Parent rota- How do you do it?

[Ripeberry]

Our pre-school seems to have a bunch of parents who just don't want to help out as they need the time that their child is attending a session to do their "things".
I'm certainly NOT talking about working parents or parents with other very young children.
Out of 15 children 10 of them are parents who do not work, but trying to get them to put their name on the rota is a nightmare.
In our county we are NOT allowed to make up a rota and we can't charge the parents to get someone in to help.
It has to be voluntuary, problem is too many people think that means someone else will do it.
Yesterday was the crunch point when 7 of the parents who don't work were standing around almost arguing with each other as to who was going to stay and help.
They all just then decided to not put their children in that day and went home!"
Yes, we are the committee and the pre-school leader were pretty disgusted as well.
I'm in the process of writting a pretty stiff letter to the parents about it and to say that if they don't help then the fees WILL have to go up for everyone and in the end it will affect the working parents more (my view) as they would like to help but they can't and most of them don't even have familly nearby, they rely on the pre-school for childcare.
Do any other pre-schools have this problem and is your county council as bonkers as ours?
Sorry bit of a rant but i'm soo angry!

Oh, yeah and as a committee member yesterday i spent over 1hr shovelling snow to make a safe path down to the school and they were all giving me the "look" as if to say "you do it".
At least i had a better excuse not to help out than they did

our pre-school don't make parents help, we ask, but rarely does anyone volunteer.

How much are you charging per session? I've read loads of thread by you on how much you're doing for the pre-school, sounds like you are putting yourself out alot without much help from anyone

I'm on our pre-school committee(although have no dc their at present) and you do find so many people unwilling to contribute anything(help, time, donations of prizes ect), which IMO is very sad. It seems its always up to the same people.

I think it all stems from what you saw your parents do as s child. My mum was the playgroup leader and was on the PTA at my school so it never ocurred to me not to get involved. It's all for the benefit of the children.

I don't think many people realise that most pre-schools are charity run and need volunteers. I know that's not the case for your parents(from previous threads)

Not much help really, but wanted you to know I empathise and I think you're doing a fab job

Well our playgroup doesn't have a committee it is a limited company I believe.

But our system is at the beginning of term a form is pinned up with all the term dates on it for each day and you write down your name next to one date each term. That way we can plan ahead for childcare and there is not really an excuse for not helping.

Thanks Eddas for your kind words. I've done the letter and i'll get the flack tomorrow but at least the pre-school leader thinks its a good idea.
I just think some of the parents just don't like kids 'en-masse' in general and the thought of staying for 3 and half hours fills them with dread!
I've suggested that they can team up with another parent and to a 'split rota' where one does 2hrs and the other does the rest.
Eddas, how do you manage if no-one volunteers? Do you ever go over your ratios and have to close due to lack of help?

We charge £9 per session for non-grant children and £2 a session for the fee paying children.
We have to apply any fee rises accross the board, so to pay for xtra staff the fees would have to go up an xtra £1.50 at least.
Sherby, what about parents who work every morning, they have a good excuse not to help.
You must get some parents that will NEVER do it because;
a) They dislike kids and especially other peoples kids
b)Complain that their kids will get clingy and won't go to pre-school because they expect mummy or daddy to help out every day
c)They work and want their day off for themselves.
It's just such an old system based on SAHP being available.

I work at a preschool. We never go over our ratios because we have 4 paid staff for 20 children, so way above the minimum, one can easily go and make snack and we are still fine.

regarding parental help, it is difficult, and we ask that parents complete a CRB check too before they help in the preschool which I think can be a barrier to some. We just ask parents - and grandparents, if they would like to help, and stress the benefits to them of seeing what their child is doing, understanding more abouth their child's education, and how much children like it when it is their parent's turn to help.

is difficult getting a committee too, we really appreciate the parents who are willing to stand, hope you are appreciated, 'cos you should be!

You have to get the parents to commit to helping on particular days when they enrol their children for the pre-school. No commitment, no pre-school place.

I agree that the system is old fashioned though - SAHPs are rare these days, and the ones that do SAH are probably doing it because they are have too many other commitments to work.

What "help" do you want your parents on the rota to give? I ask because this "help" might be turning people off. For instance, when I did parent rota (years ago) it was full of washing up, cleaning floors, cleaning toys and very little interaction with my children and their friends. I dreaded it - and we'd be signed up to do it two or three times per half term.

Bonsoir, I think that from September any new people being enrolled will have to sign a declaration that they will help out at least once a month. If they consistently don't do their rota then they will lose their place.
Quite a few of the parents actually come from different areas and a couple came from a village in another county that has a policy stating that parents WILL help out and MUST be on the committee.
No wonder they come to us
But how on earth do you manage to afford 4 members of staff! We can just about manage two and they only get paid £8 an hour.

well, legally you need a level 3 with children at all times, so we have 2 level 3s on, to enable staff to go to the loo, answer phone etc., then at least half the rest of the staff must be qualified to at least level 2, according to EYFS - so we couldn't get by with 2 staff and 2 helpers. I am at present unqualified - am qualified teacher but it doesn't count - am 2/3 way through level 3 qualification, and I get paid

The help is that in the first hour they interact with the children, read stories ect, then the next hour they help suppervise outside play.
The pre-school assistant prepares the snacks with the help of one of the children, then the parent helper wipes down the table with anti-bac and helps to make sure the children wash their hands properly and with soap.
The parent helper sits down at the table with the leader and assistant and we all have a nice chat with the children and teach them please and thank-you and sharing.
Then the parent helper will do the washing up and sweeping up which won't take more than half-an-hour at the most.
They can then fill up the paint pots and interact with the children again.
Then they have a movement and dance session for 15 mins and then its home-time.
Not too gruelling i think.

