echogenic focus?

[babyonboard]

has anyone had a cardiac echogenic focus detected on their anomaly scan? it is an area of calcium build up in the heart, which is seen as a glowing white dot.
the sonographer picked this up, and said it is a soft marker for downs, but as my bloods said a 1 in 1'400 chance of downs, and i am young, it is nothing to worry about. there were no other indicators on the scan, and all organs are functioning perfectly. of course i still can't help but worry..and there isnt much info on the net. i can make an appointment with a foetal medicine midwife to talk it through, but don't want to feel like i am wasting her time. does anyone have experience of this or know the causes?

Hi bob, I hadn't even heard of this until I read your post, just wanted to bump this up for you, maybe others who are around later will be able to give you some advice.

hopefully the sonographer is right and that everything is fine. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you

M x

Hi Babyonboard, I had this picked up at my scan for DD. I was upset at first, but my risk of Down's went from something like 1 in 500 to 1 in 420 so I was comforted by the fact that the change in risk wasn't great. My odds are much higher than yours as I am an oldie. Anyway they told me at the hospital that they see this on scans all the time as the equipment is so sensitive and it is only if it is picked up with another marker is it considered something to investigate further. Bottom line is that my 21m DD is healthy, gorgeous and wonderful!

agree with oneofeach - I was at an already higher risk as I have a child with down syndrome when they picked up this in my scan with dd2 last year. Both the sonographer and the genetic counsellor went to great lengths to explain how commonly these are discovered due to the high tech nature of equipment.

As there were no other physical markers - and there are hard physical markers that can be found then it may increase your odds a little but not by much. With my dd1 ( who has down syndrome) they found a hard marker and so it was a given that she would have down syndrome.

Apparently the sonographer /counsellor said it was so common that they now have drawn up an information sheet to explain it to people.

My dd2 was not born with down syndrome - not that it would have bothered us - we chose to have our first daughter knowing she would have down syndrome and a congenital heart defect that required surgery.

With the echogenic focus - it usually disappears by the time the babe is born.

HOWEVER - if you are concerned or want to speak with someone - by all means make the appt to speak with the midwife..... you would not be wasting her time - rest assured given how often they find these - very often here - then you would not be the first and no doubt won't be the last person she would speak to about this. If it will reassure you - call her and make an appointment.

Hi babyonboard, I had this picked up on a scan and it scared the life out of me since my triple test had already given me a high chance of Down Syndrome for my age. I did have an amnio - all clear. Ds is four months old and totally healthy and gorgeous.

These soft markers cause so much unnecessary worry - I was told that the echogenic focus wouldn't have been picked up a few years ago (due to improvements in technology), or if I had been overweight, or.. or.. Do talk to the midwife if it makes you feel reassured, you certainly won't be wasting her time. All the best x

thanks guys..firstly to maddison for taking the time to 'bump' this for me, and for both of you with experience of this. the sonographer was wonderful, he was extremely thorough, so much so that the scan was well over two hours, and tried to reassure us that what he saw wasn't necccesarliy a concern (though of course me and dp were panicking like crazy). I am guessing his knowledge wasn't too great in this case as he sent us to get some food and come back 20 minutes later, by which time he had a colleauge there who fully talked it through with us. he told us the statistics..5 in 100 of 'normal popluation, 15 in 100 of downs syndrome babies have it, and 10 in 100 of the asian population have it..and likened it to the fact that he was brazilian, yet had blonde hair and blue eyes, which is uncommon but doesnt cause any threat to him. i know i shouldnt worry as my bloods were very favourable against the possibility, but it is nice to know that others have had the same scare.
it sounds awful, but this was very much an unplanned pregnancy which me and dp have fully taken onboard, and adapted our aspirations and life plans to acommodate, and i can't help but think that the pressure of a downs baby would crumble us. all credit to mums who face this..you are remarkable, but i don't personaly feel i aould deal with it, and would not terminate or have an amnio and risk miscarriage at this stage.

sorry- to add.. i have been trying to decide over seeing the midwife..i am sure she is very busy with mums who have far greater troubles, and all i can get from her is reassurance, so i would feel selfish taking up her time..

BoB, don't feel bad about pushing to see f.m midwife. After all it was their blimmin' test which picked it up... so do whatever you can to put your mind at rest.
(We had e.f. picked up at 20-wk scan too, along with another 'soft marker' for chromosomal abormalities. We went for amnio in the end; got all-clear. DS is now 6mths.)

BoB - echogenic focii were detected at our 20 week scan, too, (at a world famous foetal medecine unit). They told us that in themselves these spots are entirely harmless with no implications at all for the baby's health or well being, and that they are extremely common, but that they are slightly more common amongst DS babies - as your srtatistics suggest. But in looking at those statistics, you have to remember that very very few babies are DS anyway, so the 1 in 15 Down's babies has a tiny, tiny statistical effect on the likelihood of a baby with these spots having DS! Especially if there are no other hard or soft markers.

