Feeling pressured into sending DS to playgroup

[KittyTN]

DS1 will be 2y9m in Sept. He has been offered 2x 3hr afternoons per week. The playgroup has a great outdoor play area, a bit dingy on the inside (in the basement of a private nursery, Victorian conversion). Approx 22 2.5-rising 5 yr olds.

I am a SAHM for now with a 4 month old DS2. DS1 is quite challenging - only just starting to speak, fights everything - getting in/out of bath, nappy changes, getting in/out of car/buggy etc. Generally unbidable. I think a lovely boy but a bit of a tyrant at home.

I tried sending him to a local Montesorri preschool when he was 2y2m - first session I returned after 1.5hrs to find him lying down but with eyes open - seemed sort of shut down. Staff said he was just tired. Second time he was crying when I came to get him. Staff said it was because another child had been picked up early. I felt it was just too early for him.

I still dont like the idea of leaving him with strangers, however kind. I dont want him to feel abandonned or frightened that I'm not there or not coming back. Everyone says they only cry for a bit but what is so great about upsetting them needlessly anyway? Some of my friends seem to feel that DS1 isnt at playgroup because I have seperation anxiety. Possibly, but I'm also not convinced about the benefits of him going to playgroup. DS1 wont sit down for story time and still mostly parallel-plays. He liked the slide and trains but we have those at home. We dont have a sand pit and he loved that, we also dont have 22 other pre-schoolers!

What do others think? Is it best to wait until over 3? I dont want to hold him back from a positive experience but I just feel uneasy.

Do you take him to any toddler groups where he can mix with other children? I don't see why a 2 year old needs to go to playgroup without you, especially if you don't think he's ready.

Wait til 3 and then send him to nursery.

I have taken him a few times to a local Mum & toddler group but he doesnt seem to have enjoyed it much. At one point he lost sight of me and became very distressed.

We go to a weekly coffee morning, just a few mums in each others houses which he seems to cope well with - very happy to disappear and play with new toys. I have to say since arrival of DS2 he tends to check in with me more than he would have done previously and had a bit of a wobble went I left to load DS2 into car before coming back for him.

Missus why do you suggest nursery rather than playgroup?

Both of my boys started playgroup at 2.5, and they were more contented for having that little break from me, I think.

I am unusual in that I strongly believe that you should make yourself your child's world. Always give them something else to love too.

Go by what HE is ready for. As long as he is mixing plenty with other children in plenty of situations, there is no need whatsoever to make him go anywhere.

Why on earth would you make a child cry when you don't need to? If you had to send him because you needed to work to pay the rent or whatever, then fair enough, but why upset him? He'll come to independence eventually, if you force it you will only cause upset for both of you.

I would personally say that if you have a friend or relative that could babysit, it could be handy to have them take him for the odd afternoon, just so he is used to them in case of any emergency, but it isn't vital.

Sorry, that should read that I believe you shouldn't make yourself your child's world.

but butterpie, he hasn't cried. And if him crying because he is separated from his mother is tried at normal, nay commendable behavior, he will come to believe that being somewhere that his mother isn't is a bad thing and SHOULD be cried about.

I won't be sending ds (3) to nursery at all, and school is debatable. Don't feel pressured, do what's right for you and him. You know him best. As long as he has plenty of social opportunities, with children and adults of all ages, he will be fine.

Only mentioned nursery because you'll get the free 15 hours once he's 3, and there may be a nursery class attached to the primary school he'll go to.

Every child is different - some are raring to go to playgroup at 2, some would do better being with their mum and in smaller groups til they're 3 or 4. It's not necessary to send a 2 year old to playgroup if neither of you want to.

I would definitely take him to playgroups where you are there but not involved directly in the play first, so he gets used to playing without you.

I agree with colditz regarding the don't be their world thing. I never really thought about that being a minority view

If you wait until he's three and then plop him into nursery or preschool then might that not come as a bit of a shock to him? I thought that it would help my DS learn to share, and obey rules etc that are not just my rules.

If he's fighting you for everything then he might need to learn that the rest of the world will require him to behave a certain way too?

This is a bit too emotive a subject really, because only you know the way that you want to bring up your DCs.

Butterpie thank you. I am supposed to be taking him back for a trial on his own this week and have been dreading it. Friends have said 'they all cry to start with', 'they only keep crying out of habit'. My husband thinks it will give me a break, improve his language skills and it will 'toughen him up'. I got a bit cross with the last one. He's only 2.5 and by no means wet.
Colditz did you mean shouldnt make yourself your childs world? Did your boys struggle at the beginning? How did you know they were ready?

I'm a strong believer in waiting until the time is right for both of you.

If you desperately needed for him to go to playgroup, for whatever reason, then it would be worth working through this. If he were desperate to go, it would also be worth it. IMO the right time will come, but it sounds like this isn't it. Re your friends and their opinions on your 'separation anxiety' - pfft, frankly. (offers own opinion which you may equally choose to pfft )

I agree with colditz to some extent, but I don't feel that extending his world has to mean playgroup. Listen to your instincts with him. Maybe look for some gentler opportunities to extend his time away from you - grandparents for 1 afternoon a month? But what's the rush? He is not even 3 years old and he has just acquired a sibling. Again, listen to your instincts.

