Should I tel the truth about why my daughter is leaving her school?

[mummyloveslucy]

Hi,

My daughter is is year 1 of a private school. She has some SEN's and although they are doing their best, I'm aware that they aren't that experienced with SEN's.
She'll be moving to a state school that has excellent SEN's facilities and teaching.

She used to love school but now she's just resisting everything and dosn't want to go.
Her teacher wrote in her communication book that Lucy won a gold star for actually getting changed for ballet on time today so she joined in the lesson rather than spending the lesson changing. She has buttond on her shirt which she finds very difficult and on her pinnafore.

they also keep her in at break if she hasn't done enough work, despite the Ed Psych saying that her sessions need to be short and focus on quality not quantity.

I think it is just a lack of knowledge really. They have been so good with her until now.

I'm not sure wether to tell them the real reasons she's leaving, or just to say we can't afford it any more? At least that way, they can't try to convince me to keep her there and it'd avoid any awkwardness.

I don't want to sound un greatful for all that they've done for her either as they have been so helpfull in getting her a speech therapist and Ed Psych etc and I know they are doing their very best with limmited funding and knowledge.

She might be there longer than a term as we'll be waiting for a place to become available at one of our chosen schools, and I really don't want this problem of her not being included in ballet as she's not quick enough to continue.
I spoke to her about it and she said "There is no one to help me, I hear the music starting and I'm on my own and I feel sad". It's heart breaking to hear that from your 5 year old.
I've thought about velcro sewn on to her blowse and pinnafore to help with changing but I feel I need to say something about this.

I know I should probubly tell the truth, but if I'm honest, I'm a bit of a wimp and want the easy way out. I also want my daughters remaining time there to be pleasent for her. What would you do?

ps, were you LEM ??

When can she start at the state school, MLL? I have to say that, given the way you describe Lucy, I would be shocked if she didn't get a Statement. I don't say that lightly. They are hard to get, they are hard to get right, and you will need a lot of hand-holding and advice - we all did, so come over to SN board and we'll help you through it

You have no idea what you are doing for Lucy. You are giving her the chance to be valued for who she is, not shoved into a mould and turned out at the end.

How on earth is it meeting Lucy's needs to prevent her from doing ballet because she can't manage buttons?

Well done you - you are amazing I have wanted to be able to say that for...well 3 or 4 years, really. Now I can

Really hope a place will come up at the other school asap. I am feeling very angry on your daughter's behalf. And on behalf of the other little children in her class. What a vile message they are receiving- that we do not help when others struggle.:( I think you are a lovely person mummyloveslucy and you always see the best in people. I also completely nderstand your wish not to rock the boat. But tbh I wish someone would go in and wipe the floor with these people. There is absolutely NO excuse for their behaviour. None whatsoever. What they are doing is unkind and unprofessional. They deserve this to be pointed out to them VERY clearly indeed.

mummy - what about taking all the buttons off her shirt and replacing with velcro ( ase well as the velcro on her pinagfore dress) then she'll just have to rip the shirt open so to speak? If the buttons are underneath the pinny this won't show?

FWIW you are making the right decision. No child should be made to acknowledge or feel that they are not up to the mark of the other kids whehter academically or socially etc. And I do echo thte fact that 15 kids in a class is easy for a teacaher and if you're paying private fees then really they should be accomodating you and Lucy particularly better.

Can you remove her from ballet at the school and put her innto a ballet class ouitside school so at least you can be there to help change her?

By the way MLL, my ds is 6 and in Year 2 and he os still given help with his buttons when he gets changed for PE.

How awful that she can't take some basic shortcuts to make life easier! I only know about state school but in ours polo shirts etc are the norm. We have many, many children in wheelchairs and they are always included in all events - I don't know about SEN but have no reason to suppose it isn't the same. To my knowledge, no child has ever even noticed if their peers have mobility needs, they all just muck in together.

Despite all this my ds is struggling a little bit with getting changed for PE. He is your dd's age and somewhat petted at home because he is an only one, so doesn't routinely dress himself unless I lay down the law. His form teacher has highlighted this but I have pointed out he isn't 6 until June next year, so not necessarily fair to compare him with the older children. I'd be very upset if he was being left out of things, he can do all except socks and shoes (is convinced socks have feet, like shoes).

Encouraging independence is all very well, but it has to be tempered with what is reasonable for the individual child.

thanks everyone, especially Lougle. That's not the first time you've bought a tear to my eyes. [soft sod]

I've spoken to my husband and he's really upset about the ballet and says that he wants her to leave at the end of this term wether she has a place or not. (He's probubly thinking, before I change my mind again) There is no chance of that now though.

The two schools we like, don't have places yet but we're putting her on their waiting lists. We might home ed her if she dosn't have a place by January, just until she gets in somewhere.

Home edding her while leaving her on waiting lists is a good idea.

Also see if you can start the statementing process. If she has a statement naming a school, I think that school pretty much has to take her. Phone your local LEA about it,(and parent partnership).

I also agree that in state school a teacher will have 30 pupils, and will cope with SEN.

Hi Mummyloveslucy

I've read a lot of your threads over the years about Lucy. What's clear is how much you love and support her.

But I wonder whether you are too worried about things concerning her and possibly too quick to act. I recall that it was going to be a tremendous financial sacrifice to send her to the school. But I also recall that she absolutely loves the school.

Think twice.

Have you asked them to help her get changed? And have you spoken to them about keeping her in to finish work and what the Ed Psych has said?

Sorry, just not clear about whether the school have refused to help accomodate her, or if they're not seeing the problems.

