Is anybody prepping for the scenario of no ambulance being sent?

[ThereIbledit]

Bear with me, but one thing that scares me is being stuck without an ambulance and paramedics in scenarios during which you used to be able to rely on them. The horror stories are normal reality now, elderly people are being left on the floor with a broken hip for 12, 24, 36 hours before an ambulance arrives, heart attack and stroke an ambulance may arrive within 3-5 hours. Broken leg, they just aren't coming. Now I've broken my leg badly before, and there was fuck all way anybody was getting me off the floor without a stretcher and entonox gas, let alone sat upright in a car. I have elderly parents who it already takes two people to assist to get up if they have a fall - it may sound silly to you but I live in fear of them falling and breaking something, because I think the only way to get medical attention is going to be getting them into a car somehow.

My first aid certificate is out of date, but I'm still fairly confident in my abilities (and work will update my training on that soon). I know where the nearest 3 defibrillators are, how to access and use them. I encourage everybody to keep good stocks of their prescription medicine in, I got a bumper first aid kit for my car for Christmas. My question is more, what else should a prepper think about having in stock at home, that we can legally have, that we used to be able to rely on an ambulance for? I was thinking about getting some kind of splint(s) and/or stretcher, for moving a casualty into a car.

TLDR: has anybody else thought about and prepped for medical emergencies that you would have otherwise have relied on an ambulance for?

He was category A.

DP has epilepsy. It's controlled but there is still a risk that he will have a prolonged seizure (the last time that happened was 2018 and it put him in hospital for 3 days). Not sure what will happen if he has one anytime soon...we can't prep for that. The best we can hope for is that it will be a "short" one (anything over 3 minutes is 999 territory), and keep our fingers crossed.

DH is a paramedic, I’m in a related field. Interesting question.

The trouble is there are so many different things that could happen it’s hard to prep for them all. And a lot will depend on how far you are from hospital, what kind of hospitals you have locally, how fit vs how frail you are, whether you can drive, what time of day it is etc etc.

A first aid course is mostly going to assume ambulances are available and teach you recognition, when to call and what to do while you are waiting. But it could also help you judge when you really need an ambulance vs when you can actually deal with stuff yourself if you need to, and of course will teach you stuff that will help you hold the fort while waiting for an ambulance/how to recognise the big problems.

Thinking about the people I’ve attended most recently some things I’d suggest are:

• elderly/frail, especially those living in enabled isolation or in denial, are by far the most at risk. Do everything you can to protect them. And there is a lot of unhelpful risk-aversion that means some end up on the floor for hours with no food or drink because they “might have hurt themselves” despite there being no reason to believe they have, when they would be much better off up and going about their usual business and/or having something to drink and being encouraged to wriggle and move at the very least while down there.
• get educated on when to worry about illness. Maybe look up the NEWS2 score and learn how to do it (it’s very basic patient assessment) and might flag up issues in early stages when they can be sorted
• Learn where your nearest heart attack and stroke hospitals are - they may not be your nearest hospital
• Have taxi money set aside and reliable local cab numbers just in case you need to get a taxi to hospital
• remember, pain is generally not a priority for the ambulance service - it’s your underlying condition that drives your place in the queue. A stroke (can be painless) will beat a broken leg (v painful). Stock up on pain relief.

I have a wheelchair in the garage (from eBay) and the phone number of a private ambulance service in my area. And a credit card with a £3k limit so I can pay for it.

❤️ thank you

so sorry for your loss

@FP1000 thank you ❤️

My advice would be incontinence pads, bed pads and disposable bed pans. All needed pretty quickly if a person can't be got off the floor.

@LadyGardenersQuestionTime

Interesting thank you for all that..

The trouble is there are so many different things that could happen it’s hard to prep for them all

Yep, agreed..I'll chuck v painful strangulated hernia into the almost infinite number of what if's.....

(crawl into back of car and get driven to A&E was the solution in our case)

Do private ambulances operate 24/7 in emergencies? I would have thought they just did pre booked appointments?

I have thought through how I would be able to move people if necessary...DH has an estate car with a very long boot, so dropping the back seats would work to fit someone flat. I have a camp bed that could be used to carry someone flat and lift into the boot. But you would need a number of people to be able to lift and carry a single immobile person safely.

