KS1 sats

[joanne7769]

Hello I'm new to the board, and wondered if I could please have your opinions, as I'm fretting over my DD's upcoming SATS next month!

She is seven, and I've just had a parents evening at her school. The school is a tiny village primary and she is very happy there. I have been told she has done a mock maths sats paper and didn't do very well at all. Wasn't told what level she achieved but I'm hoping she did make level one at least. I've brought a book on past sats papers and worksheets so I can help her at home, and I'm shocked at how bad she is. She knows her 2x tables, and can count in fives and tens, she is good at graphs and recognises 3D shapes, but that's basically it. She knows number bonds to ten, but only manages single digit addition and subtraction. I'm shocked she is so far behind, she would never be ready to achieve a decent score on her paper for next month!

So my concern is, what do I do?? Im not worried about the sats themselves, but am very concerned now about the school. I read with her and practice spellings every night, but now it seems we have lots of catching up in maths to do on top!

I expected better than this from the school! Am I being fair or are my expectations unrealistic? I wonder if I should change school, but it would break her heart!

Would value your honest opinions. Thankyou jo

I think you and the school are mad!
Key Stage 1 SATs are only done to confirm the teachers assessment of the child. Your daughter sounds absolutely fine for 7.

There should be no preparation (other than normal class lessons), this is why the tests have become non-compulsory, and they are not longer published.

You also do not want to artificially raise her score, as it will mean if she is having difficulties she is less likely to get the help she needs in year 3 and above.

Sorry but stop the test preparation, seriously she is 7, in a lot of countries (including those who do better on international tests) she would only just be starting school. Do you want her to hate school, or be terrified of failure/not matching Mummy's standards?

Is it specifically maths that you feel she is behind in Jo? How is her reading and writing?

BTW I do not think you are mad.

Thankyou it has done me some good to hear that! I sound terribly pushy, but I really am not at all. I've done no maths at all with her at home, and had a big guilty panic incase she was very far behind. I'm very relieved you believe her standard to be average. Thankyou for responding.

Thankyou lovecheese, her reading is average, I don't know how she would do in her sats, as her teacher says she has good ability but poor self confidence. She is a lovely girl and always tries her best, but I feel she is slipping behind and I'm wanting to keep her on course if I can! Hopefully I'll chill out and we will make maths fun at home, when we do practise together! So hard being a mum at times, I'm such a worrier!!!!

I am replying as a mum of three with a child who also attends a small rural school and as a primary school teacher.

I think it's really important that your DD is happy at school and if the teacher has mentioned confidence is an issue then this makes it more important than ever.

Personally I think that you have identified an issue you can help your child with at home and there is nothing wrong with this. Even in small schools the teacher time is limited and you can work with your child on a 1-1 basis. I think you do need to not worry about the SAT's themselves but focus on the fact that if you can help with basic number concepts then your DD will begin to have more confidence with her maths ability.

Does your DD find practical addition and subtraction difficult? If she can do the process with objects then it may be she finds the written form difficult (which is very common with KS1 children). In this case the workbooks would not do any harm as long as you talk about how she is taught at school and how she thinks she should work it out. Giving her time to explain her thought processes will help her work things out.

If you want any ideas for teaching a particular concept let me know. Good luck and don't beat yourself up for wanting the best for your child!

I am also a mum of 3 and a primary school teacher. I think it's normal to be concerned that your dd is not achieving what she should be achieving, But coaching her or putting pressure won't help.

Talk to her teacher and find out exactly where she's at. Also find out what levels her peers are achieving. If it seems that most are under achieving then I would blame the quality of the teaching. How does the school do usually in the league tables?

Thanks for replying, I really appreciate your opinions. Sadly as her school only has fifty children, only a few will be taking sats (ks1) this year, so I can't compare my DD to the others, nor the school with league tables. I have to put all my trust in the school, but really have no way of knowing how high the standard of teaching is!!

Please be honest does it sound like she is a long way behind? I know you don't have much info to work on!! I don't want her to be top, I just want her to be average. I can't see any reason why she would be behind, because I'm making good progress with her at home so she does seem to have the ability!

Hello again, Being totally honest? yes; and disregarding the fact that on the continent they don't start formal learning till 7, comparing it to my DD's school in England in 2011 I would expect her to know more at this stage of yr2.

