Urgent - I need minibus lap belt advice.

[vintageteacups]

Hi ladies,

Can anyone help me this morning - need to contact school about a trip tomorrow.

DD has been chosen to go on a school trip with 3 other students to a theme park to do a maths day. Have just found out that they are going on a minibus with one other member of staff who I think is a TA .

I spoke to the yr 4 teacher who I thought was also going and she said she's not.

I asked whether the minibus has 3 point harness belts and she looked at me in her 'blimey, you're a neurotic mother' way and said she didn't know. She said the head might know and it might be in the risk assessment but she thinks probably not.

Surely they should know!!!

Have copied this from the directgov website:
In minibuses under 2.54 tonnes unladen weight, children aged three and older must use the correct car seat for their weight, if available. However, it's not compulsory for the driver or anyone else to provide the child's car seat.

This surely implies that dd should have her booster seat?
Now, I know booster seats aren't supposed to be used with only a lap belt and the idea of her just using a lap belt horrifies me - I hate them and think they're dangerous.

Any advice as to the safety of no booster and only a lap belt - would you let your dd travel like this?

Don't flame me - I just want a general feeling.

Thank you.

Most modern minibusses have 3 point belts which are height adjustable so no need for booster.

Cool - so I need to ask the school to find out then.

anyone else???

I think most companies who contract to schools will have three point seat belts. I have never sent my dcs to school with a booster seat for coach travel. Adn yes you do sound a bit neurotic

When we take children on trips we do not take car seats but we do make them wear a seat belt. TBH it would be quite impractical to take booster seats/car seats.

(and I have never had a parent question it before and I have done loads of trips and I have never thought of it for my own children)

Our school minibuses all have adjustable 3 point harnesses so that booster seats are not required. There is a sliding plastic brake which is moved down to the childs top of shoulder height so that the belt fits correctly.

Some things concern parents and other things don't I guess and this (the lap belt safety issue) concerns me.

Is this the school's minibus? I'd be very surprised if the school's minibus didn't have proper 3-point seatbelts and I expect any company hiring minibuses to schools would also have 3-point seatbelts. My impression (maybe wrong) is that lapbelts have pretty much disappeared over the last few years.

If your dd still needs a booster seat (lots of Y4 children are tall enough not to) then, yes, send it to school with her.

I think lizcat it should be law for all coaches and minibuses to have those - that would be so much safer and much less worry.

Vintageteacups - i'm bit neurotic too! Had worry about taxis and no carseats. My brother went mad at me as with me at time and we all got into taxi and used ordinary belt on 5 year old and toddler on my lap with 3point belt over both of us. Apparently legal. All was well but brother cross with me!

Yes - she's in a high back booster currently. She's almost tall enough to have nothing but the height is actually 154cm not 134cm for increased safety (so someone on MN said).

The trip is a combined school thing for G & T students so some random minibus (not sure from where) is collecting and taking them so son't know what type/age of minibus.

i do believe one member of staff is all they need in the back of the minibus,BUT if there are male and female pupils going they should have male and female cover im going on what we do at sea cadets and the rules for minibus travel here plus they have a ratio for that age group of 1 adult: 10/15 dcs but as the others say the minibus has to be a 3 poin belt by law now too HTH

Really - where can I find eveidence that says the minibus has to have 3 point harness by law? Have you got a link?

I can only find the law that says after 2001 they all have to have seat belts - can't see where it says 3 point ones.

The school (via whoever's actually running the trip) should be able to find out for you, surely?

How long is the journey to the theme park? For me, I would probably take the view that, if it's a short journey, the fairly certain benefit to my child of having an interesting and fun day out with other g&t children would outweigh the tiny risk of being involved in a traffic accident. When my child does go on outings by school minibus or coach I don't give much thought to what the seatbelt arrangements are and trust that the risk assessment has been done appropriately.

When I suggested sending your dd with her booster seat, I imagined we were talking about the booster base, not a huge thing with a back to it. But each of us weighs these things up differently, and if you're still unhappy with the travel arrangements, don't give your consent to the trip.

I am sure that the school minibus will meet the legal requirements re seatbelts- ours all do and they MUST or we couldn't take children out in them. We have booster seats that we take if needed.

No - maud I didn't mean I'd take the high back bit.

I worry that the school will think I'm being precious again but it lap belts do worry me. DS (6) is small and skinny for his age and he's supposed to be going on a trip to the coast in a months time but if they are only having lap belts, I might not send him tbh.

Grockle - the legal requirements don't necessarily mean it's the safest option!

I've done a quick Google and only found that DfT advice from 2001 about seat belts being compulsory. As I said, my impression is that minibus companies which do work for schools and youth groups provide newish vehicles which have been fitted with 3-point seatbelts because (whatever the legal minimum) that is what customers expect, but if you can't get assurances about this then don't send your child. Don't worry about the school thinking you're precious or neurotic - they can't take your child without your consent and if the arrangements worry you, you're entitled not to give it.