I tried sending DD1 for her free hours and it just made us all unhappy. She is very confident, will chat to anyone, will quite happily be left with anybody that she knows, will play with other kids in mums and toddlers, etc, but nursery was just too much.

I also noticed that she regressed significantly, with potty training, sleeping and with her general education- she started pretending not to know things until somebody "tricks" her into saying them- eg she will now only say the alphabet if you start it and get it wrong and she corrects you. Same with things she has known for ages like colours and animals.

She was tired and grumpy at home, she cried and we had to trick her into getting on the bus to go, she became more clingy, it was just awful all round. We are all much happier now.

(Oh, I am not yet a qualified SALT but the language skills issue is a load of old bollocks IMO. If you are concerned about his language, get him assessed by all means, but otherwise, the best possible place for him to improve his communication is with you, provided you can find 10mins a day to concentrate on him).

Oh, and my DD1 doesn't go to nursery and has excellent language skills. Her physical skills are another matter :D (I'm thinking she may well turn out to be a clumsy academic type in the end!)

Social skills don't just come from nursery/school you know...

(Sorry, can't stay away. Exactly what language work does your dh think that the playgroup will be doing with him and 22 other children, that you won't be doing with him and his sibling at home?? what does your husband think that SAH parents do all day??

My little boy hated nursery, he started when he was three, he used to get so upset when I was leaving him - the teacher's used to say, "just go, he'll be o.k." He wasnt. I only took him a handful of times and we were both so upset at leaving each other so I didn't take him again. He always said that he didn't want to go to nursery, only school and you know what, when he did start school at 4 he absolutely loved it! The nursery teachers still see me now with my 1 year old dd3 and say, "we'll have her soon"....I don't think so!

Nagoo Does playgroup teach them not to have tantrums? I know some nursery tots who tantrum spectacularly. Also why is playgroup now less shocking than playgroup in a few months time? Agree that this is potentially quite emotive.

Colditz it is absolutely not commendable to cry if I am not around. He doesnt cry when out with DH or my parents. I view it as a sign that he is distressed and therefore not desirable.

I never understand people who think that nurseries/playgroups can somehow educate a child better than a switched on parent.

They aren't the end of the world, most are very nice places where children thrive, but that doesn't mean you should send your child there if you don't need or want to.

Today my nursery aged DD1 has done gardening, writing, reading, counting, cooking, talking, building, playing and so on. We had a house day today but tomorrow we are meeting five of her friends to have a messy play/craft session. She goes to play at other houses without me. When she is at home I'm not hovering over her all the time - I work from home and have a baby to look after - but I am here if she wants me. She usually has a little nap when she feels like it and has a room full of toys and books. She spends at least two hours with other children on at least four days a week.

I don't see why I should mess that up to send her to stay in the same room with however many other kids and two teenagers with NVQs 5 afternoons a week then be tired and clingy the rest of the day. I'm lucky in that I work from home and have people who can take her for half an hour while I get something sorted out or whatever, so I don't think we need nursery at this stage in our lives.

(I don't think we will need school either, but that is a whole other issue!)

Maktaitai not sure that DH has thought particularly hard about the pros and cons. Certainly this playschool is more play than formal pre-school learning. I think he feels that DS1 will be pushed to express himself more with other children. BTW I'm not worried about his speech, I think he has a wide 'secret' vocab, if you know what I mean. A couple of DHs colleagues have toddlers who speak in sentences. I suppose he is comparing DS1 to them.

Hmm. Maybe I can take full credit for his good behaviour after all

I am a strong believer in giving children the independence to enjoy things without being attached to mummy.

My daughter was a nightmare as a baby/toddler. We were convinced that she would be diagnosed with some sort of Autistic Spectrum disorder. She would scream unconsolably if a stranger so much as looked at her and would not calm down until the person had gone. This went on for 18 months.

She was TRULY terrible. In desparation, I decided to try and send her to daycare for 2 days a week. She cried for the first two weeks at drop-off times (for no more than 10 minutes).

Since then the staggering improvement in her ability to deal with strangers/strange situations has to be seen to be believed. My daughter is a confident, happy little girl. Still a little clingy in unfamiliar circumstances.

My, rather long winded point is, is that sometimes children need to develop a sense of independence. I would suggest that by 2.5 years old, it's a good time to start.

PadmeHum- but daycare isn't the only way for a child to gain independence. They can start off going to larger and larger groups with mummy availiable, then friends and relatives houses with and then without mummy, and then classes or groups with then without mummy.

I don't really thing the solution to a "clingy" child is to suddenly leave them alone in a room full of children and adults they have never met. That isn't going to lead to the child feeling secure at all and unsecure child = clingy child. I think if most children are going to be ok with being left in a class, it needs to be built up to, and there is no rush if they don't NEED to go.

Agreed Butterpie, it's not the only way but for us it was.

We tried the slowly, slowly approach. If I was with DD, it was a consistent disaster. I tried activities (music, swimming, library), they were all an unmitigated disaster - I am reminded of when I took her to a music group and we are actually asked to stop coming because she was so disruptive.

I think there are most certainly cases where it does a child the world of good to realise that they can be happy and thrive under the care of other adults.

For my DD - it was our LAST resort. Fortunately it worked for us.