Thanks for being honest lovecheese! Sadly my gut feeling is that something is wrong. Now I need to workout what to do about it. She says she is behind in literacy too, compared to some of her fiends. In some ways this is a relief to hear some of the other kids are doing well. I'm concerned the school has never approached me about it before, and that she has never had targets sent home. I've always just been so glad she was happy, but now I'm worrying Ive missed some problems!

You mention that your DD is average or struggling in literacy. This can have an impact on maths because if the students cant read the questions and interprete how they should answer they get it wrong, then it looks like they cant do maths.

At home we tend to ask basic sums, we dont give word questions, scenarios etc., if there are 12 potatoes and 2 children how many potatoes each would get get. Kids are often not taught how to answer/break down these sorts of questions then we wonder why they struggle.

We dont train/coach students at school for tests, they either know it or dont, and to put pressure on now will not help, it is too late. (We dont do sats).

Thanks Roadart, will try different ways of wording the questions. Does to be an awful lot though that just hasent been covered at school at all. Will have a word with her teacher Tuesday, and will hopefully find out some more than. Thankyou for taking the time too reply x

I don't think you need to be worried about SATS but perhaps have a word about her overall levels with her teacher. Tests do not suit everyone and to be honest KS1 SATS should be abolished in my opinion they are only there to serve the league tables.

My ds is in year2 and at every parent/teacher meeting the first thing I ask is "does he enjoy school?" No amount of testing and papers will help if they do not enjoy it. Learning is done best through fun, I really believe this. Even as adults we learn best when it is made to be a fun experience.

She sounds exactly like my 7 year old dd. Except yesterday I asked her what 7x2 is and she could not for the life of her work it out. After about 5 mins of lying on the floor and thinking about it, she came up with 15!

I too am worried that she is behind, although the school assure me that maths is her strong subject! I am waiting to see what she gets in her SATS because I think she is better at school than at home.

I don't think you are being unrealistic in your expectations, I feel the same way you do and am beginning to feel that i should have done more at home with her. Everyone said that year 2 is the year that a lot of things 'come together and just click' and I have been waiting for that to happen, and only now that it doesn't appear to be, I'm starting to worry.

She is also not a strong reader and like someone mentioned, I do wonder whether she can't read the questions correctly to know what is needed.

I am however not doing any SATS stuff at all with her, she is too young in my opinion and tbh it stresses me out and I don't want her to see that.

She will be going to another school in September though, my ds moved there in year 3 and has blossomed and is predicted to get marks way higher than those expected of him in year 2 of dd's school. I am hoping the school will help her achieve the same. This is a move she really wants to happen though and we have been waiting since reception to move her (head has promised to increase class size to 31 for her in Sept in year 3) as her brother and best friend go there. So I have no qualms about that aspect, but for you and your dd I can see why this might not be an option.

So yes, I would be a bit worried, because I am too!

Have you thought of tutoring? Please note that I am NOT talking about hothousing here or swotting for SATS, just a sensitive tutor who is experienced with working with her age group and can do a lot via games and fun activities. It might help build her self-confidence a lot and a good tutor should also be able to give you guidance on where to start helping her at home yourself.

As an experienced year 2 teacher, I would be concerned about your daughter's progress. Please note though that she does not need to be able to read any questions, because in the test the teacher can read any or all of the questions to her. However, the teacher cannot explain what the words mean or read the numbers or signs.

Thankyou so much for your replies, I appreciate them so much!! Could I ask, what would you expect her to be able to do maths wise at this stage, just so I know what to cover at home?

Joanne, the easiest way to see what is normally being covered in year 2 would be to get a year 2 maths workbook. Not necessarily to actually do the workbook with your child but for you to see what is being asked. W H Smiths have a big selection, but for informing about what is required at a particular age/stage, I like CGP. www.cgpbooks.co.uk/pages/productDetail.asp?book=MHR11

Joanne, it's all here.

Try this for a really easy example of the type of things she will need to know for level 2 (expected level in y2 but other levels are available)
nationalstrategies.standards.dcsf.gov.uk/downloader/32f2bc097749f45f7e09a1dc623ee848.doc

Thanks so much for the links! That's a great help xxx

joanne the WHSmith workbooks are really good, and as sarahfreck said useful for you to see what needs to be covered. They do them for all ages and key stages. My middle one enjoys them, has exhausted all of the key stage 1 stuff and is now happily working through kS2, but she's that kind of kid. Good luck and keep us informed of how you get on.

Ooh, BBC bitesize is also good to look at if she likes computers.