12 year old dd accused of corrupting her friends

[Ddwoes]

My dd has just turned 12. Her 12 yo friend showed her a site, which her phone has now blocked. It is clearly an adult site (not that the girls would necessarily have fully understood the implication of this). Dd doesn’t deny looking at the site and her friend doesn’t deny showing it to her either.

She says circa 6 weeks ago when she last went on it (only twice in total), it was populated by children, who they chatted with and some weirdos that she ignored. When I went on it to look, there were no children, rather pedophiles and exhibitionists.

Dd showed me that she cannot go on it anymore anyway and I suspect in the interim it has been flagged as a +18 / grooming site, hence why her phone has now automatically blocked it. This would also explain why there are no longer any children on the site.

Out of all her friends dd is the least interested in growing up. Ergo won’t entertain doing anything, which makes her more grown up eg shave pits / legs, wear deodorant or wear a bra. Not interested in alcohol. Behind her other friends in her viewing / reading like with films and books etc, right now would happily return to primary despite going into yr8. She had sex Ed in lockdown and any mention of that sort of thing is “wierd”. I hear what is being said amongst the children and I know a lot of what goes on (Clearly not everything) and she’s very happy to be a child.

The friend’s parents have accused her and the other, friend of showing this site to their 2 dds. The story is that she showed their 2 dds an image of a man masterbating on one of their phones, furthermore dd and her friend refused to shut the phone off. They are absolutely livid and for harmony I have apologised even though dd has vehemently denied being involved in this incident although clearly something did happen.

The mother of the girl, who showed the site to my dd and I will be sitting down with the girls together to have one more go to find out what went on in the next couple of days. Dd is a very truthful person and until now has always readily told me if she did something wrong as she knows dh and I are fair parents.

Obviously we’ve had the safety talk, more restrictions on phone usage etc. Any words of wisdom? Please be gentle. I’m disabled and not a well woman.

I’ve name changed obviously. Thanks.

[ScorpioSphinxInACalicoDress]

Well, tbf, it's your daughter's word against the friend's isn't it?
You believe your daughter that her friend showed her, the other girl's mother believes the opposite.
It's what 12 year olds do.
Now you threaten both of them if it happens again, the SIM comes out and they get a Nokia brick. And put it down to teenagers being teenagers.

[ScorpioSphinxInACalicoDress]

Oh sorry, just seen these are other girls that your DD and the other girl showed the site to.
That's a bit naughty.

[ScorpioSphinxInACalicoDress]

Nobody needs to sit down and make a huge thing of it.
A telling off, a threat, a "I'm disappointed in you" etc etc. I'd point out that some sites are so foul and disgusting the police monitor who accesses them.
You know what? They will do it again. They all do it. Eventually we catch them or not.

[Ddwoes]

Scorpio
Thank you for your replies. Good point about police monitoring some sites. Gosh. I never thought about that.

Of course it’s dd word against their dd.

It was the way it’s been done. The parents have been judge and jury over my dd and told me she was guilty, judged and criticised my child and my parenting. This is something we have never done despite it usually being their child causing issues.

I don’t want to make a huge issue of it at all. The parents have made a huge issue. Both my dds mum and I just want the truth if I can because of the way we are being accused as a family.

[Ddwoes]

Oops I changed the sentence half way through - my dds friends mum and I would like the truth.

[BluebellsGreenbells]

What good will come of sitting down with this parent?

What reason do the 2 DDs have to lie about it?

If you want it left, then tell the other parent you’ve dealt with it and you’ll not discuss it further.

[WhoWants2Know]

I possibly would make a big thing out of it. If they did show anything of an explicit nature to other children then they have potentially committed a crime. A brick phone and restriction on seeing friends would be a start.

[nogoodsolution]

OP, long experience of parenting teenagers (and, obviously pre-teenagers) suggests to me that the best thing you can do now is just let it all lie.

You cannot possibly know what your DD did or didn't do, or what the other girls did or didn't do. This is the world of teenagers. If you actually catch her red-handed, you can sit her down and talk all you like. But the world for Year 8s and onwards is a whole soup of she said/but she said/but she did this/but she did this first, and you are well advised to stay out of it unless you absolutely have to be involved (and there may well be moments where you do have to be involved - but this isn't one of them).

