Decoding phone call from one of our primary school choices...

[kattyo]

Hello All,

I was called today directly by our third choice school. They are a faith school and said that the LEA had forwarded them the names of everyone who had applied. They wanted to know 1) details of religious attendance and more or less degree of religiousity (I'd forgotten to send in the form and I was perhaps rather too honest on the second bit of the question) and 2) Exactly where on the list I'd placed them (ie 1,2,3 choice). I asked them if my answer would prejudice whether I got a place or not, and they said no that they just wanted to get an idea of how many kids might actually get places (ie how many were first choices) and also start putting together a list of choices based on their own admissions policy. I said, does the fact that the LEA has contacted you meant that I have not got into my first two choices, and they have therefore contacted my third. The answer is apparently no.

My questions to anyone in the know is:

1. By being honest about my ranking have I prejudiced getting a place?
2. is it true that the LEA would have contacted them about ALL applicants irrespective of ranking - or does the fact that I've been contacted suggest we haven't got the first two schools.

Not that it matters I suppose - as I'll find out soon enough. I'm so tired of worrying about all of this.

Thanks!

They were being very naughty asking you what preference you placed the school. Could actually be basis for an appeal....

They are allowed to ask about religious practice though.

We've also been contacted by our third choice school, and also a faith school with a separate form that I didn't fill in at the time of original application.

I believe that they get sent all applicants, regardless of preference placing, and have to put them in order according to their admission criteria. It did cross my mind that it could mean we haven't got into either of our first 2 preferences, but logically that is highly unlikely.

Like you though, I will be glad to know for sure!

LEAs vary but according to ours, the LEA send out a list of everyone who applied, whatever rank they placed the school in, so that's genuine.

The school then makes up a list in priority order of the people who applied for that school, and they decide this based on their own criteria such as religious affiliation and sibling status and so on.

I have no idea about the ranking question, but I would hope they would not use this in their placing.

I'm not sure they are allowed to. They may just be conducting research as they said, though...there's no way they'll find out the answer to that q from all the applicants though.

the religion thing is within their rights.

Ours have already sent back their lists (had to be returned today).

The LEA decides the places based on the ranking I think. But schools put everyone in order of suitability.

To deal with the easy bits first, they are absolutely right that the fact they have your application tells you absolutely nothing about how you have got on with your higher choices. The school will receive all applications together regardless of whether they are first choice or last choice.

You should, of course, have submitted the supplementary form. As you forgot they are ok asking you the questions that were on it, but not anything else. However, they are defintely not allowed to know where you ranked the school. It is against the law for them to use the rank to determine whether or not your child gets a place. If you end up appealing for this school you may be able to use the fact that they have asked this question to suggest that they have not followed the correct process.

Thanks everyone for that - particularly prh47bridge

The situation here is that the faith school are their own admission authority. What that means is that they are partially responsible for the process used for admissions. They are given by the Local Authority a full list of all applicants who put down the school as one of their preferences but most importantly not what preference.

The admission committee of the school, which should be a number of governors at the school, then have the responsibilty of putting in order all the admission requests for the school using the admission criteria for the school. They then send the list back to the LA who do all the number crunching etc and decide which place goes to which pupil depending on the preferences given.

So you could easily have put down the school as third preference but if you live right next to the school and meet the faith criteria you could be actually number 1 on their list of applicants.
So by asking what preference you gave they are being very naughty and it will clearly become an issue at any appeal. The irony is that the school will actually know by now how many 1st, 2nd and 3rd preferences they have, that information is supplied to the school by the LA, but it will not give any detail of who. So the reason they gave is bogus, they were clearly wanting to know what preference you put down.

They are certainly perfectly entitled to contact you for clarification over issues such as the religous form and actually they should be applauded for that as it is better to sort any query out now than later at appeal.

You should not be worried about the other two schools, it does not mean that decisions have already been made. Until all schools, that are their own admission authorities, have returned their lists the LA cannot even start to do the number crunching, so no places have been decided yet.

Hmmm. the school isn't great at procedure. when I looked round I asked about their policy this year on deferring places for one term (as is the new law - place held if parent requests for term after child turns five, unless child turns five after april in which case child starts summer term etc). the headmistress - who is stand in - said breezily -oh well we wouldn't allow that, we'd never allow an exception unless it was a very late entry. I got the impression she hadn't actually heard of the change in the law (unless it doesn't apply to faith schools?).

very cheeky that they asked, then, and very silly of me to state my preference - i was just wrongfooted.

I remember when I applied the receptionist said to me - 'be sure to put us first' (I thought she meant because otehrwise you may be taken up by another school who is ahead of you, but perhaps she meant something different?).

ah well.

late entry = late birthday

multiple typos. so sorry. ahead of us - not you.

The right to defer entry applies to all schools. If you have a problem with them over this refer them to paragraph 2.69 of the current Admissions Code but be warned that the code on the Department for Education website is NOT the current one and only gives you the right to request deferred entry whereas the current code gives you the right to defer. I have notified the DfE of this so I hope they will fix that shortly.

This school clearly hasn't got a clue. The comment by the receptionist plus the question you were asked suggest that they are giving priority to people who put them down as first preference. They are not allowed to do that. This will definitely be something to bring up if you end up appealing for this school.