Teachers - what are your views on education? Are you for a creative curriculum or more traditional styles of teaching?

[magdalene]

"There are two fundamentally different views of education. On the one hand, there is the emphasis on the child. The insistence that everything must be relevant to the child's experience and to the perceived needs of society. The argument that the teacher should be the mentor or coach who facilitates the growth of the child's understanding. The current obsession with personalisation. On the other, there is the belief that the school is an institution in which children are initiated by teachers, who are authorities in their subjects, into a body of knowledge which has no immediate connection to their lives or necessary relevance to the problems of society. I believe in the latter" Chris Woodhead

What are your views? I think education should be a combination of the two. I am concerned that the 'creative curriculum' has gone too much the other way and acquiring knowledge is seen as Victorian and dull. If you have inspiring teachers with excellent subject knowlege then they can make their lesson lots of fun!

Actually some secondary schools teach in a cross curricula way and find it very effective

Mrz, Oh god do they? How does that work as they have different teachers?

"I think it's just conceivably possible that some children learn better with the former method and some with the latter.

I think children should not go to school until 6 and not receive homework. At any age.

I think philosophy should be taught in schools and children should be encouraged to ask questions, not find answers.

And Chris Woodhead is a twat of the highest order.

And yes, I am a teacher."

What Tethersend said. And I'm a teacher too.

We're teaching our children in preparation for jobs which don't yet exist, but what we do know is that skills will be much more important than facts and general knowledge, as someone has already said - 4 year olds know how to Google and can find out anything they want to.

oldbatteryhen - is there more available online regarding the Rose Curriculum other than the Word files here?

We use specialist subject teachers in primary and it works fine.
From what I understand from the transition teacher Y7 pupils will have a class teacher rather than subject teachers and follow a primary model

Katherine the coalition government scrapped the Rose Curriculum when they took power (after Labour spent £?0000 publishing it before it had been passed by parliament) so schools should not be using it

It was announced last week that the new primary curriculum has been dropped by the coalition government. The curriculum was developed by QCDA building on the recommendations of Sir Jim Rose's review. All primary schools have received guidance on the new curriculum, and in recent months there has been some confusion about whether teachers and headteachers should implement this new guidance.

In announcing the intention not to proceed with the curriculum changes, DfE stated that:

?The Government intends to return the National Curriculum to its intended purpose - a minimum national entitlement organised around subject disciplines - and will shortly announce its next steps.

<strong>In the meantime, the existing primary curriculum will continue to be in force in 2011/12 and schools should plan on that basis</strong>.?

Yes, I know that mrz, but as oldbatteryhen said her school is working to that curriculum I wondered where they were getting their information from and whether it was available from as I'd like to see it :)

Because it is no longer on the QCDA website

Magdalene, the problem is that children learn in a quite different way at the age of 6 to at the age of, say, 14. And the function of primary school is not to prepare them for secondary (in spite of the views of many secondary teachers!)

And Mrz how dare the government change everything again! I (as a teacher) am so depressed at the thought of returning to the dreariest days of slavish adherence to the NC and 'subject disciplines' that we are contemplating not sending dd to school. Why should she be dragged down by the whole sorry system too?

But the point is her school is breaking the law by not following the statutory National Curriculum Katherine.

I have a nice pristine paper copy on my desk here but you can access it HERE click on the subjects on the right hand menu to download

Thanks mrz - I've got that (as linked to earlier) - is that all that was available?

I'm not wanting to access the info for teaching the statutory NC - I can teach what I like as I home school.

The whole of the new/ proposed /scrapped primary curriculum is there Katharine

www.dcsf.gov.uk/newprimarycurriculum/downloads/Understanding%20the%20arts%20final%20AoL.doc
www.dcsf.gov.uk/newprimarycurriculum/downloads/Understanding%20English%20final%20AoL.doc
www.dcsf.gov.uk/newprimarycurriculum/downloads/Historical%20Geographical%20and%20social%20understanding%20final%20AoL.doc
www.dcsf.gov.uk/newprimarycurriculum/downloads/Mathematical%20understanding%20final%20AoL.doc
www.dcsf.gov.uk/newprimarycurriculum/downloads/Understanding%20physical%20development%20final%20AoL.doc
www.dcsf.gov.uk/newprimarycurriculum/downloads/Scientific%20and%20technological%20understanding%20final%20AoL.doc
www.dcsf.gov.uk/newprimarycurriculum/downloads/Essentials%20for%20learning%20and%20life%20final.doc

Great.

We're teaching our children in preparation for jobs which don't yet exist, but what we do know is that skills will be much more important than facts and general knowledge, as someone has already said - 4 year olds know how to Google and can find out anything they want to.

We have always been preparing our children for jobs that don't exist to some extent. There is a lot of scaremongering in this area. And what exactly does 'skills are more important than facts' mean? Skills and knowledge are at least of the same importance.

I've also heard a few people say dismissively that anyone can google facts. And does everyone google facts? And do they find the right facts? And have they idea what relevance these facts have if they find them?

Is school all about preparing people for the workplace? I think there is a lot to be said for education for education's sake.

That first para was meant to be in speech marks.