In the ned we did have amnio, but that was because DS was diagnosed as having talipes (club foot) and there is a tiny chance that the combination of echogenic focii and club foot could indicate some chromoomal problem. But had I realised then what 'soft marker' means, and how slight the statistical risk was, I certainly wouldn't have risked amnio.

if nothing else was spotted on your scan, and as your nuchal test results are so very positive, i thinmk you can relax, enjoy your pregnancy, and concentrate on the nice bits of expecting a baby - and congratulations!

thanks so much guys..its reaussuring beyond belief to hear others' experiences of this.
my uncles girlfriend is a midwife specialising in abnormalities (and i only just found this out,,would have been reassurance before!)and she too says its only a 'soft marker' and coupled with bloods is nothing to worry sbout.
i won't do further tests, as the risk is so low, and i wouldn't want to put my baby at risk.
and once again..thankyou..the reasuarnce means more than you can imagine.

I am so relieved to read all of your postings. I found out today that my 18 week ultrasound picked up a soft marker and it could be related to Down's. I really freaked out thinking the worst so it was good to know it is common and the fact that I'm low risk and baby is fine in every other way gives me peace of mind.

Everyone else has said it already but I just wanted to let you know that echogenic foci were picked up at my 20 wk scan and I panicked too. The sonographer tried to reassure me and said that they see about 5 women a day who have these foci and they usually go away of their own accord. She didn't tell me it was a soft marker for Down's. I found out after by looking it up online and of course managed to completely terrify myself.

Anyway, I don't know for sure yet as baby's not due until Oct but, as far as I know, it's nothing to worry about. I kind of wish they didn't tell me things like that...I could do without the extra stress!

I have just had a 21 week scan on my 7th baby with a finding of an echogenic focci in left ventricle. And have been quietly freaking out about it all.
I have never had this issue with any of the other 6, but understanding now that technology in the past wasn't as sensitive as it is today who knows if my perfectly healthy 11 and 9 year olds didn't have these and it was never picked up! I'm not Asian but my husband is a quarter chinese. There were no other soft markers. They spent so long on the renal pelvis saying there was a slight dialation in both kidney's measuring 3.5mm and 4.5mm. Almost asthough she was looking for another soft marker. Given babies bladder was full (kidneys are draining) my Dr said this is hardly dialation as 5 and 6 mm are considered normal, 7 to 9 is less than normal and 10 is of some small concern. The rest of my scan showed 3 vessles in placenta (DS Babies sometimes having only 2) brain and all other organs to be normal including skinfold measurment. I am also only 32 and have no family history of Downs. This has all put my mind at rest but not as much as all you lovely people writing in to babyonboard. Helping her by your stories of healthy babies being born after these scares will give me my first good nights sleep in the 4 days since I found out. Thankyou, we busy and expecting Mums need our rest and peace of mind!!!!!

Just to add about how normal echogenic focii are- our consultants have discussed it and given us the directive that if we find one soft marker that has NO other implications, eg. echogenic focus in heart, NOT to mention it as it is NORMAL when found in isolation. We quite often see slightly full kidneys (for us thats meauring 6 or 7 mm) in isolation, but as that has other implications we do look at full kidneys (AKA dilated renal pelvis/pelves) again at 28 weeks, when most are normal.
Its a tricky issue about whether not mentioning it is withholding information, but then we do not mention all the normal measurements (e.g. bits of brain, etc) as these come under us saying the anatomy looks normal. Seeing this topic brings home to me how much anxiety can be raised about a 'normal' finding.....
Good luck all mums

I read everything I could find on echogenic focus /foci / golfballs when my 14 week ultrasound revealed this in my baby's left ventricle. I panicked until he was born as I was told it was more common in babies with Downs Syndrome or other chromosomal problems and my risk factor was doubled as a result of the find. At his 32 week scan an abnormally large bi-parietal diameter (the width of the head between the ears) was found and this too could be an indicator of problems. I just wanted to reassure others that my baby was born with no heart or chromosomal problems and a normal looking head! - and is a healthy boy who weighed over eight pounds.

Well I'm not sure why, but I decided to login and write that my baby with 2 (supposedly soft signs for downs) was born in 2008 perfectly healthy with no issues with renal pelvis and no chromosomal abnormality. Since then I have had my 8th baby who also had an ecogenic fossii on left ventricle. I saw it as soon as the sonographer had a good image of the heart and said, "ecogenic fossii?". He said,
"yup, 2nd one today. Bet you it'll be gone in a few weeks. It's just the muscles evening out as they form. No biggy." I said,
"yeah, I know, my last bub had the same, wish they were this reassuring then." He said,
"off the record, it is absolutely ridiculous that this is a soft sign of downs when it is seen in isolation or just one other soft marker. I have not seen one case where the baby actually had downs in 10 years and I see this several times a week. And just as many with dialated renal pelvis. To think this information is causing poor ladies to risk amniocentesis on their perfectly healthy foetus."
Well my son was born 20 weeks later on April the 19th and he is now a perfectly healthy 8 month old baby with no chromosomal abnormality. I have looked on other sites and some chat threads go back 7 years without a single case resulting in a baby with any chromosomal abnormality. Straight hair and birth marks are also soft signs for downs. Half of my 8 children have straight hair and everyone of them have birth marks.This seriously needs to be disassociated with downs. It is causing stress in pregnant women and causing risky unnecessary procedures to be performed on perfectly normal pregnancies.
End of rant. ;)