Paid time off to attend antenatal classes

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I'm looking at antenatal classes and I understand that I can take paid time off "if recommended by a doctor or midwife". But looking at people's experiences around me, it seems that many employers don't ask for proof of recommendation (for classes, not medical appointments), within reason. So I wanted to ask about recent experiences. I'm sure it's employer dependent but did you have to ask your midwife for a note for your employer or was your employer happy to approve paid time off for antenatal classes easily? Thanks

As an employer I wouldn’t be happy and would think they’re taking the mick! Go in your own time like most people do.

No, it's intended for medical appointments. Not NCT or the NHS classes they offer on how to change a nappy, bath a baby etc.

I mean, have you checked your maternity policy? If it's allowed in there, then your opinion doesn't matter one jot.

OP- My work policy (local gov) has the same clause, I never took them up on it, but I would probably go to some breastfeeding cafes antenatally if I got the opportunity again- think it would be very easy to get a midwife to recommend that

I mean you're about to have a lot of time off. I'd want to leave on a good note, not having taken the mick

I’ve not got to that stage of pregnancy yet, so haven’t used it, but my work policy says you can have paid time off for appointments and antenatal classes.

Maybe reach out to your HR team and ask?

I think the attitude / response depends on the company, I know for a fact my current manager would encourage me to take whatever I’m entitled to and wouldn’t worry about me being off for a few more hours. But my previous company would have laughed at the fact I even asked.

From ACAS

to be recommended I’d say they have to be something beyond NCT or standard NHS that are available any time - but also depends on your usual hours and what’s available in your area! if your hospital only does 9-5 classes then maybe you need the time off

eg I was referred for prenatal anxiety CBT and my workplace gave me the time paid to attend. I would also say, in similar, if you were socially prescribed yoga or relaxation or a parenting class to support a first time parent then that should be acceptable.

Just because others don’t do it doesn’t mean you can’t - it’s nothing to do with ‘leaving on good terms’. If your employer can’t follow the law you’re not on good terms already and need to be careful while on maternity leave

It's very unusual for classes to be in the day? Or do you work antisocial hours? They're usually in the evening?

My employer was happy to give me the time.

I was invited to 2 NHS sessions which were both in the daytime. One was an hour on breastfeeding and the other was 2 hours more general about birth options, taking baby home, safety, sleeping etc.

My employer was fine with me taking time out to go to them.

My employer allows this time off with no proof. They trust the adult workers they employ not to take the piss.

The classes I have found have all been outside my working hours so far, but I have comfort in knowing I could go to one if I needed to during my working day and not be questioned.

I'm a teacher and attended the two NHS courses in school time. I think I just said I had an antenatal appointment and they didn't ever want proof of anything. I agree, I think it depends on the type of employer you have. I totally disagree with the people saying you'd be taking the mick, the NHS courses are free and NCT is upwards of £200 now. I don't think it's unreasonable to take 4 hours or whatever it is to feel a bit more prepared.

I work in HR.

Legally, employees have the right to ‘reasonable’ paid time off for maternity appointments and antenatal classes. There is no legal definition of what counts as antenatal care, so it can cover just about anything pregnancy related.

I will repeat this for those at the back (or the ones who want to ignore it and hope it goes away):

Pregnant women in England have the legal right to paid, in working hours, time off to attend medical appointments, scans, NCT classes, pregnancy yoga, relaxation, meditation, parent craft, breastfeeding, kegels, visits to the birthing suites, the list really goes on and on - basically ANYTHING recommended by their GP, midwife, etc PLUS the travel time. Employers who refuse requests could very well find themselves defending their refusal at a tribunal, so they had better be sure they have a rock solid reason for refusing. If your employer unreasonably refuses to allow you to take time off for antenatal care or refuses to pay for all or part of your time off you can bring a claim for loss of pay in an employment tribunal under section 57 (section 57ZC for agency workers) of the Employment Rights Act 1996.

It doesn’t matter if you are an employer and you aren’t happy about it . It doesn’t matter what it says in the company maternity policy. The law takes precedence. No you can’t make them ‘go on their own time’ (and if you ask them to then you are probably breaking the law). Employers are also not allowed to request the time is made up.

Have a look at ACAS and maternity action for more information about requesting time off for appointments.

All of my antenatal appointments were during the day and I was able to go to these during work time, I just had to tell my manager when they were and it was no issue. Hypnobirthing, breastfeeding and antenatal classes I booked for the evening so it wasn't during work time. I generally tried to work things so I was taking as little time off as possible even though my employer is super flexible. Plus going in the evenings meant that dh was able to attend as well.

What are kegels?

@DragonFly98 Pelvic floor exercises.

I’ve given a list of actual antenatal appointments we’ve approved.

Thanks I couldn't work out what it meant.

As an employer, I would take a pretty dim view if I had given PTO for what I'd assumed was a necessary medical appointment, to find out it was voluntary classes- given most trusts will run these out of office hours. If you ask and they approve, fair play- but I wouldn't put these in the same category as necessary

@SD1978 It’s not really up to you to decide what’s necessary.

@DragonFly98 Yeah I had to google it when the request came in!

@Littlegoth - hence it's an opinion. Like most people have given one way or the other. If OP is entitled to attend these during business hours, and be paid- then I would assume transparency- her telling them that this is why and that according to ACAS she is legally entitled if there is any question, makes things easiest for them.

You have to be allowed the time off the difficult thing is is there a reducstion in workload? My last 6 weeks before maternity leave I lost about a day a week of working hours but still had to do the same amount of stuff so I was utterly exhausted

I've managed pregnant women and I wasn't required by policy to obtain any proof of antenatal appointments.

@SD1978 I think your post highlighted one reason why pregnant women have problems in the work place. Very often there’s a disconnect between an employer’s personal opinions vs medical opinion and what is allowed under employment llaw. A manager or employer might think something like NCT, kegels or pregnancy yoga are voluntary fripperies where a doctor may see them as essential medical appointments. That’s why managers don’t get to decide what is voluntary, they just need to comply with the law and keep their private opinions to themselves (which they obviously don’t or there wouldn’t be so many help pages are organisations based around protecting women’s rights during air after maternity).

Pregnancy yoga might be the difference between an employee being able to sit at a desk or being signed off due to SPD.

Kegels sessions were rubbished off by one manager as apparently incontinence is something women just have to put up with after childbirth, when actually it fell under physiotherapy.

I didn’t bother with NCT classes personally, but I can see how they might be useful as most women don’t automatically know how to look after babies, or how to breathe or sit in labour without being taught these things. One place I worked allowed women to claim up to £200 toward the cost of NCT classes because it recognised the importance of NCT in preparing their staff for childbirth and parenthood from a wellbeing perspective. Even people who argue that the only thing they got from NCT was a social group - there’s nothing wrong with that either as having a young baby can be very isolating.

Edit
*long post and speaking from the biased viewpoint of having just been through a difficult pregnancy which was made a lot easier by having supportive managers, and also from working at a previous organisation in a mainly male environment where too many managers thought their personal opinions trumped employment law and the equality act.

Thanks everyone! Your responses are really helpful!

Legally you are entitled. Personally, I'd have felt like I was taking the piss. Remember you have to go back to this place after maternity leave, don't make it difficult for yourself.

In my experience work get upset enough about all the additional appointments (I had some hospital appointment pretty much every week after 20 weeks). In the end I had to show appointments but appreciate after the 3rd diabetes test it might have sounded like I was taking the pee!

it was also hard enough to get bank holidays and other contractural benefits allocated to me but that’s maybe another story.