I'm amazed that everyone else can get changed for ballet without help. Wouldn't happen at ds's school. In yr 1 it was expected that the teacher helped the class change for sport. Now in yr 2 they are supposed to be more independent but the teacher helps as needed. I still dress ds at home as he needs help (hypermobility). He can't do buttons, catches or zips. None of the boys would miss the sports lesson because they couldn't get changed in time.

As for slow working and being kept in at break. This happens a lot to ds and to a lesser extent others.

I wouldn't say the reason for leaving until you are actually leaving. Once you are leaving and have a confirmed place then I would tell them in detail.

You need to discuss the move with the Ed Psych to ensure that the new school is able to provide what your dd needs. I assume you are paying for the Ed Psych so you can ensure that their help is focused on what you need.

I think you can apply for the schools, then appeal the lack of a place because of your DD's Special Educational Needs, which can over-rule the infant class-size regulations for that year.

I would start a thread in Primary Education, asking for advice from either 'admission' or 'prh47bridge' (I think) they are the two appeals gurus.

Quattrocento- She did love the school and her old teacher was fantastic with her. She isn't any more, I don't think her new teacher understands her as well and she's being made to feel different.

It was decided that Lucy would do her phonics lessons with the year below. She was very happy with this and enjoyed her lessons, then the teacher said to her "we're doing our English now, so it's up to you if you want to go to reception for your phonics or do you want to be a big girl and stay with the class?" Of corse she said she'd stay, and the teacher was pleased that she did some nice writing.

It's a bit sad that she should tell her that i she goes to reception for her phonics, she's not a big girl. She dosn't have SEN's just to piss her teacher off FFS.

Sorry, just echoing what others are saying, but this school is an absolute fucking disgrace!
How can that teacher not rush to help your poor little daughter when she is so obviously struggling?
I taught a Year 2 class of 30 a couple of years ago and there was a girl who struggled to get undressed/redressed for P.E. I helped her for god's sake-it's part of my job! And for the record I'm an upper junior teacher who doesn't really 'do' dependent infants.
Good lord, are private schools really so unwilling to recognise difference and adapt to suit? I've had a couple of kids over the last year with SEN moving from private school to our very good state school; their parents were reporting that they'd been told that their sons were 'unteachable' .
Good luck to you and your lovely daughter and please tell the truth. I didn't have much knowledge of SEN when I started teaching, but I made it my business to bloody well inform myself, and so should her teacher.

I'm glad you've made a decision. I think tell them when you have a definite alternative place. tbh they probably won't try to persuade you to reconsider. They are simply not meeting her needs and are deceiving themselves if they think otherwise. Nice teachers are not always the best teachers for every child. Meaning well is not the smae as doing well. In fairness they may be better able to cater for certain SN (ie mobility issues) than others but Lucy's may yet prove more complex and they are already at a loss as to how to cope. If you find you feel strongly after you have moved, write to the Governors and Ofsted.

btw my dd's school also has a strict ballet uniform but she often runs late having eaten lunch slowly so just changes shoes. It should n't matter in the scheme of things yet they are making an issue over it at the expense fo her confidence and enjoyment - sums up the attitude really :(

I would tell the truth. My DS1 is in an independent school and they aren't very good with special needs. They have no idea how to handle him (suspected Aspergers) and consequently I'm currently home-edding (may do flexi schooling with their agreement) and considering my options (which aren't great as we didn't get any of our state school choices...)

You really must inform the school, in writing, of the reasons Lucy will be leaving. Financially you may be able to afford an inappropriate private education for her but Lucy can't afford to waste any more of her time being excluded because her needs aren't being met.

I'm a primary school teacher in a mainstream primary. There are 30 children in my class, at least a third of whom have additional needs. For 50 minutes a day there is a TA in class to work with me and to support those children.

The children in my class range from those able to do maths at the level of a 13-year-old to those who can't yet spell their own name. When we go swimming I have to assist a good number of them (they are 8 and 9) with buttons, zips, shoelaces, swimming hats etc. Would I ever leave one of them getting changed whilst the others got on with their lesson? Absolutely not if there was a single thing I could do in order to avoid it.

So, I teach 30 children with an enormous range of needs for every single subject and I manage it but Lucy's teacher has 15 children, one of whom needs additional support and her needs can't be met. Hmm...

You owe it to Lucy to be honest about the reasons she will be leaving.

I've been reading about Lucy for some time now - and I do remember that the school has been less than sympathetic in the past - I have an incident of her being ridiculaed for wetting herself in my nming - am I right? I'm sorry if I'm not.

And i seem to remember that she had a place at a brilliant local state school, but you changed your mind - is there a chance of her getting into that school after all?

Yes, she was told off for wetting herself. I can't remember exactly what happened but I remember I wasn't happy.

the state school she had a place at was good but not brilliant, it was our closest school. Although it had a SEN's unit, it wasn't rated ecelent progress for SEN's by OFSTED.

The ones I've found recently have been rated excellent for SEN's and care and support.

Her old reception teacher at the same school was fantastic with her. She helped her get changed, she cleaned her up if she had an accident and Lucy'd tell me "I pooed myself today, but miss X wasn't even angry." It's such a shame she can't have her as her teacher all the way through. She had such a good relationship with her and she made a lot of progress.
She's now on maternity leave but my husband saw her out one day recently and she asked about Lucy, and he said she seemed quite concerned and said "is she doing well do you think or are they telling you she's doing well?" That was a bit worrying.

You must say something about the ballet - it is totally unacceptable for a 5yo to struggle with changing and miss out.

But don't say anything about leaving because they might not bother with her much if they know she's leaving soon.