KS1 SATS Meeting

[Anice]

I've got my first ever KS1 SATS meeting in half an hour with all the other parents. Its a state primary in Surrey. Can anyone tell me what we should expect to hear about?

Ds2 has been able to do all level 2 work for maths for the whole year and he's well into level 3. I made a mistake last summer of finding a program that tutored him and he played on it for hours on end. It was the thing he liked doing most until the DSi was bought.
We lived abroad previously and I had to teach DS1 at this stage so I know he has covered the whole curriculum.
I met DS2's teacher in September and showed her what he'd been doing. Naively I thought she'd just test him for herself, prove to herself that I wasn't lying and set him work that he didn't already know back to front and inside out.
But she didn't. Instead she gave him the same as the rest of the class, so that at the parent's night last month she was able to report that he was at the same level as he'd been last July when his year 1 teacher had assessed him.
In the meantime, DS2 has played their game, did the work in class and went online and did 25000 questions correctly for level 2 material in an online maths program that the school subscribes to. He averages 50 correct answers a minute - its mostly just mental arithmetic.
I stopped him using the program that was pushing him on last summer (and anyway he'd rather play on the DS these days).
I have had to write this year off, whilst DS2 has been complaining of boredom, but what i have sort of been hoping was that if he scored well in the upcoming SATS tests then the school might be willing to teach him something he doesn't already know in year 3.
However I see the answer that he'd have had to have done the work in class, and as its still not being set (unless something has changed in the last month) then he's going to get rated as a 2b or 2a and he'll start next year doing stuff that he will have known fully for a year by next September.

We have just been advised that we are being externally moderated this year - for maths, science and reading. We will have to show evidence that we have covered the curriculum in all of these subjects - e.g. workbooks, app grids, reading levels.
Any school can be moderated this way at the end of KS1.

I don't see how the teachers at your ds's school are collecting this evidence from an online game! What else do they do? Has he got written numeracy work in books?

yes, he has. But the work at school is just what they give him. he is accurate but the work just doesn't ever seem to step up a level.

The teacher has split the class in two and DS2 gets the same work as the more-able half. Generally that's fine, but he's got a real ability in maths and so he mostly just does the set work and then helps the others on his table.

OP, maybe its a Surrey thing. we were sold study guides. so wish I hadn't bought them. useless. ds1(7), yr 2, has his in may, but we don't know when.
the whole sat thing is vile.

Its been a stressful year. Its why I don't like going into the school. I've either got to make a complaint to the governors or drop it.

I've been hoping to avoid the complaint and I was hoping something would happen where the school would finally just decide that he does know 2 x5 or 17+11 or what a rectangle looks like.

One of the bad things has been DS2 does not like going to school any more and plays on me most mornings, trying to convince me that he's sick. Sometimes, when i am unsure of whether he is pretending or not I think "what difference" as it would be a huge coincidence of that day was the one that he was actually going to get some fresh work to do.

We cheered when ks3 SATs were dropped. Ks2 SATs were heading for the chop as well ... Until the election!

Think I paid £30 odd quid for mine. Study book and question practice book, for english maths and science. What a twat. Ignorant, I had no idea, naieve. I have been ripped off. I am so angry with myself. most of the 60 parents bought them. many of us feel similarly pissed off.

Please I'm begging you, don't do it.

Oblomov - i didn't. DS is only 7 and that is approx 9 years too young to worry about exams IMO.
I understand why labour introduced all this testing, but I don't think it worked and even if it had worked, the disadvantages would have outweighed the advantages.

Personally I wish education could be de-politicised but I know this is a not-in-my-lifetime thing as the teaching unions are themselves politicised.

Interesting ... our KS1 SATS meeting focussed on not telling your child about the formal tests, not buying work sheets or making your child do them, and that the KS1 NC Level would be based mostly on teacher assessment, with the formal SATS only done as they were enforced.

Actually they suggested that the best things we could do to support our children were: reading at home, talking about what we'd read, letting our children use money, playing board games, weighing and measuring ...

So pleased we were not flogged study guides ...

Anice, SATs were introduced by John Major's Conservative government in 1991.

And, as has been mentioned several times - the tests are no longer important. Assessments are done by the teachers of performance in class. Our children find the tests fun.