Panda G, the cleaning and washing up is necessary and also what is the point of having qualified staff if they spend all their time doing those kind of jobs instead of interacting with the children.
I can still see what my daughter does from the kitchen and its great to be a fly on the wall

I agree taht the cleaning and washing up etc needs to be done, if we have a parent in that day they usually do it. My point was that legally we need to have the qualified staff in to meet the EYFS. We need a level 3 with the children at all times, so employ 2 level 3's so if one is in the office for any reason - seeing a parent, SENCO stuff etc, the other 3 is with the children.

I think it is really valuable for parents to be involved with the setting, helping, reading, playing and washing up. benefits the setting as an extra pair of hands, but alos the parent as they see another side to their child, and hopefully feel more part of the setting, children generally love it when it is their parent's turn to help also.

Well said PandaG. Just wish we could afford it

just happen to have been studying the benefits of parental involvement at college this morning!

Ripeberry, we actually have 26 children most days and have 5 staff members in every day. Infact we have no spaces atm for the new intake/people upping sessions after Easter so we're currently discussing opening 2 afternoons aswell. WE only open for 2.5 hours as that's all the government pay and non-funded children pay £8.50per session. Our hall is very cheap though(£5 per hour) which undoubtedly helps our costs, it's a local church hall so not ideal but alternatives are few and far between and more than double the cost.

our preschool leader decided that if she could avoid it she wouldn't force parents to keep to a rota as they would be doing it forceably rather than becasue they want to, I haven't actually helped out but then I do have a 22 month old so it's a tad tricky(as well as dd who was at preschool)

I'm chairperson of our pre school and we ask parents to help out once or twice a term (depending on how many sessions a week their child does). We have a rota and ask parents to sign up every term. Their child's name then gets a tick next to it on a list in the cloak room. May seem a bit harsh but we can't aford to employ a fourth member of staff, so rely on parent helpers. Some are great and others just don't want to do. For parents who don't do it we charge them a non-rota fee of £5 - this is added on to their invoice. Many are more than happy to pay it! Parents are made aware of this when their child starts pre school. We're considering a two tier fee structure - parents who don't help will be charged more per session.

In a recent parent newsletter which addressed the parent rota, we referred to the EPPE Project of 2004. This is what we said - it might be worth using?

"It is worth pointing out that an important piece of research into pre school education provision carried out in 2004 (EPPE Project), states that there are more intellectual gains for children in centres that encourage high levels of parent engagement in their children?s learning. The research recommends parents should be engaged in their children?s learning and share educational aims with them"

mayron - could you give me the details of the EPPE project - am doing a course and a reference to that in my assignment would be good!

But washing up and cleaning floors isn't exactly engaging in your child's learning though, is it? Love the idea of charging more for those parents who won't help but what about those parents who can't help due to little ones at home?

It's so difficult to accommodate everyone.

I think what parents need to reaise is that these pre-school's which run as charities are ones which probably in the past were playgroups like i went to where parents paid a few quid and a few mums run it. They are now chairties and employ people because childcarers have to be registered. They are charities to keep costs low and rely heavily on help. If you don't want to help then send your child to a nursery.

For those parents with young children, which for me was the case whilst dd was at preschool, it is hard to help in the session, which I think most pre-schools understand as the majority have children themselves. But you could help out in otehr ways. I am lucky that our preschool doesn't enforce a parent rota but I made sure I joined the comittee and have helped at all the events(sports day, bazaars etc).

'it will affect the working parents more (my view) as they would like to help but they can't and most of them don't even have familly nearby, they rely on the pre-school for childcare.'
how can 2 and a half hour sessions be used for childcare while you are working? or do you open longer than that?

compo, some people have a cm who takes the child, so the parent doesn't have anything to do with the preschool run.My cm will do this for me with ds, likelihood is I won't even see his preschool let alone be able to help! He will attend to settings though, so i'll be abel to help at one but not the other

Our preschool runs full days, so the free sessions are 2.5 hours morning or afternoon and working parents (and others) pay for the extra sessions, lunchtimes, before and after school club options, as they need. We don't have a parents. rota, just 5 paid staff. and a committee which I'm on.

It works well, I can sympathise with parents who won't or can't help out, I was always either working or at home with a younger child so wouldn't have been able to take turns on a rota.

I think the parent rota model is only going to work for a few families, and if you're using it then it should be very clear it's part of using the setting.

And the working parents or those wiht babies at home need a different sort of setting without a parents' rota.

Then noone needs to get frustrated with a model which isn't working.

why do the parents who work get away with it? that seems very unfair imo.

why couldn't you charge more to everyone then anyone who helps gets the session free. they could sign up at the beginning of each term. that sounds like a much fairer way imo.

it's like at our rowing club, the fees are low and everyone is expected to muck in. In reality it is the same old 10%. I don't actually do much there as i really don't have time (work, kids etc.) but i honestly wouldn't mind paying more, i'm not there because it is cheap.
i would rather pay more and not spend sunday morning doing "my turn" of cleaning the changing rooms!