The National Curriculum:

Knowledge, skills and understanding
Teaching should ensure that geographical enquiry and skills are used when
developing knowledge and understanding of places, patterns and processes,
and environmental change and sustainable development.
Geographical enquiry and skills
1 In undertaking geographical enquiry, pupils should be taught to:
a ask geographical questions [for example, ?What is it like to live in this place??]
b observe and record [for example, identify buildings in the street and
complete a chart]
c express their own views about people, places and environments [for example,
about litter in the school]
d communicate in different ways [for example, in pictures, speech, writing].
2 In developing geographical skills, pupils should be taught to:
a use geographical vocabulary [for example, hill, river, motorway, near, far,
north, south]
b use fieldwork skills [for example, recording information on a school plan
or local area map]
c use globes, maps and plans at a range of scales [for example, following
a route on a map]
d use secondary sources of information [for example, CD-ROMs, pictures,
photographs, stories, information texts, videos, artefacts]
e make maps and plans [for example, a pictorial map of a place in a story].
Knowledge and understanding of places
3 Pupils should be taught to:
a identify and describe what places are like [for example, in terms of
landscape, jobs, weather]
b identify and describe where places are [for example, position on a map,
whether they are on a river]
c recognise how places have become the way they are and how they are
changing [for example, the quality of the environment in a street]
d recognise how places compare with other places [for example, compare
the local area with places elsewhere in the United Kingdom]
e recognise how places are linked to other places in the world [for example,
food from other countries].

Excerpt from the Rose Review for humanites re. geography:

1. Breadth of learning

a. When exploring local, national and global contexts children should: 1. learn about the ways people, communities, places and environments have changed over time, and how they are interconnected 2. develop and extend local and global links through communications and collaboration tools4.

b. Through the study of people and communities children should:

1. find out about the main political and social institutions that affect their lives
2. find out about issues and take action to improve things in their communities and make a positive contribution to society
3. engage with different representatives from the community5
4. explore issues of justice, rights and responsibilities in their own contexts and the wider world.

c. In the study of place and space children should:

1. use fieldwork, first-hand experience and secondary sources6 to locate and investigate the geographical features of a range of places and environments, including their own locality, a contrasting area in the UK and a different locality in another country
2. learn about and develop informed views and opinions on local, national and global issues such as sustainability7, climate change, economic inequality, and their impact on people, places and environments in the past and the present.

d. The study of the past should include aspects of local, British and world history. Children should:

1. study the past in outline and in depth, covering different societies and periods of history from ancient times to modern day
2. use dates and vocabulary related to the passing of time
3. place events, people and changes within a broad chronological framework
4. use a range of sources of information8 and visit historic buildings, museums, galleries and sites.

E1. to find out about the key human and physical features of their own locality10, its location in the UK, and how it has changed over time
E2. to explore how people?s ways of life, including their own, change with location and time11
E3. about the links between their locality and other places in the UK and beyond12
E5. to investigate issues, express views and take part in decision-making activities to improve their immediate environment or community14
E6. to use the internet and other digital sources and simulations to find out about significant issues, events and people, and to explore distant and contrasting places
E7. the importance of rules and to recognise the difference between right and wrong and what is fair and unfair

They are almost identical in key study areas, which is something we have checked. We also like the early, middle and upper primary divisions.

The NC for science is more detailed.

We just like the breakdown of areas (arts, humanities, social, etc) - of course we make sure we're studying the right bits!

pointydog - yes, I agree. You can look up information on the internet or read up on a subject but if you can't apply that knowledge or understand its relevance then it doesn't mean much. Skills AND knowledge are both required. Perhaps education now is a reflection of the society we live in. Why teach children knowledge when we can hire cheap foreign labour from China to do the work? Or poach nurses or doctors from Africa for instance.
And why this idea that teaching knowledge is boring and children with dyslexia can't possibly access it? I am sure really good teachers already plan lots of different activities (pair work, reading, making things etc) so why this constant bloody obsession with 'learning styles'?

I don't think anyone has said that teaching knowledge is boring. What I have said is that teaching knowledge in artificial little compartments with no 'story' (context) attached to it, can be boring for children. Also, teaching at its best should be done with children, not to children. That is a very old-fashioned outlook (which is still apparently prevalent in many prep schools, which is probably why the present government is so keen to re-introduce it).

No I did not say that best practice is teaching DONE to children. Of course it should be done with children!!!! But there are going to be some occasions when teachers do have to teach a concept or two!! And that may mean - SHOCK! HORROR! - a child listening to the teacher. I don't knwo what the present government intend to do but I hardly think Labour did much to give ALL children the first class education they deserve.

Of course teachers teach concepts but often (most of the time) it can be done creatively - Science - forces taking the children outdoors with a parachute to experience wind resistance themselves or use a book? Variation - take part in the RSPB BIG SCHOOL BIRD WATCH or Geography - visit a real island or History - have lessons in a Victorian school room
Literacy/English encompasses everything we do but how much more meaningful to use to write a recount of a visit or a diary of your Victorian school day or a non chronological report of bird

Yes, I totally get all of that mrz. I am no way saying there shouldn't be any creativity in the curriculum - all excellent teachers inspire, enthuse and motivate their children (and they were doing that hopefully before this 'creative curriculum' was introduced) but the notion nowadays is that teachers are not teachers but facilitators and children have to find things out for themselves! I do not understand this at all. And this idea that SKILLS are more important than knowledge - they are EQUALLY important! And for children to become creative thinkers with original ideas and innovative opinions, they need to be taught knowledge as well.

I think for years (since the introduction of the NC) children have been spoon fed and didn't need to think for themselves. Children need to be shown how to use and apply the skills and knowledge they have been taught.

That sort of creativity has always been done by good teachers. I cannot imagine many people arguing with that sort of creativity within teaching.

Current ideas that do not make so much sense are learning styles and those extremely vague buzz phrases such as children's choice in their learning, learning should be fun and active learning.

Of course you have to teach concepts, it's just how you fit it into your structure. I find with my daugher (4.5) that sometimes I am despesperate to teach her a concept and she just won't hear me. Then the next day the concept actually fits into what we are playing/looking at/ watching on TV and she is asking me the question and is eager to understand. Creative curriculum is about setting up those situations in a way that is appropriate to the age and developmental stage of the children.

I totally agree with mrz that children are not encouraged to think for themselves; they just don't know how to start.