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Original poster

DD1 says her teacher tells her to mispronounce words

27 replies

ilythia · 20/02/2011 09:39

not intentionally I hasten to add, but she says all her 'th' words as 'v'. Everyone.
This is only recently (since she started reading) and I have corrected her a couple of times but she says that the TA who helps her read says it is said 'v', she is very adamant about this and has shown me how her mouth is supposed to go to pronounce it and everything.
She now gets upset if we correct her as 'you are wrong, Miss X is right, she is the teacher' so I have had to stop correcting it for a bit.

WTF am I supposed to do?

OP posts:
Original poster
ilythia · 20/02/2011 09:39

I mean not intentionally 'pronounce x wrong' she obviously (for some bizarre reason) believes this is how you say thingsHmm

OP posts:
mrz · 20/02/2011 09:49

or she has a speech problem?

I've recently had a student who says /th/ as "v" or "f" so wiv and fing not with and thing and found myself saying "put your tongue out"

Original poster
ilythia · 20/02/2011 09:55

Do you mean DD or the teacher? DD used to be able to pronounce it, it's only since this new TA started listening to her read and started correcting her pronounciation of 'th' words that she has started doing it.

Put tongue out is what it needs though, thanks (clueless with SALT stuffGrin)

OP posts:
piratecat · 20/02/2011 09:56

sorry,

the teaching assistant tells your daughter to say

eg. wiv instead of with

omfg.

speak to head.

Original poster
ilythia · 20/02/2011 09:58

yy pirate, that's it absolutely.

Do you think head? I am Not Happy but it is very common for the area iyswim. I just think it's feckign lazy.

And weirdly it only seems to be the start of words, so the, that and this are 'vuh' 'vat' and 'vis'

makes teeth itch.

OP posts:
Original poster
ilythia · 20/02/2011 09:59

if it helps she is 5, and hugely dramatic, so doesn't like being told she is doing anything wrong, hence me having to be careful correcting her (or she weepsHmm)

OP posts:
mrz · 20/02/2011 10:04

I mean the teacher my student was a student "teacher" not a child sorry I should have made that clear

Original poster
ilythia · 20/02/2011 10:08

that's okay, it's what I thought, but still, as a grown up you shoudl not be tellign children to mispronounce things? WOuld it be worth telling the teacher first to mention it?
This is what I am worried about, if sdhe genuinely believes this, or this is how she says it, I am going to look so snobby, aren't I?

OP posts:
mrz · 20/02/2011 10:33

I would just mention that you are concerned that your daughter has started saying "v" for /th/ and as you know this will cause problems with spelling later.

senua · 20/02/2011 10:42

Is there anything on the internet which backs up mummy's (and the rest of the world'sHmm) way of pronouncing things.

I would also cite the BBc's RP, my lud.

mrz · 20/02/2011 10:45

scroll down to th

senua · 20/02/2011 10:46

I wouls also "mention in passing"Wink to the teacher what DD has been saying. And then do a tinkling laugh to denote "kids say the silliest things don't they? I mean, surely a grown-up teacher pronounces things properly, non"
Or the alternate: earnestly ask because you are sure that DD has misunderstodd but ...

laosvher · 20/02/2011 10:53

Meet with the teacher after school or phone up.
Is it an area fing? Since DD2s making friends in Manchester she comes out with all sorts of fings and dat.
Not sure whether she's just trying to be all 'ard though Hmm

maizieD · 20/02/2011 11:27

I am too Shockfor words!

littlebylittle · 20/02/2011 13:13

Word with teacher first. It's not right and I would be concerned, but it's not one to go in with all guns blazing on. A student writes your instead of you're in dd's reading diary. I have mentioned it and teacher agreed it needed mentioning to student, but wasn't serious enough to get cross about in the first instance.

Original poster
ilythia · 20/02/2011 13:36

Oh thanks everyone. have shown DD1 that mr Thorne thing and she can say 'th' but said 'but we say 'v' at school so I think a visit to school is needed. Fuck knows when though as I can rarely get there, might have to wait for parents evening ina few weeks.

Glad to know I am right to be pissed off though!

OP posts:
AdelaofBlois · 20/02/2011 13:37

It is interesting you say it is only at the start of words, and that the words you mention (the, that and this) do not have the same /th/ sound as with (or the 'thing' cited by Mrz). They are indeed pronounced with the tongue not stuck between the teeth. But neither are they pronounced with the lips together as in /v/. I also can't think of any English dialect that pronounces these particular sounds as /v/ (wiv, yes, or 'de' but not 've') so I don't think this is an RP issue (unless the TA has adopted a comic German accent and can't lose it)

I think you should be gentle here because the TA's got in a mess here. He or she has been taught to show sound and mouth shape, has tried to work out what the sound is, and got it wrong because it is neither /th/ nor /v/. It should be mentioned, but not in the context of idiocy or poor English-it's a tricky problem and someone doing their best might mess up and value the support. Please bear in mind even very educated and cleverly spoken TAs are not always given the training their commitment deserves. Help, don't nag.

Original poster
ilythia · 20/02/2011 13:39

Not going to go in guns blazing as they are all lovely, teacher especially, but am not going to let it slide for sure.

OP posts:
Original poster
ilythia · 20/02/2011 13:40

at comic german accentGrin point taken, thanks

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DerangedSibyl · 20/02/2011 13:40

I had a similar problem at ds1's preschool.

I would work all weekend getting him to say 'this' and he would come back from preshcool on Monday saying 'vfis'.

So I booked an appointment with his keyworker, and she nodded away, then said "To be honest, I can't hear vfat vfere's much of a problem, but we'll work on it!"

And I walked out with my head in my hands.

cupofteaplease · 20/02/2011 13:43

Do you live in Milton Keynes?! So many of the children I teach say and read 'the' as 'vuh', it's so frustrating! Unfortunately, for the less able of these pupils it hampers their writing as if they cannot spell a word and attempt to 'sound it out', they resort to 'v' instead of 'th'.

mrz · 20/02/2011 13:44

My student has a speech problems and saw a speech therapist when she was younger for the problem Hmm

AdelaofBlois · 20/02/2011 13:50

It is also the case that these are morelikely to be mispronounced as 'vf' when stress is placed, because the lips are closed beforehand as part of a breathing process.

Personally, I think it admirably the TA tried to show sound formation (only one of the three I've worked with would, and she was a former SALT), and wonder what support he or she has been given in this, or whether they are just moving off their own observations of teaching during one-t-one reading sessions. The school should be encouraged to recognise the problem, but also to note it has rather a potentially very fine TA in its midst, and that all pupils would benefit from providing support.

AdelaofBlois · 20/02/2011 13:51

On german, apologies if you are a non-native speaker. I was trying to be funny, not have a dig.

OffToNarnia · 21/02/2011 07:44

Just to pick up on your your worry about looking snobby op. Different situation... At beginning of year 1 my ds started dropping t's in middle of words. Really annoying and he was clearly copying and thinking cool as relished the words as said them. In the end I mentioned to teacher just asking them if they could pick him up on it which they did in an amused way. But I had to be careful at pick up/drop off time as noticed a parent issue not just a kid one. Still feel like I was being bit of a snob but when he read 'The litter queen' dropping middle t's all the way through it was aaaggghhh!!!!!

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