Quick question, sorry, if a child was working often in class in numeracy with the "Top" table (hate the expression)but sometimes worked with the second group, due to wavering confidence rather than lack of ability, what kind of paper would they sit? Do you think the teacher would have them do the level 3 paper?

It would depend entirely on what level they were working at in class - if they worked on a day to day level at level 3, the level 3 paper would be given. If they were working at a 2a level, then the level 2 paper would be given.

The tests are there to show the teacher can use teacher assessment accurately, and to complement the assessment process. There would be lots and lots of other (different) evidence to show that the child worked at a level 3, or 2a, or whatever.

the funny thing was that when the teacher spoke at the meeting last week, she explained that the children would be given a level 2 paper and those who did well would be given a level 3 one. Then she looked at me and said, that any child who has been working at level 3 all year would just be given the level 3 paper.
If she was thinking abotu DS2 when she said that, then it begs teh question why she assessed him as not havign moved on from 2b when we had the paernt's night a few weeks ago.

Time will tell. All I can do for now is try to find a school that has a G&T program and a space for DS2 - so far that seems like an impossible task.

The statutory documentation for KS1 assessment states that children should be tested only once - this teacher is misusing the test materials.

Anice - you can put your child on the waiting list for every school you like. You never know how long it will take to get a place.

If you are really unhappy you can also HE while keeping his name on the waiting lists for other schools....

I am really unhappy but DH would not agree to HE on the grounds that DS2 needs the social interaction. Actually I agree with him.

All I really want is for him to be given something with a tiny amount of challenge for those 3 or 4 hours a week of maths. I am not ;looking for hot housing, but he does have my sympathy that he is still having to show workings for adding numbers up to 20 when he can do mental arithmetic into thousands in his head. Anyone would find that boring, wouldn't they? For English, History, PE etc., etc. I think the teacher is doing a better job than I could do.

The ideal would be that I take him out during the maths lessons and teach him myself but obviously schools don't really work like that!

Feenie, thanks for your comment, but surely if, as you say, a child is consistently working at a 2a would it not make sense to give the child a chance with a L3 paper? I know with my own daughter that it is often a lack of confidence in maths that could perhaps be mis-interpreted as a lack of ability, and certainly there are some "forceful" personalities, being PC, in the top group who could dominate a table. Is this something that I could ask her teacher about or will she laugh me out of the classroom? p.s I have a good relationship with her teacher and feel that we can be honest with each other.

LoveCheese - she can't give your DD a L3 on the basis of one test paper. She has to demonstrate she is consistently working at a L3 in class....

Then why sit the bloody tests then? seems utter madness to me! So just suppose a child was working at a good level, say a 2a in class, did try the L3 paper and got 100%, what then? would they still get a 2a? Not aiming this at you, Feenie, BTW!; surely the next logical step would be to do away with the tests completely.

"but surely if, as you say, a child is consistently working at a 2a would it not make sense to give the child a chance with a L3 paper?"

One piece of level 3 evidence would not a level 3 make! It may indicate that a child was ready to begin working on some level 3 concepts, but there are much better ways of indicating this without giving an inappropriate test paper (which isn't allowed anyway - children may only be given one).

In the scenario you describe, lovecheese, all other evidence would also point to 'level 3ness' - Y2 teachers have to gather so much evidence that they really do know the children's attainment inside out.

Thanks, Feenie, I do feel for yr2 teachers and all the assessment and box-ticking that they must have to do. (So could I ask teacher if she will sit L2 or L3 paper? Could I then gather from her answer what her result is likely to be? )

My Year 2's are not told they are doing tests I tell them we are doing puzzle books to see what they have learnt so far and what I still need to teach them. We do not tell the parents when we will complete them and do not do them all in 1 week but over a longer time period. They are useful to assist the assesment that I complete on a daily basis. At the end of the day the test just help with the teacher assesment level that we give at the end of the year. Year 2's are still too young to be put under pressure at school or at home and I would feel very sad if any of my class felt this way. On the whole though the children actually seem to enjoy filling in their puzzle books!!

I don't think my year 2 son will really be concerned about whether this gets called a test or not. On the other hand my year 4 son has been doing SATS this week and has been extremely stressed by them.

I don't know why because I can't get him to explain what has been said to him but it must have been something to do with school because I didn't even know about them until he started getting angry over nothing in the evenings.