Manager has referred me to OH for pregnancy sickness but I haven't even took one day off

[gracem24]

I work for the NHS. I've been suffering terribly with all day pregnancy nausea and vomiting, it's incredibly debilitating. It ramped up massively when I hit 9 weeks and being in the office was horrible. I am around 10.5 weeks now and haven't took a single day off during my pregnancy, but I did ask my manager if I could WFH last week which was agreed. I usually only do one WFH day out of the 4 days I work but there is nothing I do in the office that I can't do at home, and am actually more productive at home where I'm comfortable at the moment. I seen my GP on Friday about this to discuss meds and was given a fit note that recommends me to WFH for the next 2 weeks, I didn't want to come back to absolutely stacks of work and the stress of that which is always what happens when I'm on a/l. I let my manager know and she said she is referring me to occ health and that she cannot support me WFH for the rest of my pregnancy (I didn't ask for this but this is just what she said) but I can WFH this week and until I hear from occ health.

This is the first time I've ever even had a note from the GP and first time being referred to occ health. I can't understand why as I haven't even been off sick? I've still been working everyday. GP was happy to sign me off completely for a few weeks and I wish I had of just done this now. I really can't see why I'm being referred to occ health has anyone had any experience of this and know if its normal to be referred when you haven't even been off sick? Maybe it's my hormones but I'm quite annoyed by it. There is no way at all I will be struggling on into the office feeling the way I do now in 2 weeks if I still feel the same, which I feel is what they are trying to get me to do because of the referral, I struggled on through my first pregnancy into the office everyday through it and never had any medication or a day off and I'm not doing it this time.

I feel for you OP as I'm in the same boat with working and HG. Definitely take the rest and the medication though (this is my third time). It sounds like your work are trying to find a way they can best support you through this time of sickness. They are not allowed to penalise you due to pregnancy sickness so try not to worry. It might be worth asking if they can do this appointment over the phone or email.

It sounds like they are trying to help you, by working out with the support of occupational health how to make adjustments to enable you to do your job.

In your own words, it’s ’debilitating’, but you need to be agreement with your employer about WFH for the next six months. You cannot just decide that is what is going to happen.

If they are not willing to accommodate WFH and you are not well enough to work, might the best option to be signed off for a few weeks and hope the sickness improves?

You have asked for accommodations to help cope with an illness during your pregnancy. Your manager isn’t comfortable with the WFH accommodation so has referred you to occupational health to see if there is a way of making it easier for you to be in the office.

The fit note may only be for two weeks, but your manager knows well enough that the note can be renewed every two weeks.

My experience of occupational health is that they are there to support you and see what arrangements are needed for you to be able to do your job. On previous jobs they have helped me when I've had a back injury that made office work difficult. They aren't there to get you in trouble and you don't have to have been off sick for them to be consulted.

You might find that with occ health support she is able to accommodate you working from home for longer/be more supportive - they have to follow OH recommendations to quite a significant extent. If you don’t engage and they don’t have recommendations to follow from occ health they won’t be able to modify anything though.

As others have said, I’d take this as a good thing.
Any pregnancy related sickness won’t be counted against you. Your manager may be coming under pressure to be seen to be doing something to support you.
Worst case scenario OH say you should WFH more. Not a bad thing considering.

I work in an office and had a meeting with occupational health, as part of the standard process for pregnant employees. I was about 18 weeks pregnant, but hadn't needed any adjustment to working patterns or arrangements. For me, it focused on whether I needed anything additional or different to do my job normally and the lady actively encouraged me to ask to work different hours / remotely if it became necessary.

Someone else might have a bit of experience about NHS occupational health appointments - but mine was fine, definitely no sense of being "told off"

I think there are 2 issues here:
1- Your GP had recommended that you WFH for a fortnight. Is your line manager accepting of that?

2- Your line manager has referred you to Oc Health. OH role is to support you to do your job. Your line manager is helping you in seeking that support. You may feel
That there's nothing you do in the office differently to wfh, but your LM may see it differently. Supporting staff, passing on tacit knowledge etc are "unseen" and difficult to manage remotely. I sat this as someone who had 8 weeks with hyperemisis in each pregnancy, and is also a line manager!

If your sickness etc is unmanageable, and you do need time off, be aware that pregnancy related sickness must be recorded seperately and can not be used in any disciplinary action against you.

I just really don't see what occ health can do to help with all day vomitting and I'm so weak the the moment I have no energy, I need to save whatever I have for my toddler who I parent alone during the week outside of work hours due to my DP working away Monday - Friday. I'm just lying in bed all day working from there, if they said I couldn't wfh then my GP is happy to sign me off, because I simply don't see a way I can go into the office at the moment, but can occ health overrule this? They just need to take a look again my sickness records to see I'm not a piss taker and I'm never off sick.

I had a manager who seemed to find my severe pregnancy sickness very complicated to deal with. I ended up having to make up about 20 hours of flexi time and looking back with I had just got signed off when my GP offered since I couldn’t work normal hours/ days in the office. The normal sickness procedures don’t apply to pregnancy related illness so nothing would be triggered. Honestly just get signed off and stop trying to be superwoman.

Would a man go into work if he was feeling like death, vomiting, not eating normally?

No, occupational health cannot overrule you being signed off by the GP. I'd recommend meeting with them first though - you might find they are fully supportive and want to help you! Knowing you can get signed off if there isn't a resolution.

I've just read the rest of the replies. The note states that if my employer can't support wfh then they must treat my note as an un fit to work note. It's good to hear occ health should be supportive, I really hope that's the case as I'm just worried they're going to try and force me into the office which I just can't face doing at the moment and would rather be signed off altogether.

@gracem24 can you get any additional support at home?

It must be very difficult with your partner being away Mon-Fri while you are so ill. Can they WFH?

