact that DS goes to pre-school there and is familier with the setting, easing transition which I know is considered weak in appeal cases but school governors may be less harsh...I am hoping!!

This criteria sits just above distance so if the school accept us it should help us considerbly.

The complication is that the school have said that they know of 2 families who are appealing for places at the school and advised that we also appeal to ensure we also have a fair chance of a place should any be available.

I don't know what to appeal against or how? I know I can appeal even if not a preference but it is a 30 class size and am I right in thinking that this would not help my case? I don't think any mistakes have been made.

Also the council have told the school to give late applicants until the end of the week, are they allowed to do this where there is a strict deadline and competetion for places - it doesn't seem fair to me...

Sorry really long post but the saga seems to get more complicated by the minute ..I would be so happy if we could get DS in this school and I want to make sure we do everything in our power to help that happen.

Thanks

This is just a list of points as I need to be quick.

• At this stage you should be able to submit a fresh application for this school - you don't need to amend the application you made in January (or whenever). The School Admissions Code says this new application has to be considered without delay.

• There is provision in the Schools Admissions Code for schools/LEAs to give priority to children or parents with disabilities who would face difficulties in getting to more distant schools. Presumably this is the criterion which the school is using but (obviously) you need to be clear about whether the criterion does apply to parents or only to children. Include as much supporting evidence (from GP, hospital etc) as you can.

• If the school has a vacancy (with nobody on the waiting list) and you apply for it, they have to give it to you.

• If there is no vacancy and the class of 30 is full, your application will be refused. You will be added to the waiting list, which is held in the same order as the admissions priorities, so if you are accepted as meeting the social/health needs criterion that should place you near the top of the list. Obviously, you need to get on the waiting list ASAP so that you don't miss any vacancy that crops up.

• You can also appeal against the refusal of the place but, as you recognise, the scope for winning an infant class size appeal is very limited.

• As you also recognise, attending the pre-school is not (usually) a criterion for admission to a reception class and is not the basis for an appeal. The appeal panel will be made up of a mix of people, but they should not be governors of the school as they are supposed to be independent.

Hope I haven't missed anything, but I'm sure others will be along with more advice.

Thanks Panelmember that is really helpful information, reading back my message it doesn't make much sense, rushing in my lunch hour, mistakes everywhere, sorry, I will explain more clearly.

Both my council and another local one are only talking about change of preference at the moment and not separate applications. For two schools which I have applied for in another borough there is one place at each but I have been told I need to apply and then my application will be considered after the deadline for preference change (13th May) in a second phase of allocations - so I will be considered against anyone else who has changed or applied late since allocations, then I think they start waiting lists, none of the local church schools have formed waiting lists and won't until places have been accepted / rejected so I guess that is why they are still talking in language of preference rather than waiting lists..

My council are very adamant on the three waiting list rule and is the same council as the poster who challenged with the adjudicator so I am waiting to see what they come back to her with before pushing them on that point (playing along and trying to pick the 3 schools which offer more chance or a place).

I am not looking to appeal but it has been suggested if people appeal they will be considered before us in the process should places be available - that is not the case is it? I see our best course of action at the moment as being to try and get as high up the criteria as we can - which is what I referred to with the social criteria of this school and mentioning the pre-school as I think the decision about whether or not a case meets the criteria is with the school governors (when just for a waiting list case not an appeal, it is the schools own criteria).

Also this business of giving people until the end of the week to accept their places despite today being the deadline...that has got to be wrong and maybe something which I could appeal against? As it is a mistake or a breach of the rules of admission surely...

If parents are offered places based on a set of rules and one of them being to return the form by a certain date and they don't surely they forfeit that offer of a place?

Catherine

I'm sure panelmember will be back soon, but just to cover a couple of your questions

I am not looking to appeal but it has been suggested if people appeal they will be considered before us in the process should places be available - that is not the case is it?

The admissions authority cannot "keep" places back for successful appeals, that would be a breach of the admissions code:-
para 3.20 As soon as school places become vacant, they must be filled from the waiting list, even if this is before admission appeals have been heard... Placing a child?s name on a waiting list does not affect an applicant?s right of appeal against an unsuccessful application.

