Experiences/advice please - GBS Group B Strep

[MandaHugNKiss]

So, following my stay in hospital last week I received a letter through the post today to tell me the swab they'd taken has shown positive for Group B Strep (GBS). I now have a fancy 'Alert!' sticker for my notes and the letter tells me they advise I receive IV antibiotics during labour (ideally 4 hours prior to birth but at least 2).

Am I being silly for being upset about this? I know from reading the literature that this isn't something I've 'caught' - we all have gbs in our intestines but for about 25% of women it migrates and colonises the vagina, so in that sense I'm not ashamed or anything... but my hopes for a midwife led birth in the 'home-like' atmosphere of the birthing centre are vanishing before my very eyes (as it is, the stay in hospital was for a bleed because of placenta previa - so was already having to 'hope' the placenta plays nice and moves up and away from my cervix).

I know the important thing is that forewarned is forearmed - the baby would be potentially at risk and now I KNOW I'm a carrier we can take steps to prevent that but... but...

In addition to this, I have very rapid labours (1st was 5hrs 15mins start to finish, 2nd 1 hr 40mins) which is making me think the whole labour will have to be even more managed - going to the hospital, starting the IV and then being induced in order to give the anti b's enough time to do their thing (and as it is, I'm allergic to the anti b of choice - d'oh!).

Eh. I dunno, kinda just ranting I think. But also asking any of you who have experience of GBS in pregnancy/labour to share your stories, please.

willit Yes, that had occured to me re: penicilin and the baby, particularly as DP is also allergic - a good chance our offspring will be too, then, one would imagine.

You're right that, yes, it's important to take on board that preventative anti b's aren't a guarantee that baby/we'll be safe. Mollieos experience also demonstrates this - but it feel imperitive now that I take steps to prevent/reduce the chances of infection should I be one of the unlucky ones for whom the GBS causes a problem.

Also I can't help wondering if I was colonised when I had my first two children and was just fortunate.

Annie I'm really glad that a) I overcame my hesitance at 'starting a topic' (I'm fairly new to these parts ) and b) that so many have come forward with their stories. It's really helped me think through what is 'best' to do rather than simply wallow in self-pity; to realise that, actually, I'm fortunate to know ahead of time that I have GBS because... well, just in case. I'm also really happy that it's helping to raise awareness for those of us recently diagnosed with GBS or dealing with the issue again in a subsequent pregnancy. I really hope that given what we know now, and being prepared to take the preventative measures, our babies are born healthy and thriving. Good luck x

Babies happy both your little ones were clear. It's becoming obvious (and your experience backs this up, particularly with DC1), it's possible for GBS to not be an issue for the baby by either colonising rather than infecting or simply not 'touching' baby at all. I shall go and have a read-up about garlic - not that I will use it in place of but, perhaps, in addition to the ABs. It can't hurt to unleash a multi pronged attack on the little blighters, I'm sure Any particular resources you'd recommend I read re: garlic?

moaning Again, you're showing that GBS doesn't have to be an issue... but I can tell you're angry that you weren't warned about it. Indeed, it's shocking that nobody bothered to contact you and I'm so glad your babies were fine regardless.

tammy Thank you for adding your story too. Another positive outcome but tinged with regret/anger/angst that things weren't handled very well. This makes me even more thankful that I'm forewarned and my healthcare trust are obviously taking things seriously. I'm sorry your treatment wasn't very good and I'm sure I'll also be hyper-vigilant (read: worried sick) once this baby arrives despite doing all I can to prevent an infection... but happy you had a good outcome and hoping I get the same

Thank you mollieO for that link. I have just phoned and will have a test in the post within days which is just brilliant.
At least this way I can have peace of mind instead of always wondering if the doctor was right.

Your all a clever bunch!

Can someone explain what garlic protocal is? I'm curious. Does it work? Thanks

Really useful for me to read about all of these different experiences.

I would say to keep your immune systems as strong as possible. It won't get rid of Strep B but maybe give you a better chance of fighting it.

Re garlic - I have read that you are supposed to prick a clove, tie string around it and insert overnight. There have been some funny stories about the garlic getting lost and so good luck to those who are going to try it :0 . I don't think there is any research to sugest it is effective but it seems to have worked for some women.

Here is a link.

www.midwiferytoday.com/articles/garlic.asp

Before this pregnancy ended, I thought about taking high strength garlic capsules as they have strong anti-bacterial properties, however, they also thin the blood and so not a good thing in pregnancy.

Also, as you know anti-biotics can really screw up your system and so maybe think about a course of probiotics after to restore the balance of natural bacteria in the gut. Worth googling.