I found being pregnant and working for the NHS the worst experience. My line manager and matron were completely unaccommodating and seemed to be very angry that I was pregnant and vomiting throughout the day, every shift.

I came to realise that they didn’t care about me as a person, they just wanted to get as much work out of me as possible and were therefore annoyed that I was being less productive due to severe nausea and vomiting.

In the end I had to be signed off sick (again, they were very angry about this and tried to get me to come back to work constantly), until eventually i had to go through my union. They stepped in and it was eventually enforced that I could work in an office environment (instead of a ward) for the rest of my pregnancy. For context, I had never been off sick before being pregnant, was very hard working and respected in my team.

I never went back to the NHS. For an institution that is all about caring for others, it often struggles to care for its own employees.

Don’t let them force you into working in an environment that puts your health at risk. You and the baby are more important.

As someone who has referred to OH and also been referred to OH, your manager is doing this to support you and try to keep you in work. It is very easy to see it as a punishment, but it isn't- it's to support you and help make accommodations and adjustments.

OH are a neutral party here, and will be able to listen to you and make recommendations to help you. It can be an arse-covering exercise, but, if you cooperate and work with them, it can be helpful.

Please don't see this as a negative thing!

Note: I am not NHS, but similar institution with its own OH service..

It's ridiculous to think of this as something they've done to you because of your sickness record. It's obvious it's because you've gone in there with a fit note that makes recommendations they have a duty to meet. It's to help you.

I do have my parents who look after my little boy twice a week while I'm at work who are supportive. He is thankfully an angel most of the time and is straight asleep when I put him to bed at 7 every night which I'm super grateful for. My DP's work is construction so unfortunately not able to WFH, but he did take some time off from Wednesday until this morning last week so he could take over and when he is here from Friday afternoons onwards he couldn't be anymore supportive and I've never had to ask him to do anything.

Don't take it personally, they have your abs baby's best interest at heart x

Your manager is either genuinely concerned and wants to help or, they are peed off that you are to work from home for the next two weeks. Go to occupational health and just explain, as you have on here and all will be fine. They may well say you should not be working ideally ... say you will get a sick/fit note if they recommend it.

I've just re-read where my manager was emailing me regarding the occ health referral and wfh etc and she stated she was referring me to occ health and then stated she will need to seek advice from HR to establish any further adjustments required for me as she will be unable to support working from home for the remainder of the pregnancy. At the time I just assumed hr worked hand in hand with occ health but I'm wondering if that means even if occ health recommended wfh that she would need to go to hr as she couldn't support what occ health have said? Just looking at different scenarios. Can hr override what occ health say?

I would imagine she is just following guidelines. Ohs aren't there to overrule or anything, they are there to support both you and your manager. They arent out to get you.

Although if abutting like my trust you'll be waiting forever for an appointment anyway. I was referred for something different 10 weeks ago and my appointment is in 4 weeks time. I'm going back to work next week..

Yes I'm not sure if it would be a occ health nurse or doctor who i'd speak to but the wait for a occ health doctor is at least 5 weeks, in which time the sickness could of possibly eased off. If it's a nurse though I think the wait is around 2 weeks.

It's probably procedure because of needing adjustments.
If you need time off take the time off. I have recently had quite a bit of time off with pregnancy sickness and more WFH than my contract. In my office HR and my line manager see each return to work form and we're both supportive and encouraging of me to take more time off than I was taking. Work offered a distraction however so when I was able it was best to work. On days I wasn't able to work I checked messages once or twice a day in moments of reprieve and if there was anything that could be resolved quickly I did that and if not messaged to let them know I was on sick leave and would get back to them once I was back so that on days I could work I had a smaller pile for admin to deal with and could focus on the main role

My mum work for the NHS all her working life and found them to be very challenging with regards to sick leave. She was forced back to work early and disciplined for time off due to a work related back injury. It took her Union stepping in to get reasonable adjustments. Go into the appointment with an open mind but make sure you come out of it with a workable solution and if WFH isn't available and going into work isn't an option it will have to be sick leave. Push the gps for meds too, I probably put up with more than I should have done and ended up having to work from home after having a fall in the night due to being dizzy from not keeping enough food down and then not being able to weight bare on my right foot.

They can’t force into the office because your GP clearly wrote ‘if wfh can’t be accommodated, this is a not fit for work note’

So basically work either sees you off sick or accept you wfh. If I was your manager, I know which one I’d chose!

The OT is about trying to find away to make it possible for you to work in the office. They might not be able to propose any realistic accommodations

Manager here-
let me translate your manager’s email to you about OHA and HR referral.
It is completely reasonable for the manager to state if your current role cannot be fulfilled from home. That is your manager’s job to oversee your job and how it’s fulfilled.
If you are pregnant there are only few ways this can go-
A-They can make your duties lighter (take off some duties without reducing pay)
B-they can temporarily put you into a different role, let’s say if occupational health adviser does come back the company should be seeking ways to accommodate working from home.
C-if they can’t provide any of the above, they have to put you on paid garden leave for an X amount of time and review, possibly it would involve another OHA meeting afterwards.

I don’t think your manager is looking to penalise you or to get rid of you, it’s just that the manager has been up front about the fact that they would like to go the correct procedure of finding out what’s best for you and they are seeking professional input for a solution to be achieved.

HR is necessary here because your manager likely is aware of the options outlined above and putting any of that in place will require some input from HR. Because your manager, with HR would have to either reduce your duties and find someone else for this and then liaise with this prospective person to take on additional duties for a certain time, or the HR would have to highlight possible jobs in other departments that you could take on as per OHA advice …or arrange for a garden leave and issue relevant paperwork for that.
You have to understand that working from home cannot be just requested like that. You cannot demand it if it’s not fit for the role. The role might need to change.