Is it possible for a child to have a reading level below a writing level?

[Whitestuffmum]

My daughter has just had school report including her SAT's results at the end of year 1. She is apparently a 1C in reading but a 2C in writing? How is this possible? At parents evening half way through the year we were led to believe she was a female version of Albert Einstein, but she has been kept on 'blue' level books for the last 6 months, hence her reading 'grade'.

It's certainly possible, but I wouldn't say it was common, most of mine have a writing level a sub-level or two below their reading one rather than the other way round.

Strangely I was talking to a friend about this yesterday. Her DS (5) can't read for toffee but his writing is really good - he can read his own writing but sit him in front of a book and he goes blank!

Very bizarre and very unusual but obviously not impossible!

If you're concerned then ask her teacher

Yes it is possible for writing to be ahead of reading.

Yes, usually have one or two children where this is the case.

Thanks for all your comments. I have spoken to the school again today and they have given her a test which puts her reading age at 7 years, 6 months. (Her real age is age 6 years 9 months). This brings her in line with a 2C/2B for reading. She has therefore been kept at least 4 colour bands behind in her books! I am FUMING with the school about it. The long and the short is her teacher just hasn't bothered to move her up. I think he has heard her read twice all year and otherwise left it to parent helpers. Just goes to show, you need to question these things. Grrrr!

Whitestuff mum, it is common for schools to encourage children to read books they can read without undue difficulty. They're not supposed to be at the limit of difficulty as fluency, enjoyment and reasonably rapid comprehension are important.

It applies to readers of all abilities, from top to bottom.

Does that help?

Yes I understand that, but my daughter brings a book home, reads it through with no difficulty and no help, I write in her comment book something along the lines of 'no problems', 'read with no difficulty' and then we keep the same book for often 2 weeks. The school have this policy that you not only have to read the words but you have to have 'expression' when you read. But my daughter has a shy character and doesn't like showing off when she reads. I've been giving the teacher the benefit of the doubt as he's new and is doing what he's been told. I had no appreciation that they would convert her colour band into a SAT level.

One of the other things that has annoyed me is I'd assumed she'd be a level 3 candidate for end of Key Stage 2 (I have 2 other children, so have a fair idea about this. Also she's on 'top table' for every subject so I know she's fairly bright). At this rate shes got to move up SEVEN sub levels in SAT's to acheive this.

I must say, what does help is venting my anger here!!! Thanks. I feel much better.

Any other comments though appreciated.

This is really appalling. The teacher assessment should be based on many, many sources of evidence - how could they have got this so wrong? You don't think it could have been a typing error on the report - 1c should have been 2c? And how can she be on the 'top' table but only a 2c. How do you know she is on the top table?

I was told she was on the top table in all subjects at parents evening, mid year. We were told then in 'teacher speak' that she was bright and ahead in everything. As parents we came away glowing with pride. Imagine my shock when I got this! I went in to see the teacher as soon as I got the report so its no typo.

I'm kicking myself for not questioning it earlier, but her new teacher is fab and enthisiastic and the kids love him. I'm kind of blaming the school, not him. for not offering him more support as an NQT. As I say, he's just been following this new policy, but obviously taking it a step too far.
The policy came about last year as a result of pushy parents trying to move their kids on too fast.

Just to add, my son by contrast, has managed to move up an entire level in reading this year from a 2B in Year 2 to a 3B in Year 3! I thought it was meant to be 1 or 2 sub levels a year? I thought "great, he's really progressed" and I really hope he has, but now I wonder what to believe?

Feenie - she's year 1 not 2 so would that mean a 2c would be on "top table"?

Yes, sorry, it would - I assumed you were talking about Year 2.

Whitestuffmum, I don't think you need to worry about your ds's school's teacher assessment based on runoutofideas's experience. Most schools moderate carefully to ensure levelling is the same across the school, and the LEA and OFsted check judgements too.

Huh? What experience? Or did you mean someone else....?

Whitestuffmum just said that after reading this thread, where your child was wrongly assessed, that she now wonders what to believe regarding her own son's excellent progress and the accuracy of levelling.

Still confused - my child hasn't been wrongly assessed.

Oh, I'm so sorry, Runoutofideas - I got you completely mixed up with Whitestuffmum. It must be end-of-term-itis! Sorry.

Don't worry - I thought it was me being a bit slow on the uptake...

Whitestuff mum, sorry, but you said year 1 and then something about SAT results. Did you accidentally mistype year 1 instead of year 2?
Trying to understand what's happening here so it obviously is important to know which year you mean.

In any case... been thinking about this, the levels you've been given will be drawn from a combination of tests and teacher assessments, as others have said.

The 2B slash 2C (which is it - that's a sub-level?) for reading will have been partly assessed from a test that involves the child WRITING answers to show its comprehension. Therefore, fluent writers favour better in this kind of test. I don't think there is a 'pure' reading test at this stage, as notoriously, many children can read out aloud text of impressive complexity without knowing what it means. This forces test methods that prove the level of comprehension either by getting a child to choose between a number of statements (so they can converge on the right answer) or by getting them to write a more open-ended answer.

My child's school does its own version of a SAT score for EVERY year group excluding reception, in Numeracy, Literacy and Science. In reading, they have I'm afraid based the score PURELY on her book band level and on nothing else.

After my questioning, they tested her reading age using the 'Burt reading test'. I came home and downloaded the test and tested her myself and came out with the same answer. I spoke to my mother in law who was head of another primary school and they used a very similar one called the 'Schonell' test. I downloaded this as well, followed the instuctions to the letter on how to administer the test and she came out similar at 7 years 8 months reading age.

I'm afraid you are all giving the school too much benefit of the doubt. Believe me I've been in 3 times about this. There has been no moderation at all and no assessment using a variety of methods. They have just got it woefully wrong.

The teacher, I can tell you is going to need a few stiff drinks this evening after what I said today!

There is a difference however between a reading age and a reading level. From memory the Schonell test is purely a measure of decoding, ie can you read these words. A reading level will be based on decoding and comprehension skills. There are a fair number of children whose decoding skills far outpace their level of understanding ( I'm not saying your child is one of these just that this can be a valid reason for a disparity between reading age and reading level.)

Whitestuffmum, please read some of the posts that explain how testing works. If someone said - 'Oh, my 7 year-old child is reading a book for 11 year olds', that doesn't that child will read it like an 11 year old.' Might (exceptionally) do, but probably won't. The reading level is a test based on comprehension, not just decoding.

I don't know what you said to the teacher, but you sound very pleased about it. I hope it works out.

The first 2 attainment targets in reading focus on decoding, and the other four focus on responses to text, authorial intent, etc.

But it's important also to note that a teacher assessment will not be all about written answers in a test, and nor should it be. Evidence to show a child can do something is not restricted to writing an answer in a test.