Also this business of giving people until the end of the week to accept their places despite today being the deadline...that has got to be wrong and maybe something which I could appeal against? As it is a mistake or a breach of the rules of admission surely...

Unfortunately not, in fact the admissions code says that parents MUST be reminded to respond before the offer can be withdrawn:-
para 1.50 Once an offer of a school place has been made it is only reasonable for an admission authority to withdraw that offer in very limited circumstances... If a parent has not responded to the offer of a place within a reasonable time, the admission authority must remind the parent of the need to respond within a further seven days and point out that the place may be withdrawn if they do not.

Sorry, OP, your thread title led me to think we were talking about appeals. I am still a little confused about what you're saying so forgive me if I again pick up the wrong end of the stick.

As you say, the first stage is to make an initial application for the schools.

My LEA does not do this second wave of allocations thing, so it's all alien to me. Here, places are allocated, accepted or refused and any resulting vacancies are filled from the original admissions list (which in due course becomes the waiting list, with any further additions/subtractions). My LEA also permits parents to join as many waiting lists as they wish.

I remain convinced - until such time as the adjudicator gives a ruling rather than just comments over the phone - that the waiting list limit is not defensible in law. Likewise, I am convinced that anyone in your position should be submitting fresh applications for new schools rather than tweaking the preferences you gave in [January], but if your LEA is intransigent on this, then you obviously have to go along with their version of the rules, for now at least.

Betsy is absolutely right - places aren't reserved for successful appellants and, in fact, LEAs/schools are required to fill vacancies as and when they arise and not to hang around waiting for the outcome of appeals. Likewise, the admissions code (as Betty says) requires LEAs/schools to give parents plenty of opportunity for responding to their offer of a place. The circumstances in which the offer of a place can be revoked are very limited indeed.

I'm just going to jump in with the number of waiting lists thing - I've responded to the schools adjudicator with the points made by prh47bridge and haven't had a response, sent another email asking why I've not had a response and included the information again - still no response! So unprofessional (I presume this is an official 'body' and not a charity or voluntary organisation?). Really disappointed with lack of response considering the time issue with this.

I think that the faith school are doing the right thing. They have had 24 firm acceptances and six have not replied. As Betsyboo says the admission authority has to give the parents formal notice that they will withdraw the place on a set date.
So I think you are doing all the right things, get on the list for the school at as high a priority as possible and then hope the 6 do not respond. After the cutoff date indicated to these errant parents the school will reform the waiting list in admission criteria order and the first six on the list will be offered a place. It is a committee of the governing body who will agree the admission order but the LA that will make the formal offer of a place.
Any appeal for a faith school has to be to an independant appeal panel, which is not the governors of the school.

oneofthosedays - The Adjudicator is an official body. I can only suggest that you keep chasing them for a determination on this issue.

Thanks for all your advice on the matter I really appreciate your time and expertise, this is such a mine field! I will submit the admissions form to the school tomorrow along with a letter and evidence as to why I think there is a social benefit to my DS in him going to that school. I am not sure I have a strong case but it is worth a try at this stage and it is a genuine concern, part of the reason this hit me so hard is because the news came so soon after diagnosis and it just makes things even harder ....

Sorry if I am not making much sense, I find the topic so difficult which isn't helped by the response I get from my LEA. I guess it is only right that the families are given another chance to accept their places, I don't know their circumstances so maybe my view was a bit harsh but considering all I ever think about these days is school places I can't imagine someone being late with their form!!!

I have had some positive news though, after myself and oneofthosedays contacting our local MP about the matter he has taken it to the local paper who have covered it on the front page. Our MP is Andy Burnham the Shadow Education Secretary so pretty influential support on the matter! The article says that he is going to set up talks with headteachers and council officials and they are hoping for a positive outcome for the families affected. I am not sure if there is anything they can do but it is nice to be acknowledged and it may also help to gather all of those in a similar situation together.