These things all die down very quickly and are soon superseded by the next drama.

My other thought, FWIW, is never, ever assume that your pre-teen/teen is always telling the full story or the whole truth. They are all capable of skating over the bits in which they don't cover themselves with glory, especially when it comes to things that they know you will be (rightly) cross about. Their brains are busily re-wiring themselves, and they do and say any amount of nonsense while this is happening.

Try to think of them as very big toddlers.

[Ddwoes]

@WhoWants2Know
The thing is my dd was shown something from the first friend. My dd denies showing anyone else. It would be unfair to punish her if she did nothing wrong. What the other mum (my friend) does is up to her.

@BluebellsGreenbells
What reason do the 2 DDs have to lie about it?
The girls get what I consider long and harsh punishments. Eg phone confiscated for a month.
I have told the other parents I’ve dealt with it.

@nogoodsolution
Totally agree about not getting the whole truth and toddlers.

Thing is the other mum (as I say my friend) also wants to know whether or not she should be apologising.

It’s shit after everything the children have been through and all the care and love dd and I have given these girls that it’s ended up this way. We presume the girls will be persona non gratis from now on and that’s a really really big deal for my dd. Less so for the other girl as she lives elsewhere.

[Ddwoes]

Thank you for your responses by the way. It’s heartening to hear that albeit we are taking this seriously, posters don’t think we are under reacting.

For me, I’m gearing myself up for when my dd gets older and how I deal with the teenage years. Much as dd doesn’t really want to grow up, she will despite herself and I need to protect her.

I’ve had a look around and much as it is shocking to read, the average age children are exposed to porn is 11. Children are curious and as parents it’s our job to guide them.

[Anordinarymum]

In my experience of being a mum of teenagers and dealing with them I would have to say that no parent wants to admit their child is the bad one.
They will point the finger at your child when it's clearly their child !

A long time ago some idiot in 6th form sent my 13 year old daughter a video of a man being beheaded. She showed me it and I was distressed and angry.

I called the school and they said they would have a word with the offending boy but also said that children see so much violence and sexual content on computers that it clouds the truth and hopefully she would not be too badly affected.

All you can do is talk to your child and make her aware that actions like this have a cumulative effect.

Good luck

[ScorpioSphinxInACalicoDress]

You won't know for sure either I imagine that it was definitely the other girl who showed your DD and not that they didn't find it together.

My own anecdotes- DD and her friend aged about 7 googling "naked ladies". Then a couple of years later DD being in hysterics that the police would come and get her for something else her friend and her had "found".

"Well, stop finding them then" seemed to do the trick. She's 16 now and not remotely traumatised but does remember the telling off and warning.

[nogoodsolution]

Just a further thought from me following your more recent posts.

*What reason do the 2 DDs have to lie about it?

The girls get what I consider long and harsh punishments. Eg phone confiscated for a month.

Tread really, really carefully here.

The ultimate aim is for young people to behave in a decent, kind, thoughtful, considerate manner. A lot of problems arise from "long and harsh punishments", the most common one being lying. If a teenager knows the punishment will be long and harsh, they will lie.

If they know the punishment will be fair (if uncomfortable) and a natural consequence of their misdeed, they are more likely to tell you when they have fouled up (which they will do).

You also have to separate the misdeed from the individual. Your DD may well be all the lovely things you describe - but even if she did show someone else a video of a man masturbating (which is just the kind of thing people of that age do, unfortunately), she is still all those lovely things. She will make mistakes, as they all do. I don't mean they shouldn't have sanctions for these - but it's a balancing act. Also be aware that teenagers are extremely resourceful, and if you confiscate their phones, they invariably find ways to have second phones, second or third Instagram accounts because they think we were born yesterday, etc, etc.

I have told the other parents I’ve dealt with it.
Sensible, as it shows a) that you're taking their concerns seriously, and b) it will help to let it blow over

[Ddwoes]

@Anordinarymum
Agreed about finger pointing. I asked dd about safety in general and safeguarding her friends, if anything else had happened. Not just these friends. All her friends. Dd said the elder of the 2 girls had agreed to chat on Instagram live with some foreign men. I gently told the dad and his response was that my dd was trying to take the heat off and said my dd had added a couple of boys on her snap chat. Dd has also denied doing this.