Copy & Pasted from a website :-

Garlic protocol:

Break a fresh, hard clove from a bulb of garlic and peel off the paper-like cover. Cut in half. A whole clove will NOT work. A crushed clove releases more allicin, but is harder to insert. Sew a string through it for easy retrieval.

Put damaged garlic clove in your vagina in the evening before you go to sleep. Many women taste garlic in their mouths as soon as it is in their vagina- so it is less pleasant to treat while awake.

In the morning, the garlic may come out when you poop. If not, many women find it is easiest to take it out on the toilet. Circle the vagina with a finger, till you find it. It cannot enter the uterus through the cervix. It cannot get lost- but it can get pushed into the pocket between the cervix and the vaginal wall.

Most people will taste the garlic as long as it is in there. So if you still taste it, it is probably still in there. Most women have trouble getting it out the first time.
For easy retrieval sew a string through the middle of the clove before you put it in- You don't want to get irritated in the process of getting rid of the GBS. Be gentle. Dot scratch yourself with long nails. Repeat this for 8 nights (around week 36). Or for 2 nights on, 1 night off, for 5 times (8 nights in 15 days)
After the eight night of treatment, get cultured at the health care place you go to. Before you go to get the culture, wash perineum and rectal area with soap and put on clean cotton underwear. GBS usually lives in your large intestine, and from there contaminates the vagina. A Rectal/Vaginal culture is done with a cotton swab inserted into the vagina and then into the anus.

When women are treated with antibiotics, the GBS returns soon after antibiotics regime is finished. The same is probably true with garlic. Therefore, if you culture positive and then use garlic to get a negative culture, you might consider inserting garlic once a week until you deliver the baby.

The level of garlic "smell" is a very poor indication of the real amount of allicin (active ingredient) that is generated. The olfactory receptors of the average person are so sensitive that even 1 mg of allicin molecules in the air will saturate the receptors so our nose and seem the same as 100 mg.

Allicin is gradually produced in the crushed clove for about 2 hours after the clove is damaged and simultaneously degraded. Once in contact with the mucosa or bacteria it degrades rapidly. No one knows how long it can be active when in contact with mucosa. We know that if you drink pure allicin within 5 minutes you can not detect it anymore because it all got adsorbed through the mucosal lining.

Bacteria are about 30 times more sensitive to allicin than human cells but at high concentrations also human cells suffer so in conclusion it would be more effective as an antibacterial and less toxic to the mucosa if women would use smaller amounts of crushed garlic with more frequent changes.

If you decide to try this protocol, please email me with as much information as possible: [email protected] and put GBS in the subject line:

1. History of GBS on previous pregnancy or is this your first pregnancy?

1. Garlic treatment = _ nights? Half clove? Full clove?

1. Date of culture- was it urine culture? recto-vaginal swab? Vaginal culture?

1. Results of culture after garlic treatment.

1. Please describe any adverse/untoward events

I will publish the results as soon as I have the results of 300 women who have used the protocol. No personal identification information would be kept ? your information will be combined with others and hopefully published in tabulated form in a medical journal, so that future patients would benefit from your efforts.

Read more:

www.cdc.gov/mmwr/PDF/RR/RR5111.pdf

http:

References:

1. Prevention of fumonisin-induced maternal and developmental toxicity in rats by certain plant extracts. J Appl Toxicol Nov-Dec 2004;24(6):469-74.

1. Emergence of Long-Term Memory for Conditioned Aversion in the Rat Fetus. Dev Psychobio 2004; 44: 189?198.

1. Protective effects of garlic juice against embryotoxicity of methylmercuric chloride administered to pregnant Fischer 344 rats. Yonsei Med J. 1999;40(5):483-9.

1. The effect of garlic on plasma lipids and platelets in primips with high risk of preeclampsia. Eur J Obstet Gynecol Reprod Biol. 2001 Dec 1;99(2):201-6.

PS. In case you were wondering: Garlic ingestion by pregnant women alters the odor of amniotic fluid. Chem Senses. 1995 Apr;20(2):207-9."

Hi

I can only echo what the previous posters have said about taking Group Strep B very seriously.

