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Talk about every stage of pregnancy, from early symptoms to preparing for birth.

can you have a vbac if breech?

8 replies

monkeydops · 22/11/2008 15:31

I'm 37 weeks pregnant with DC2. DS is now 2 and was born by emergency cesarean after a failure to progress following induction. I was really hoping for a vbac this time round but am currently breech. I have been using moxibustion (form of acupuncture) for 8 days and have been told that the hospital won't try and turn the baby using ecv cos of the previous cs and that if baby doesn't turn by 39 weeks I'll be looking at elec cs. Any thoughts? experiences?

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Tangle · 22/11/2008 18:35

I've no direct experience of a breech VBAC, but DD was a (planned) home breech birth.

If you can, try and get hold of "Breech Birth" by Benna Waites and/or "Breech Birth: What are my options" by Jane Evans. And google Mary Cronk.

The Benna Waites book has a whole chapter on gentle ways to encourage your baby to turn - including moxibustion, hypnotherapy, the Webster Technique (chiro), plus variations on a theme of "position the mother" (lie head down - such as on an ironing board propped aganst the sofa, crawling around the floor, handstands in a swimming pool, crawling down the stairs - make sure DH is supporting your shoulders!) and "attract the baby" (sit in a warm bath with frozen peas on top of bump, have attractive sounds where you want the head - music or daddy talking, shine light where you want the head).

If you want to look into vaginal breech birth, make sure you are crystal clear on what you are talking about - there is a world of difference between a hands-off vaginal breech birth (as practised by Mary Cronk) and a medicalised vaginal breech delivery, although the terms are sometimes used interchangeably. This article by Mary Cronk details the differences quite nicely (there's a table towards the bottom).

I didn't find the registrar I talked to for the "so your baby's breech" chat to be very well informed regarding vaginal breech birth (in other words I was told ECV or CS, vaginal delivery if you really must) - which isn't too suprising as she'd probably never even heard of one happening in the hospital. If you want to persue that course you'll probably need to talk to the midwifery department direct (50% of breech babies are undiagnosed so they must deliver some, whatever hospital policy says). Or consider using IMs, which is what I did in the end - even if you're not sure that's the right course of action for you, talking to an IM may help you come to a decision (and most of them won't mind talking through options in the least).

If you don't want to try for a vaginal breech birth, you could discuss leaving the CS until you're in labour - that way your DC has the maximum time to turn (and as a 2nd baby where the previous one was cephalic they are very likely to turn). There are pros and cons, but it is an option you could consider.

Fingers crossed your LO turns, and good luck making a decision. There is no right or wrong way to bring a breech baby into the world - just ways that feel better or worse to you.

ButterflyBessie · 22/11/2008 18:43

go onto the ukvbachbac yahoo chat group, they have loads of advice and links.

You can have one BUT no doubt you will have a fight on your hands

good luck

Tangle · 22/11/2008 18:57

Also meant to say that I haven't come across anything that says a VBAC is more risky if the baby is breech, or that a breech birth is more risky if its a VBAC. That said, one of the biggest problems I found is that there doesn't seem to be any research into the risks of vaginal breech birth at all.

Best bet on how to investigate the breech/VBAC combination is to talk to a midwife experienced in vaginal breech birth and VBACs - and from my experience you'll be more likley to find that in the independent sector. Look www.independentmidwives.org.uk/ to find an IM near you.

squeakypop · 22/11/2008 19:01

FTP is always a bit worrying. Have you had the reasons investigated, eg the dimensions of your birth canal? You really wouldn't want to risk breech if you were too small.

As for a birth - both VBAC and breech call for zero intervention.

Tangle · 22/11/2008 19:29

If you have MWs experienced with the Mary Cronk model of breech birth, failure to progress would be taken as an indication that a CS is a sensible way forward. You would not induce or augment a breech. Breech labours that are spontaneous and naturally progressive (for normaly developed, term babies) have never been known to result in a baby with its head stuck (according to my MW, who is very experienced in breech birth).

squeakypop · 22/11/2008 19:42

I agree, Tangle.

My last baby was breech, which I kept secret from my HCPs (otherwise automatic C-section). I was very mindful that FTP would indicate c-section and would have been very happy to come clean. As it happened, DD's labour progressed well and all was fine. My MW knew that I wanted as little intervention as possible so she sat some distance away while I laboured (Mary Cronk would have been proud).

If I had been in any doubt at all, I would have asked for an immediate C. I don't believe in the intermediate options.

I had my baby around the time of the Term Breech Study.

treedelivery · 23/11/2008 16:52

I'd try your consultant [via secretery] to see about EVC despite your prev cs.

If your own consultant doesn't do them maybe ask to meet with the one that does. I've known our hospital attempt them - with caution.

Wonder how far you got in your 1st labour? maybe that bubs was a tight fit hence need to induce and finally cs. Maybe this one is too so it's stuck it's bum in as head a squeeze? Just a though to go along with squeakypop's failure to progress point.

Or maybe it's all just blooming chance and this one will delivery just fine as a breech.

monkeydops · 24/11/2008 08:27

thanks for all your top tips and the the details of Mary Cronk - I'll look into it all./ Seeing MW today to discuss options.....

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