He saw it as meddling and I honestly wasn’t. Lesson learned.

@nogoodsolution
I totally can separate the misdeed from the individual. If my dd has done any of the above, I won’t be happy of course. But can deal with it. I’m not a prude. I get it.

I agree with the lying with harsh punishments, which is why Dh and I have a very honest and open parenting style with dd. She is a very truthful child and hates lying.

If a teenager knows the punishment will be long and harsh, they will lie
Yes, I know this and it is why I parent very differently from them.

If they know a punishment to be fair (if uncomfortable) and a natural consequence of their misdeed, they are more likely to tell you when they fouled up (which they do).
Agreed. Dd did something really stupid a couple of days ago, which has hurt another friend a lot at another parent’s behest. Complicated story. Dd owned up straight away btw. What dd did has caused a lot of upset and the two sister have taken sides against my dd.

Again Dh and I haven’t punished dd because she felt she had no choice. The lesson we want her to learn here is to check with one of us first. Punishment would have sent the opposite message. I was cross though.

[Ddwoes]

Dh said to do a Michelle Obama. “When they go low, we go high”.

[Bluntness100]

For goodness sake, all kids lie when they think they are going to be deep in the shit. All this”my child is so honest “ is just naive.

Op, just talk to her about what to do when she sees this stuff, how not to share it. For the other mum. Tell her your child denies it but you’ve dpoken to her about internet safety and appropriateness and that you’re as distressed by it as she is.

Then leave it there.

[Ddwoes]

Bluntness
I’m not saying dd has never lied. Not that naive. She’s never lied when faced with the truth and “Are you sure” etc. Agreed on what you are saying. Both the other mum and I have Spoken to our dds about what to do and which sites they are allowed on.

[BluebellsGreenbells]

OP it sounds like parents are far too involved.

Children DDs age need to figure somethings out themselves. What other parents believe of your DD won’t change because they will want to believe their children. The same as you do.

All that will happen is a big falling out with the girls secretly making up in the middle.

All these situations require is a short ‘I’ll speak to her’ or ‘I’ve dealt with it’ or something similar. They don’t need to know what punishment if any has occurred.

[Ddwoes]

Bluebells
Thanks. I agree the parents are getting far too involved. When I told my friend she’d shown the site to mine, it was taken as read that she would take steps. If I were dealing with parents like her or me, it would have been “oh shit, I’m ever so sorry, I will deal with it” and that would been the end of it.

But their mum was off the scale. She was vibrating with anger and I felt if I said anything to her, she was going to completely let loose at me. I was pretty scared tbh. She knows how ill I am and we’ve been really quite friendly so it was totally shocking to me.

My dh is really angry with how they’ve treated dd and me. It’s in stark contrast with our approach to them when we’ve had need a couple of times to talk about things their younger dd (same age as mine) has done.

What their father said is that the elder dd was in tears when telling him what she / they saw. Hence his comment that seeing something like this could scar them for life. I definitely got the impression he thought she’d been traumatised by what she saw.

The younger sister seems innocently curious about these things - she said something inappropriate in front of me. I spoke to her but didn’t feel it was something I needed to tell her parents at the time. Perhaps had I done so it may have triggered a conversation between them. But equally I feared they would just punish her.

These children don’t come with a user manual unfortunately and I didn’t want her to feel constantly “grassed on” by her friend’s mum. She is already really angry with my dd because as she sees it she gets punished whereas she feels my dd gets off Scot-free. That’s absolutely not true.

I was brought up with parents, who punished me severely and I it had a profound effect on me. As a result of my experiences, dh and I have agreed to have more measured approach.

[Ddwoes]

Just an update. Idk if anyone will read this. Thank you for your very good advice. I’ve spoken to my friend and said I was rather hasty about wanting the girls to sit down and talk to us about what they remembered from that day. This was about what we - really I wanted as parents rather than what was good for them. The main thing is neither of them were traumatised nor did they do anything, which could threaten their safety.

What with this and another issue I mentioned but haven’t gone into, this week has been a real baptism of fire into the world of teenagers!