Confused (still) about food during pregnancy

[foodfairy]

Ok, so I work in the food industry, this is pregnancy No4 and I really should know, but just have a couple of questions as Christmas is looming and I might as well have fun eating for 2!

1 You can eat seafood, sushi etc - the main problem with this is food poisoning, which while it will make me feel grotty, doesn't effect the baby?

2 You can't eat Stilton, brie etc due to listeria. But what happens if you heat them up? Also lots of cheeses are made from raw milk - Parmesan for instance. Am I suppposed to give this up?

3 Parma ham, smoked salmon etc. No idea if this is ok or not? Is is another case of causing food poisoning, but wont' effect the baby?

4 Rare meat - this can cause toxiplasmosis (sp?) but is really rare, surely if a real threat they would test to see how susceptible you are as they do on the continent.

5 Raw eggs - if eggs have a lion mark stamped on them they are supposed to be salmonella free no? So can I make into mayonnaise, wobbly custards etc

Thanks!

OK, I'm sure others will chime in with more/better info, but..

1 I think seafood is fine, if it's cooked. Personally I tend to have bad luck with prawns etc from restaurants, so I've steered clear. As far as I'm aware, food poisoning (i.e. salmonella) CAN be very harmful to the baby, as it has no immune system of its own yet. Sushi is out, although some (myself included) would say veggie sushi or sushi with cooked fish is OK. There is the possibility of cross-contamination by raw fish though.

2 I think soft cheeses are OK as long as they're made from pasteurised milk. You can get around this by heating them to the point where they're bubbling hot, which would kill any listeria.

3 Any cured/smoked meat is technically uncooked, so it's risky. Again, if you cook it (parma ham on a pizza for example) it's fine.

4 Toxoplasmosis is rare, but is it really worth the risk? I'd rather go without rare steak for a few months than chance it. Some sources say as long as it's medium it's fine, others would argue it should be well-cooked through.

5 The lion mark should guarantee salmonella-free eggs, so if you're making things yourself it should be fine.

There is a lot of conflicting advice out there, and some of it comes down to personal decision obviously, but hopefully someone will correct me if I've been less than accurate with anything.

The advice is to avoid soft and blue cheeses and especially mould ripened cheeses like brie because the high moisture and low salt content can allow listeria to breed. Although the risk is very low indeed, and dairies where these cheeses are manufactured are tested regularly for the presence of listeria. Pasteurisation makes little difference to the risk, listeria pathogens are likely to be introduced into the cheese after it has been made, so whether the raw ingredient was pasteurised milk or unpasteurised milk is irrelevant.

If you cook them you'll be fine, I am planning on eating lots of grilled stilton on toast this Christmas.

There is no problem eating hard cheese whether it is made from pasteurised or unpasteurised milk. The FSA says parmesan is fine, the salt content is high and the moisture content is low so it would be hard for bacteria to breed there.

Listeria is the only form of food poisoning which poses a specific risk to your baby. As you say other types will make you feel lousy, but your body is well-designed to protect your baby from them. Salmonella for example will make you feel dreadful (I think it may be particularly nasty for pregnant women, which is why it is worth making efforts to avoid it) but it will only harm your baby if you become severely dehydrated or malnourished as a result.

Am veggie so can't help much on the others.

1/ Prawns and seafood are fine as long as you trust their provenance. I love sushi so looked into this in depth - and its pretty much a no! The raw nature of the fish is a parasite risk which is only killed if fast frozen to below 50 degrees c. We dont do that in the UK, ever. Sushi rice is a risk of food poisoning, but again, depends on reliability of source. I would NOT go to Yo Sushi for example. Salmonella presents no risk to the fetus past the 1st trimester, it just makes you ill, and then there is risk of dehydration, which does risk the unborn. Salmonella does not pass the placenta.

2/ soft and hard cheeses are fine as long as they are pasteurised. Rind ripened cheese is not ok, even if it is made from pasteurised milk as bacteria enters during the ripening process. This means stilton, brie, camembert etc. But they are fine to eat if heated ALL the way through. Baked camembert anyone?

3/Generally best to avoid uncooked meats. Food poisoning and bacteria.

4/ solid cuts of rare meat are fine (another favourite of mine and this advise is sourced from the nhs book on pregnancy) as long as the outside is thoroughly seared all the way round. Beefburgers / mince based products should not be eaten if ANY pink in them at all. Same with chicken and pork.

5/ the lion mark does not guarentee salmonella free eggs. It does guarentee that the flock have been innoculated against salmonella, so it shouldn't be in the egg, but most salmonella is picked up from the shell of the egg and impossible to get rid of unless egg is cooked all the way through. Again, this is risk of food poisoning though so you take your chance.

Hope it helps. very confusing because they keep mooving the bloody goal posts!

Well I am on the continent and given totally different advice - my gynaecologist said - no spirits, no smoking and no raw milk or raw milk products - otherwise eat what you like with moderation , then followed by a lecture on pregnancy is a natural condition not a disease. Although we are tested for immunity to Toxoplasmosis as routine.
Mind you I applied this advice when I had ds in the UK also, it's one of those personal choices to make.

So I should (theoretically) be able to tuck into a menu of:

New Orleans fried oysters/Sushi flown in from Japan and freshly prepared by my personal chef

Baked whole camembert

Sizzling parma ham salad

Seared tenderloin (that's interesting about minced meat needing to be cooked through, is there a reason for that?)

Maybe chocolate souffle - is the risk in me touching the shell?

In my dreams! But thanks all, a quick post here has been more informative than all the many questions I've asked various midwifes/doctors/hv's over the years where they never seem to have any detail to let you make informed decisions. Lotuspalm what NHS book do you have?