I knew I had Group Strep B after a vaginal swab in my first pregnancy, I received IV antibiotics (4 hourly which took about 20mins to administer) and DD was born healthy.
I didn't have a test in my second pregnancy, but I knew I would have the IV antibiotics again (I was happy for this) however DS ended up being a crash section so in theory he shouldn't have come into contact with the Group Strep B but he came down with septacemia within 48 hours of birth. As we had just come home from hospital he was readmitted for immediate treatment. His symptoms were similar to MillieO's little one, not feeding, low blood sugar, temperature, grey in colour, blue lips, grunting noises, fast breathing, very unsettled. He had a lumbar puncture upon arrival to try and find out what infection he had and was then put on 3 really strong IV ABS that ran round the clock. Thankfully he recovered and we both came home 10 days later.
Interesting to read about little ones who went through similar experiences being ill in their first years, my DS is really prone to taking any infection really bad whilst DD shakes most things off and has never had ABs whereas poor DS (nearly 2) has had steroids for croup, countless ABs for chest infections, lots of conjunctivitis.

I also don't mean to panic anyone but please do take it very seriously.
Wishing you all very healthy and happy pregnancies and deliveries

Interesting about the conjunctivitis brightredballoon. I thought it was a normal part of life as a baby.
It wasn't until DS2 that I realised he never once had it.
Both DS1 and I had it loads it his first year.
Wonder if it's an immune system thing post AB's or infection.

Thank you for sharing. Really pleased your baby is well.

If Strep B has already enetered the aminiotic fluid via the membranes, C-section doesn't reduce the risk of baby being infected. In my case, the autopsy found that my daughter's cord was swollen which suggests hr body was responding to the infection whilst she was still in my tummy shortly before delivery.

the garlic thing is interesting but i suspect it would not go down well with my GP if i presented myself for a re-swab on the basis that someone on the internet had told me to stick garlic up my bits.

i was positive in first labour and being treated "as if" this time - they don't re-test. i've checked and the birthing centre will still let you in if you need antibiotics (although i haven't got OP's issues with quick delivery - if only! - or allergies).

i don't know if anyone has mentioned this but one thing i am going to do this time is start on probiotics a few weeks before delivery - me and baby both had thrush (me nipple, him bum) which could have been related to the antis.

I had an emcs with DD and a few days after told the MW that I was a bit itchy down below and was treated for thrush, I was given antib's after the cs anyway so thought thrush was just a reaction to that. I had absolutely no relief from the itching and in the end the MW swabbed me and it came back positive for Group B strep. I was obviously concerned as I had read about it in pregnancy and knew it could be fatal in newborns. DD seemed fine but at a few weeks old developed some spots which as a precautionary measure was treated with antib's. The HV picked it up - I thought it was just milk spots
anyway that resulted in her getting oral thrush and me getting thrush in the boobies so we then needed treated for that.
I feel lucky that DD didn't have any serious side effects and like Manda says my notes are plastered with Group B Strep so I won't be swabbed but will be treated as if I do have it with my current pregnancy.
The NHS seem reluctant to test routinely as it comes and goes and just cos you were + at 30 weeks doesn't mean you will be + at delivery. My MW said it was possible that I only became + after delivery. I guess we will never know.
I have to say I didn't find the GBSS website very helpful I was keen to find out if DD had come into contact even though she had been born via emcs - and I found the information hard to find. I got fully dialated and the mw could see DD's head but she got stuck so then had to come back out the sunroof.
I think it is really good to raise awareness though and Manda I think forewarned is forearmed although with your track record of fast deliveries I'm not sure they will get much antib's into you. But at least you and baby will be closely monitored.
sh77 I'm so very sorry for your loss.

Bumping for user who started new thread today on strep b.

I took the private test before I had DS1 (even though my midwife told me it was a waste of time ). It came back positive so I had IV antibiotics during labour every four hours (as I was there a while!) However, the midwife who delivered the baby in the end missed the last set of ABs, even though I tried to point out that I needed them! These things gave me the impression that GBS is not taken very seriously round here (Warwickshire).

My midwife had not mentioned that I would need to stay in for 24 hours after the birth for the baby to be monitored and this was a bit of a shock when I was hoping for a speedy discharge, but the more stories I hear about babies who do get GBS, the more I realise how important it is (and will stay in happily this time round when DS2 arrives in February).

I have mentioned GBS to all my friends who have been pregnant since I had DS and, to my knowledge, none of them have been tested - I think they assume that because the test isn't offered routinely that it isn't really a risk - and yet we know differently on here. I never like to push my point too much, as I don't want to frighten pregnant ladies, but I am always amazed nonetheless.

Can anyone tell me whether they've had a waterbirth despite the ABs? Last time I was told at a monitoring session that it would be ok, but when I went in two days later in labour, was told that I couldn't use the birthing pool due to the canula. I will make more of a fuss this time if I find that others have used it, despite the canula.