I have actually built a stretcher from 2 poles and a load of ropes, or using 2 hoodies with 2 poles. It works. But it is heavy to lift and as someone being carried on it, it feels very unstable. So I wouldn't want to need to be carried far or down too many stairs etc. But while you would want about 4 adults (preferably 6) to do it safely, I know that a group of about 8 Cub Scouts (ages 8-12) with 1 adult directing and assisting can carry a 14 stone adult that way. When the "patient" is not in any pain and the floor to be dropped on (if that happened) is soft forest floor.

Don’t we need the code for a defib machine? So reliant on 999 answering in time to give it you?

I think one important prep is have someone not drinking at home so they can drive to a&e if needed.
My dad collapsed last week (heart) and no ambulances so we had to drive him to a&e.
My mum waited 8 hours for an ambulance last year and something like a bed pan would have been useful as the poor woman couldn't mobilise to use the toilet. It was awful.

Good point and on two occasions in the past 18 months when I've rung 999 I've just been put on hold ...

Maybe it was an allergy they weren’t previously aware of.

But also, it’s not that uncommon to have a serious allergy you are aware of, and still no epipen. The NHS seemed to get a lot more conservative about handing them out a while back — they must be expensive, I guess. I had to push to get one again after managing without for years; I’d been told to just “avoid the allergen”. And I had a history of anaphylaxis.

They only let me have one again after I had a close call with my allergen (a food) being in something it shouldn’t have been in.

I posted at the time and others had similar stories.

I'm not a prepper but I am an acute nurse and I know what I would have in my ultimate first aid kit

Analgesia and antipyretics (basics like paracetamol and ibuprofen, but definitely at least one opioid like cocodamol or nurofen plus. If you have children keep rectal paracetamol in the house because if they have a temp of 40 and are vomiting it's the best way to make sure they get a full dose).
Antihistamines and check all dates and functioning of epi pens if there is a user in the house.
Blood sugar monitor with strips and glucogel or dextrose sweeties.
Mask for CPR- though if it's a stranger currently advised not to do rescue breaths but focus on good quality CPR.
Ligature cutters
Torch
Either a tourniquet or something that can be used as a tourniquet
Aspirin 300mg- to give in acute chest pain.
A box of latex gloves
Ice/heat pack
Saline to clean out wound
Thermometer
Pen and pad- if someone has a seizure or a cardiac arrest make sure you note the exact time of event.
Some sort of gauze pads to hold to a wound if it was opening or someone was having a significant blood loss,

For falls or concerns about elderly patients; please spend some time on YouTube to see the best way to get someone up off the floor. They should not be yanked by the elbows but helped to a chair. Judge the move as you begin, if they are unable to weight-bear/you can see its a fall with harm sometimes the safest place while you wait is on the floor because they cannot fall any further than the floor. I would buy incontinence pants but also the square pads to go under. I'd check their pad 4 hourly or sooner as reqd and get a pillow and move it to each side every 4 hours so they don't get a pressure sore. Make sure they have pillows and blankets ready and don't bother with trousers. Just keep covered with blankets.

A defibrillator won't help you if it's a non shockable rhythm.

I have brittle asthma and this scares me shitless.

Recently, my wife, age 81, felt faint, and lowered herself to the floor, rather then try to remain standing and perhaps fall. I went to help her, and discovered how hard it is to assist a 112 lb person to stand, let alone lift her.

I could - maybe - just about lift a 100 lb barbell, but not a frail old lady. I'm no spring chicken myself. So, the question for me, if I wanted to drive her to the hospital, would be how do I find three or four strong people to move her.

It's a perpetual worry.

Some do some don’t: there are also lots of “hidden” defibs in offices, sports centres that are available some of the time. But yes, you would need to be directed and our ambulance trust will only send you to one if it’s within 400m of you (and it’s registered with them).

Good cpr is crucial too, a defib alone won’t help.

So you pre book one asap. You might have to wait overnight. It’s still faster than waiting for the NHS to show up!

New allergy, they were told this when seen at A and E. Antihistamine was given at the itchy rash stage but it still progressed but would have progressed quicker without it.

I don't live in the UK now but my parents do, I was talking to them both about this the other day. Mum has heart issues and Dad is very wobbly because of previous strokes. They have both accepted the fact that if something happens to them at home now that they will die because an ambulance will not reach them in time. The way they both spoke really upset me because they were just so accepting and matter of fact about it. It's such a sad situation in this day and age.

So sorry for your loss @Mammyloveswine

Have some foil blankets in the car. It can be a long cold wait if the fall is outside and a lot of hospitals are stretched so blankets arent always forthcoming when you do get there.