Wrong diagnosis of no heartbeat

[SarahBee]

Hi all,

Has anyone else out there experienced what I've just been through? Expecting my first and haven't been sure of dates as I was on hormone treatment for endometriosis and not back to proper cycles when I got pregnant. I excitedly turned up for my first scan last week (12 week, at Harris Birthright Centre, Kings) and after the apparently obligatory 3+hour wait there, was told they couldn't find a heartbeat, the "mass of foetal tissue" wasn't normally developed and so they were pretty certain the pregnancy hadn't been successful. After listening to their advice not to wait for a second scan in a week but have a d&c asap, asking loads of questions and telling them AGAIN I wasn't sure of dates, they called a specialist from the early pregnancy unit who confirmed that I was 8 weeks not 12 and got a heartbeat within seconds of walking in the door. I was so relieved at the time, I accepted their spoken apologies - just wanting to get home. Now I'm really angry and emotional. Has anyone else had this? Does anyone know how units record/
monitor when it happens? I'd heard brilliant things about the centre and now I'm really not sure whether I can face walking back in in 4 weeks for a second attempt at the nuchal. Thanks,

just goes to show that even if you go to the 'top' place people can get it wrong. Most places have an obligation to train staff so you may have ended up with someone's opinion who hadn't seen enough of the whole range of how different embryos look at each stage..it also sounds like that they may not have had a lot of communications training too
I'd call about your nuchal and tell them what happened..they can put you on the list of a v experienced person & hopefully treat you with kid gloves. the waiting time sound unacceptable too, I've never had to wait longer than 30 mins more than my appointment time.

SarahBee, is King's your local maternity hospital? Is there another hospital you could ask to be referred to?
I won't go into the details here as it is not relevant to your very upsetting experience, but I too found some Harris Birthright Centre staff SERIOUSLY lacking in human kindness earlier this year. It's all very well being a centre of excellence and having a charismatic top person, but from what I went through it seems that some visiting doctors at this centre are so keen to study under Professor Nicolaides and get the placement on their CV, that they forget it is real-life patients' well-being at stake. That unit could do with a few midwives as well.
Let's just say that it is now on my hospital maternity notes that if I ever succeed in getting pregnant again I have asked to receive none of my treatment at King's unless it is medically essential for the health of my child. Even though I could have my nuchal scan in world-famous SE5 instead of humble old SE18 I would really rather not, frankly.
There are many other hospitals in London offering the nuchal scan and you are at liberty to ask your GP to refer you elsewhere - and tell them why. My local consultant was interested to hear my feedback regarding how we were treated at King's, too.
Just wanted to let you know that there are other people out there who find all the media coverage of the wonderful, caring, HBC extremely distressing. There is another side to every success story.
Can't help you with the recording thing other suggesting you write to Professor Nicolaides giving details of the conversations you had with the doctors (especially anyone who suggested an immediate d & c) and copy the letter to your GP and/or your referring doctor.
Best of luck with your pregnancy and so sorry to hear about what you've been through.

Hi Sarahbee
I had a similar experience. I conceived prior to commencing hormone treatment for endo but because I was unsure of my dates they did an internal scan and through measurements told me I was 8 weeks pregnant. Had lots more scans all the way my pregnancy - mainly as reassurance. Gave birth to a wonderful dd. Other than transferring to another hosp. I wouldn't worry too much about the nuchal because they've got more accurate details now(easier said than done, I know). Obviously Marina's got 1st hand exp of HBC, but I think most hospitals have their fair share of neg experiences (but also many positives)

Thanks for the messages - took Marina's advice and went to see my GP this morning who was supportive and reassuring but says King's is my only option for Nuchal. I'm using my local hospital which I don't really want to change, but they share King's facilities for Nuchal rather than having their own unit. Guess I'll ring them and make sure I get a different person next time. Anyone know of any safe natural valium to keep me sane during the wait....? I feel better just talking about it, so I'm glad I stumbled across this site. Thanks and best wishes all, will let you know if second visit shows any improvement!

I'm so sorry you had such an awful experience. I had my nuchal scan at Kings and my scanner was lovely, very kind, humorous and very reassuring (persuaded me not to go for more invasive tests etc). I think it very much depends on the person. My nuchal wasn't in Harris, but in the normal antenatal part of the hospital, as it is a pretty routine scan at Kings. Hope it goes well. I would definitely complain about your treatment, but maybe your next scan will be quite different.

If you can, ask for the first appointment of the day as you won't have the long wait. The delays are, apparently, often caused by emergency cases taking priority.

I have had 2 nuchal scans at the HBC and both times the scanners were excellent. I would hope that there are more good stories than bad and that you were just "unlucky". Don't worry about your next scan.

I agree you should write to them and complain - it is only by being told thesse things that they can improve. The particular member of staff who saw you can then be trained better to ensure it doesn';t happen again.

Rescue Remedy! And good luck - I realised after my rant about HBC that King's has a large, "routine" antenatal department so hopefully the environment will be better next time, and the wait less lengthy.

Hi Sarahbee

I too had my nuchal at Kings but not Harris Birthright but did go on to have a CVS at HBC and found all the staff very kind/supportive and were very thorough. I am now expecting my second and due for a nuchal next week and I suspect I will follow up with a CVS at HBC I hope my experience is a good one and only wish you had been treated with more support and kindness. I think writing to the Professor is a very good idea. Take care and good luck.

SarahBee-its reputably the best in the country. Or at least Prof Nikoleides is. He's the big boss. There certainly arent better ones in the area. You could perhaps ask for a referral to Guys Hospital if dont want to go back.
Were you seen downstairs in the ante natal area or on the 9th floor? If it was teh 9th, their usual policy is that you are seen by a junior consultant first, followed up by the senior consultant, to either confirm the firsts findings or catch something that the first may have missed due to inexperience. They nearly always have "students" but these are usually senior registrars or above in level.
Perhaps the ultrasound used wasnt set to "find" such a tiny baby as they thought you were 12weeks already, something like a thumb nail compared to a whole thumb in size difference I think.
My advise would be to ask to see only the most senior staff based on your past experience. The letter head should give the top consultants names, and you can ask for them specifically on booking your appt.
Good luck, hope that your next experience is better if you do decide to go back. They really are the top dogs in their field.

Wow, I managed to get through the four weeks till the follow up scan yesterday, I had written to Kings but got no reply, so I was quite stressed wondering if I'd end up with the same people again. But when I got there it was fine (30 min wait, I recommend 9am Wed appointments if you can get them!) and the doctor from the specialist unit who came and rescued me last time had been asked to come back so I had some continuity and she was fab. Totally reassuring, went through all organs in detail, such a fascinating commentary. I am glad I went back to them, because I can now believe I was just unfortunate the first time. All good and healthy and I'm just blown away by how exciting it is seeing it move on that screen. I feel like a huge weight has just melted away from me and now I can relax and enjoy it and look forward to the future again.

I'm glad everything went really well with your scan and hopefully you can now relax and enjoy the rest of your pregnancy.

Hi SarahBee

Glad to hear everything was OK. I had my scan/CVS done at Kings a couple of weeks ago only to discover the total change of building so didnt know of the new set up where HBC is right next to main scanning dept. Everything was fine for me too.

I am very happy to hear you OK and I look forward now to my next scan at 22 weeks I think!!

So pleased everything was fine when you went back, SarahBee!

Hello my dears, my question is in my case, i.have an.mopie forte, i can.see, i have -8 at.both of my eyes, i need to have an CS ?is possible to have it in.Eangland?